I would say that at high level it’s probably 8-2. I dont think any matchup in 3S is 9-1. Too many mind games for any matchup to be total domination like that. Even bad matches like Q vs. Mak can play out in different ways depending on who is working the mind games.
Q vs. Mak is definitely one of the worst matches in the game. She can jump at him all day long and his high defense doesn’t save him from getting stunned. He’ll almost never get a chance to taunt any ways. Mak’s dash covers distance too quickly. C and DB you’ll almost never connect vs. her since she can jump around like an idiot. Not to mention a big part of her game revolves around trying to grab you with a better version of the C and DB.
I was reading that thread, and I think it’s trash. People can’t seem to post realistic shit anymore. 9-1? Please. Not even 8-2. What can Makoto do that’s so horribly unbeatable? Jumping all over the place? That’s his advice? Does he play anyone that can parry well? Wait let me guess, even if it’s parried, she magically escapes…no, not quite. Dashing in? Who can’t react to that? He thinks karakusa owns Q cause he can’t escape? Wtf is this shit advice? If you’re gonna say someone beats someone 9-1, have some reasons that make sense. You wanna know a 9-1 matchup? Cable vs Zangief in MVC2. You can superjump away from him ALL day long and shoot his ass. But Q vs Makoto 9-1? Retarded…show me vids of his bullshit in practice. There are none.
I wouldn’t say it’s 9-1 either but if there’s any match that comes close to it it’s defintely Q vs. Mak. Easily 8-2 just by brainstorming the match. The match is terrible. Most matches in 3S are usually a 1, 2 or 3 points in advantage for one character or the other. Very few matchups get worse than 3-7 in 3S. This is just one of those rare matchups where it’s evident that Q just has little options and can only win with the little options he has.
You really are a sitting duck waiting to get owned in this matchup. There’s really no way for Q to ensure that Mak will never get close to him. It’s going to happen every round at some point. It’s just is she going to get enough karakusa setups to win the round? It all depends on whether Q gets stunned or not and being able to taunt doesn’t help to reduce stun. If Q gets knocked down karakusa is almost free afterwards. Karakusa goes through just about everything he has. You can’t escape Makoto getting in unless you play the round perfectly. The best you can do is work your mind games well enough so that you end up coming out with a win and not getting stunned. She beats your ground game so you’re forced to jumping about as much as she is just to keep her away.
BTW Ultra Dave has experience playing against Eric Kim/Ramza who is basically the best Makoto player on the East Coast and probably the 2nd best Mak in the US (next to Sextaro himself). Justin Wong’s Chun Li is pretty much useless against Eric’s Mak at this point. Everytime they play now Justin’s Chun loses basically for free. Justin had to switch to Elena to give him the options he needed to beat Eric’s Mak at Final Round X (big console tournament in ATL a few months ago).
Err, I’m pretty sure there’s a convincing amount of 8-2 matchups. Even if they’re low v top tier, they’re still there. And there’s no real way to judge the amount of 7-3s that are in reality closer to 8-2s.
A game that is near perfect doesn’t really have a near useless character. A game that is near perfect allows everyone to be competitive at almost all levels of play. Yeah, Sean ‘can’ win. He can win if he’s completely better than his opponent, or his opponents’ controls stop working. That doesn’t say anything about him being used competitively in a place where it would matter.
You keep implying that I’ve said things like 3s is imbalanced or that it’s broken, which is completely untrue. All I’ve been doing is completely refuting your notion of 3s being near perfect [and apparently perfection would be achieved by giving Yun a longer bar, completely ignoring Chun li… right], which it is not.
He grabs Justin and then the round is over. It’s that free.
Well to be more descriptive about it (if you’re referring to Justin vs. Eric) it just comes down to the fact that Chun can poke but she can’t avoid the jump ins and karakusa quite so well (at least not as well as Elena). Chun Li can definitely win the match and one attack is all she needs to do big damage vs. Makoto. It’s just that Makoto can close the gap so quickly off of one whiffed poke and Chun’s whole game is based on staying on the ground which is really what Makoto wants. He uses SA1 Mak so that Justin has to be very careful about throwing random pokes. One bad attempt to throw a poke is half life easily.
True…on the lower tier of characters there probably are a fair share but IMO those match ups are almost negligible given that especially in the US those characters rarely get used in tourneys. In Japan it would make more sense to look at those matches but generally I would say there are more 7-3’s than 8-2’s in 3S.
You ever heard of joke characters? Dan is a joke, 3S Sean is a joke. It’s fun to have humiliation tactics. Every other character in 3S has serious users in high level areas that can do well vs top-tiers.
LOL. I wasn’t really aiming to be helpful seeing I already made it obvious that to me it’s almost magical the way he works Mak. It’s kinda one of those things where he just understands the matchup and the way Justin plays. Makoto is a very mind game oriented character any ways so a lot of it really can’t be explained in wording. YouTube Eric Kim vs. Justin at NEC if you want to get an idea of what happens in the match.
I’ve already said your points don’t even matter because I don’t give a shit about making Necro play like he is in 3rd Strike.
If you’re one of those idiots who think 3S is “perfect” except for Yun’s SA3 bar, then there’s no hope for you anyway, so don’t post in this topic if you love 3S as it is so much.
If that’s the case then don’t bother posting in a thread that doesn’t look for a complete revamp of the structure of characters, it merely seeks to make tweaks and adjustments.
So from that, I’d conclude that it’s YOU who is probably 12, that there is no hope for YOU, and that in general youre arguing like an utter retard.
Personally I think imbalanced games give me a different kind of incentive to play.
Yes a lot of games that are balanced are undeniably good.
Yes a lot of games that are balanced will usually see a more diverse kind of gameplay.
But deep down inside, I feel that “art imitates life” in the sense that the world is unfair. Advantages and disadvantages will always exist in varying degrees: and by picking higher tier it feels good to know that you are more advantaged against others.
Likewise people who play low tier and are able to win against high tier can feel even better about their own gameplay since they overcame the inherent tier obstacle.
Things like that don’t happen in balanced games. Example: If you are playing protoss and you win against somebody playing Zerg, you won’t feel you are better just because you beat zerg in addition to winning. (I’m not a starcraft pro, im just assuming its almost perfectly balanced.)
I mean look at marvel, it wouldn’t be marvel without the tier differences. Yet despite the tier differences people love it so much.
Just keep in mind that its always the players who make the differences in the end. Because the game itself is ultimately only one of the factors that make up the entirety of how its perceived and played.
Extra: typing this up just reminded me of a scene in Matrix where the Architect explains to Neo about a simulating a perfect world which people rejected and in the end could only persist in a world of inequality and suffering. - no particular connection; just a thought
