Next time link us to the stream! D:
You can also use Cl.HP as OS against Fei Long’s Shienkyaku/Chicken Wing
Just delay it a bit, as if you were trying to combo instead of OS.
Using with S.HK also works on Blanka’s EX Rainbow, but, in this case, there’s no pressure afterwards
[media=youtube]u2ta2E1xVd0&feature=channel_video_title[/media]
[media=youtube]DoI_t20Xyck&feature=channel_video_title[/media]
[media=youtube]8K3TON61bss&feature=channel_video_title[/media]
Good shit contributing to the thread but once again
Everyone keeps on punishing roundhouse or ex chicken wing . That shit is easy to punish using an OS.
But you guys are not punishing short chicken wing . The OS fierce will lose to it, and you will be down on damage because of it. Fei rules the ground because of his walk speed and rekkas that can’t be blocked on reaction
Fei will mix up SHORT chicken wing on his wake up if he’s smart. Yes you can only combo off roundhouse and ex chicken wing, but it’s just one if his many other wake ups that you can’t predict Everytime
Forward throw, walk forward, jump forward kick/fierce punch, OS stand roundhouse LOSES to uppercut. If you delay the OS roundhouse, you block the uppercut, but the roundhouse that comes out loses to short chicken wing
I’m no professor of explaining the technical mechanics of SF4, but clue me in on exactly what you’re doing .
The only way you can make a safe jump work to avoid everything is a point blank slide, hold up and do a safe jump roundhouse, OS stand roundhouse
All though these nifty OS’s are nice one time things to use if your opponent doesn’t know that got counters, they are not solutions to the most probable thing they will decide to do
AKA short chicken wing or uppercut
Isn’t short chicken wing punishable on block? If you think they will start countering with that after they see that they are being OS’d, couldn’t you bait them by blocking and punishing?
No it’s not punishable after you block it
Hey Kim,
Don’t mind me but I urge you to try the safe jump OS again because I had a friend who mains Bison test it out too and the results were the same as mine.
A little thing to note is that, using this OS, if Fei does any flame kick, you will block it standing, not crouching; if you got a crouching block it means your OS would have been a sweep and not a roundhouse.
If there’s anything tricky imo, it’s actually the timing for the safe jump.
Oh and…short chicken wing is -4 frames on block so it can be punished by crouching or standing short.
Edit: I’m basing the frame data on super so unless Capcom changed his short chicken wing frames in AE, there should be no discrepancies.
Cheers
Framedata is useful for that. Yeah…LK is punishable by a 3f plink Cr.LK into LK/MK/EX Scissors
As for OS against LK-HK CW, it IS possible, but requires good timing. Anyway, it’s riskier for Fei to try these stuff, not for Bison.
Ive never punished lk chicken wing but I won’t argue against frame data. But I do disagree that fei is taking more risks. If I can’t get the timing down for the OS roundhouse and I have an equal risk of doing less potential damage, no thanks
YOU FEEL ME
Btw I still don’t think OS roundhouse is better then forward throw, wall forward a little more , jump forward kick, OS low short
You can OS low strong and react to any chicken wing and slide on reaction
Only thing low strong doesn’t cover is fei’s wake up dash.
If you think he will wake up dash , then maybe not attacking in the air and hitting him once you land is a more rewarding punish
I think this is a more realistic and feasible setup,
How about everyone else?
I think the reason we Bisons rarely punish short chicken wings is simply because decent Feis would probably only use it in a hit confirm combo, if at all. There’s just so much more incentive to use the roundhouse or EX chicken wing in terms of momentum on block or hit.
And yeah, I agree that risk/reward is totally in Fei’s favour. I doubt anyone really needs to elaborate on this, just play a good Fei and all should be clear.
About the OS roundhouse on safe jump, for me that’s just a good tool to apply pressure on Fei since Fei has way too many options to get out of Bison’s pressure; I dare say Bison is actually the one being pressured in this matchup.
Pardon me repeating this but, I still find safe jumping Fei to be quite a task with Bison. I tried safe jumping using Rog and the difference is like day and night. I kinda hope I’m not the only one feeling that way.
I’ll try out your OS suggestion in the lab later Kim, thanks for the tip hehe.
Cheers
Even though my cell doesn’t work, my twitter,srk, and training mode are still functioning
I tested out the fei long jump setup. It was hard for me to do cause there wasn’t an easy way to do it. The best thing I came up with was after forward throwing fei…
- whiff low short(plink it to make it easier) as soon as you can
- hold up forward and do a jump in
If you mistimed the low short, you can react to your low short not coming out and choose not to attack in the air. If this happens as soon as you land , press focus and backdash. The worst thing that will happen is you will get hit in the air with a 3 hit chicken wing. Or you can just land after the jump and deal with being at negative frames
I tested some OS against Fei yesterday. Used point blank Slide as auto-safejump
Tried S.HK and Cr.MK
Cr.MK could get under CW
S.HK beat CW LK, HK, blocked Shien
My timing was simply tapping HK twice while holding back (Slide,NJ+HK+HK)
Punishing LK CW on block was easy too.
Lots of info gathered here…
Plus…I found something nice about Psycho Crossups. If you use it aiming Bison’s foot to hit the enemy, not only some reversals will whiff and be punishable (autocorrect Cannon Spike whiffs, Sumo Headbutt LP fails, Zonk Knuckle fails, Lariat PPP whiffs), but it messes some inputs.
Example: Depending on how fast a CW is input, it won’t come out unless the last direction is done “backwards” (D,DF,F,UB+K)
Sweet
I wasn’t aware that nj.HK after slide could be used as a safe-jump. Is this against 5 frame DP chars/reversals?
If so it does sound pretty damn useful vs a fair amount of the cast.
It’s against 4f
empty jump against 3f
slide must hit 1st active frame
I use j.mp->cr.hk as main setup
If you land sweep from a little further, your safe Jump timing is different
Jump strong into sweep will be difficult to land Everytime you need it. Plus all you get is the safe Jump roundhouse. Very predictable if you ask me. I’d rather juggle with stand fierce then choose cross up psycho or just wait a bit and do scissors
Yeah thanks Kim for the cr short safe jump setup. I’d say it’s a really good setup for me. I had a not-so-reliable version involving him doing a squat before jumping which works but requires really good sense of timing on my part.
Using the cr forward OS is interesting since like you said, punishing chicken wings with sweep on reaction grants me an untechable knockdown although I personally haven’t come up with much to work off on after a sweep at that distance, but that’s my fault obviously.
Personally for choice of OS, I think it depends on where I happened to throw Fei into. Assuming I threw him into a corner, I’d use roundhouse OS so that whatever he does he’s still in the corner. If there’s a chance where his wakeup chicken wing would bring him into the corner, then I’d op to use the cr forward + reaction roundhouse OS instead. Of cos, I don’t expect smart Feis to do that, but one can hope right?
Hey Kriger, I use double tapping for the roundhouse OS as well hehe. And thanks for the testing too, it’s all useful!
And about the jump strong -> sweep vs jump strong -> fierce…I generally go with the latter too. Once again though, I think it’s important to take into account where both chars are in the stage when deciding how to make use of the follow up off a jump strong.
You can only do j.mp -> sweep if you catch the opponent on the way up of a jump. It never happens for me
Nice one on the info people.
Found that OS U1 works well vs Makoto in the corner if you predict EX Overhead off a meaty cr.lk/ cr.mk. [media=youtube]DVpDhXVwgpI[/media]
Also Gagapa has 3 OS’s which are very useful vs Fei. Here is one of them [media=youtube]8K3TON61bss[/media]
I find this style OS works well on Akuma if you get a slide knockdown and predict the teleport/ or throw them then slide forward to retain charge.
after J.MP, I do the following:
S.HK for corner damage
Cr.MP -> Psycho LP/HP for Crossup/Non Cross resets (HP is bad for fake cross). Also setup for ambiguous U2 if I’m really desperate for damage.
Cr.HK is useful near corner or against characters with good answer to Psycho Cross. Also can be used as knockdown setup to Psycho Cross/Non-Cross (and deals 100 damage).
Yeah, I’ve got some issues connecting J.MP too. Usually works against big characters or high jumping ones. Zangief, Viper, T.Hawk are good victims.