Oh I meant that the eventhubs list is not something different from what’s already out there.
There’s some discussion about people’s matchup opinions here, and somewhere in there I posted the Japanese wiki listings:
http://shoryuken.com/f260/dictator-matchup-score-chart-241981/
But this thread is just as appropriate.
Maybe the tier list is an indication that we’re doing it all wrong, guys.
That tier list is so wrong it hurts
Honestly I think chun is almost even but cammy ryu abel sagat akuma fei are all 5 instead of 6 .Actually based on experience the fei match up is slightly in fei’s favor now because unless you can react and poke chicken wing your in a world of hurt but I dont think it’s bad enough to be a 4-6. It almost like they admitted guile is a 7-3 and decided to give 6’s for lol’s.Viper’s improvements don’t really affect the bison match up so I say it’s 7-3 and seth to me is still 6-4 bison.Because our u2 helps more than his in this match up alot more. So to me he is the same score as rog maybe a spot lower above cammy.
Would be cool if this is accurate, only because all top 3 chars could be counterpicked, unlike Vanillas “beat all” Sagat/Ryu ect.
Everyone can be counter picked in this game. Nobody cares about vanilla now. It’s Super.
Bison’s good. All the matches he has an advantage adds up and puts him on a high average all over all the lists.
hey guys, i finally got back into sf. after reading the first page, there are a few questions i’ve had that weren’t answered there. i have 2 qs:
usually on wakeup vs ryu/akuma, i do an ambiguous frontal/cross up j.hp, so they can’t really srk spam me even though i’m jumping in. this works on ryu, but on akuma, he always teleports away. i was thinking of doing option select slide, but the one night i tried it i didn’t actually hit him out of his teleport, i just landed right next to him - i’m not sure if i can punish in that situation. any ideas? also i was considering option select U2.
one thing not discussed on the front page is neutral jumping to get over fireballs. so i’ve been doing that to get over my friend’s ryu/akuma fireballs at long-mid range, at close/close-mid range i stop because otherwise i’ll eat SRK. he knows not to throw a hadoken at close range because of course i’m charging for ex scissors. my question is do you guys even really bother to do neutral jumping at mid range if they know not to hadoken, b/c it seems like i’m just surrendering myself to the air while they can move to get better positioning.
I need to test this more thoroughly, but yea, safejump j.fierce OS slide is the way to go on Akuma’s wakeup. You’re right, you do only land beside him, but I’m fairly sure you’ve got a couple free c.shorts on him afterwards (not all that great considering you prolly won’t have enough charge for c.shorts -> scissors). That said, I’m thinking there’s a good chance you can do the s.short -> s.rh link. On another note, sometimes you and Akuma end up travelling in opposite directions when you use this OS – I think it has something to do with the direction of Akuma’s teleport.
More testing required, for sure.
if you are doing a slide, you should have more than enough time to do shortx3 scissors (or a better combo).
slide comes from the option select.
anyways, i also find it curious that i don’t find many tips on spacing when not rushing down, which is matchup dependent. for example, vs ryu, you’d probably wanna stay right outside of his c.mk range. at this range you can s.mk it, and if you smell a fireball, you can jump in combo for big damage. finally, at that range, you can bait jump ins with s.lk. if he jumps in, you can take a step back and your s.hk’s hitbox is at a better angle to antiair, you can also use c.hp but it takes practice.
should we help out create a list? because tony already put in a lot of work with the matchup thread.
edit: you can also think of tip slide/mksk/pc range as long range sweet spots as well in many matches.
I know. Doing the OS doesn’t require you to lose charge, and you will build more than enough charger during the jump+slide to combo into scissors or PC (you never need to leave downback to option select a slide).
EDIT: Good call on the ideal spacing list. Finding the ‘sweet spot’ in a matchup makes playing it much easier. It could be an addition to this thread, or a seperate one.
too much shit to type, I wanna add my own input, don’t wanna do an ask me thread like im the super shit or anything, but in my free time I wanna answer questions or have some people ask shit so I can test it out later
To whoever was posting about option selecting vs akumas wake up teleport, theres no such thing as an O/S slide. First, you’re at risk of wake up uppercut, second of all your slide won’t hit akuma if he just does a simple backdash(he can block in time). After you knock akuma down all your counters to wake up teleport are premeditated. I have most of my experience from playing vanilla in Japan, thus I don’t really use U2 vs akuma since im trying to do a 2 for 1 and get my sbo training on if I play an akuma on xbox live. But you prob can counter using U2 if you predict shit. A setup only I do vs wake up akuma back teleport, is after a scissor kick hits, dash forward, jump up forward, and when akuma teleports you can do a slide. This doesnt work versus forward teleport. but its a good guess counter.
like I mentioned before countering akuma’s teleport is mostly premeditated shit, not much to do with reactions(yes it sucks). After a throw, you can teleport behind him and jump forward or back to guess which place he will try to teleport and sweep also. and uhhh after throw you can jump forward to place yourself closer and maintain a charge, then either ex psycho his back teleport when he wakes up , walk back and punish his teleport that goes forward. like I said all premeditated stuff.
Maybe I should make an ask me something about bison thread…
BTW its kind of dumb that the sf4 and ssf4 character forums are merged in the ssf4 thread. The characters are actually a bit different. SONNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN
Do it!
you can OS psycho crusher too.
if you have charge, are next to akuma, you can do
cr. jab
st.close jab ~ forward + fierce
st.short
st. roundhouse
as a blockstring (open however). First jab must be as meaty as possible.
I’m not saying it’s practical or that I actually use it, but it exists and I talk more about it and its uses against various teleports and backdashes in the OS thread.
Lastly, I don’t know how safe fierce PC is on block against Akuma from point blank range, but if you manage to land a slide, you can always meaty EX or fierce PC. It is a guess instead of a reaction, but if he blocks you might be relatively safe. I think he might be able to Demon you though but I’m sure that someone more familiar with the matchup can chime in. Also, you can do an autocorrect psycho crusher and nightmare booster if you say have him cornered and he teleports out instead of back. Timing is very strict.
Like Kim1234 said we can throw u2 on teleport recovery. Also kind of random but if anyone is using that kara tech vs rufus you can also OS st.lp+st. lk+st.hk to me is better.So instead of reseting rufus you give fat bastard a big st.hk.
Interesting option select. but being efficient with your meter is important vs akuma.
Pros:
Cons:
Instead I would recommend the less advance tactic of going for either back off a bit and punish his recovery of the teleport with ex psycho. or on anticipation jump forward and then you can punish his back teleport. Good akumas get accustomed to this and start doing forward teleports or backdashes to avoid counters like this
its all about conditioning your opponent and knowing the counters to execute them
Interesting option select. but being efficient with your meter is important vs akuma.
Pros:
Cons:
Instead I would recommend the less advance tactic of going for either back off a bit and punish his recovery of the teleport with ex psycho. or on anticipation jump forward and then you can punish his back teleport. Good akumas get accustomed to this and start doing forward teleports or backdashes to avoid counters like this
its all about conditioning your opponent and knowing the counters to execute them
Its pretty easy to counter Akumas forward teleport in the corner with auto correct pc especially if you didnt go for a meaty (if you went for a throw hes out). If I’m just keeping akuma in the corner and waiting for him to do something dumb I almost always hit him.