Akuma General Discussion Thread: "I am the Master of the Fist!"

[Dime]

Y’all crazy. This dude is ridiculous. You just have to be able to throw fireballs semi well and you will see his strength.

Necalli/Laura/ken/ryu are all considered stubby as well.

But let’s list his “really good” attributes:

1.st.lk is a tick setup with like no pushback so tick throws are a breeze with him.
2. He has pressure after his forward throw and throw loops in the corner.
3. Though he has stubby limbs he actually has some very long ranged multihit confirms.
4. Fhp goes through throws and links to st.lp xx lk tatsu for a perfect throw bait and is plus one on block for a perfect frame trap that has to be reversaled out of.
5. Teleport to get him out of some dicey situations.
6. Some of the very best AA in the game.
7. VERY high damage
8. Very good fireball and is the safest in the cast on block
9. Lots of meaty setups against quickrise and without need for meter
10. V trigger makes his damage go through the roof (regular BNB does 238 pre v trigger, 294 in v trigger, with a better setup in v trigger and that meterless)
11. Neutral game super confirm in cr.mk xx fireball xx super (414 in v trigger, 360 without) seriously akumas v trigger is like an X factor level 1
12. Air fireballs for easy jumpins against characters that try to AA with normals or non ex dp’s
13. Faster walk speed than ryu or ken up there with Chun but not vega (not as fast as Chun either but still)
14. Only character that can do aerial specials while jumping backwards
15. Demonflip air fireball is a great approach tool in v trigger.
16. Some of the easiest and most ridiculous frame traps in the game leading to some of the biggest rewards in the game.
17. Cr.hp is a plus on block CC

[Valoon]

f.hp is basically s1 air legs but easy to do. A bit less utility overall but same thing to bait throws.

[Dime]

Lol, I lied. Akumas BNB in v trigger does 358 meterless:

In v trigger:

Cr.mp,st.mk xx lk tatsu>v fireball>v DP and you get a setup afterwards

Also, since his v DP captures it counts as a throw so the opponent can’t backrise it. Yeah this dude aint top tier…

[Intuitive2011]

Cr.Hp, his game revolves around it. Easily his best footsie/CC button. Confirms into St.Hp, Cr.Hk, has a great hitbox and plus on block. My CFN is WhoIsMrGund if anybody wants to take a look.

[IAmYagami]

Not sure if this is known, so I recorded this.
https://youtu.be/rYv6f6Wymvo

[Intuitive2011]

Not sure if this is known, so I recorded this.
https://youtu.be/rYv6f6Wymvo

BHP always OTGs on a HKD I think.

[IAmYagami]

Not sure if this is known, so I recorded this.
https://youtu.be/rYv6f6Wymvo

*F+HP always OTGs on a HKD I think.

You may be right.

You can back recover from the throw though, but if you do, you can actually get hit with the F+HP and you can combo with st.LK as shown below.

https://youtu.be/_2KSq1_Zx0Q

Not sure what it is on-block (F+HP) though.

[Intuitive2011]

Not sure if this is known, so I recorded this.
https://youtu.be/rYv6f6Wymvo

*F+HP always OTGs on a HKD I think.

You may be right.

You can back recover from the throw though, but if you do, you can actually get hit with the F+HP and you can combo with st.LK as shown below.

https://youtu.be/_2KSq1_Zx0Q

I think you could get Cr.Mp if that F.HP hits meaty.

[StarFishPrime]

I’m getting lamed out so hard

[Tragedy]

Y’all crazy. This dude is ridiculous. You just have to be able to throw fireballs semi well and you will see his strength.

Necalli/Laura/ken/ryu are all considered stubby as well.

But let’s list his “really good” attributes:

1.st.lk is a tick setup with like no pushback so tick throws are a breeze with him.
2. He has pressure after his forward throw and throw loops in the corner.
3. Though he has stubby limbs he actually has some very long ranged multihit confirms.
4. Fhp goes through throws and links to st.lp xx lk tatsu for a perfect throw bait and is plus one on block for a perfect frame trap that has to be reversaled out of.
5. Teleport to get him out of some dicey situations.
6. Some of the very best AA in the game.
7. VERY high damage
8. Very good fireball and is the safest in the cast on block
9. Lots of meaty setups against quickrise and without need for meter
10. V trigger makes his damage go through the roof (regular BNB does 238 pre v trigger, 294 in v trigger, with a better setup in v trigger and that meterless)
11. Neutral game super confirm in cr.mk xx fireball xx super (414 in v trigger, 360 without) seriously akumas v trigger is like an X factor level 1
12. Air fireballs for easy jumpins against characters that try to AA with normals or non ex dp’s
13. Faster walk speed than ryu or ken up there with Chun but not vega (not as fast as Chun either but still)
14. Only character that can do aerial specials while jumping backwards
15. Demonflip air fireball is a great approach tool in v trigger.
16. Some of the easiest and most ridiculous frame traps in the game leading to some of the biggest rewards in the game.
17. Cr.hp is a plus on block CC

Hell, I mastered throwing fireballs before I was 10. I have some friends who still claim that’s “all I did” back in the day.

I’m not saying he’s not good. “Ridiculous” is a stretch I’d say, but he is good. He definitely has tools/options galore, but that’s the technical play I was talking about. There are other characters who can execute a large part of his gameplan without those tools because they don’t need them. You can do far less work for similar reward.

The thing is, with a small-ish character pool, being high tier currently means being in the top 7. Akuma is top 10; as always, just not top 7. Not to mention, for those who aren’t character loyal, if you’re into learning a technical playstyle and want maximum reward for it, there’s no reason not to be playing Urien. No tier whore worth his salt that can put up with a completely technical character is going to pick Akuma over Urien. Probably wouldn’t pick Akuma over Juri either, but I’ve got to actually spend some more time with her to call that one.

Anywho… tier things being tier things, they’re just tier things and ultimately not necessarily that important. Perhaps Akuma’s big box o tools will come in handy sooner or later (later), I just don’t think that’s where the game is at right now.

Either way, I’m happy as hell to have my character back. I missed fighting games, but I really just didn’t give enough of a shit about Nash or Ken to bother taking SFV seriously for any consistent length of time. Now it’s grind time for sho, and I’m glad there’s a decent amount to play around with.

[IPPman]

More throw loop info

If you do a throw then dash in throw and they don’t quick rise whiff st.hk and then you can do a meaty or throw mix-up.

More info coming soon if you do cr.mp instead of dash in throw (help appreciated I have to go to work in a few mins)

^Nice. Thanks.

[IPPman]

Some stuff gotten from looking at raw data/scripts from the ~secret beta~

I included Ryu’s number in parentheses as a point of comparison:

Akuma Forward Walk Speed: 0.52 (0.47)
Akuma Back Walk Speed: -0.36 (-0.32)
Forward Dash: 16 frames (16)
Backdash: 21 frames (21)

Akuma isn’t top 3 fastest like he was in SF4, but he’s still faster than most characters. I saw some people calling him “slow” when he’s first revealed but that’s not true, relatively speaking. He’s basically Chun/Cammy tier, but below Vega godtier.

What is the parenthesis number for?

Ryu’s walk speed and dash frames.

[IPPman]

People really aren’t talking about the fact that Gouki has 2 Critical Arts. That’s huge. When he has meter and V Trigger, the opponent has to be terrified. It’s very easy to land both CAs too.

[Intuitive2011]

SFV Frame Data [2.070] (WIP)

Akuma’s frame data. Thanks @LordWilliam1234

[Intuitive2011]

Potential Vortex Setup:

Cr.Mk, St.Lp, (link), Mk.Tatsu (hit), LK.Tatsu (Whiff) XX Cr.Mk (counter hit), St.Mk, LK Tatsu, Cr.Hk. Vs Normal recovery Akuma will side switch and beat wake up 3f Jab by Chun Li. Back recovery has the same meaty timing but Akuma will stay in front.

[Kuwabara01]

found max damage
Meterless
j.HP > s.HK xx s.HK > s.MK xx VS xx K xx LK Tatsu (whiffs) > HP DP [340/519]

Meterless with VT Activation
j.HP > c.HP > s.HP xx VT > s.MK xx HP Hado > HP DP [402/632]

Meterless with VT Activation, Corner Only
j.HP > c.HP > s.MK xx HP DP xx VT > HP Hado > HP DP [413/623]

Meterless in VT
j.HP > c.HP > s.MK xx LK Tatsu > HP Hado > HP DP [417/626]

1 Bar
j.HP > s.HK xx s.HK > s.MK xx MK Tatsu > EX DP [366/556]

1 Bar, Corner Only
j.HP > s.HK xx s.HK > s.MK xx EX Tatsu > HP DP [376/549]

1 Bar with VT Activation
j.HP > c.HP > c.MP xx EX Hado xx VT > dash > s.MK xx HP Hado > HP DP [408/634]

1 Bar in VT
[Nothing better than meterless combo]

2 Bar
[Nothing better than 1 bar combo]

2 Bar, Corner Only
j.HP > c.HP > s.MK xx VS xx K xx Demon Flip xx EX Hado > EX DP [404/625]

2 Bar with VT Activation
[Nothing better than 1 bar combo]

2 Bar in VT
[Nothing better than meterless combo]

3 Bar
j.HP > s.HK xx s.HK > s.MK xx VS xx K xx LK Tatsu (whiffs) > HP DP (2 hits) xx CA [485/509]

3 Bar, Corner Only
j.HP > c.HP > s.MK xx HP DP (2 hits) xx CA > HP DP [524/531]

3 Bar with VT Activation
j.HP > c.HP > s.HP xx VT > s.MK xx LK Tatsu > HP Hado > HP DP xx CA [516/565]

3 Bar with VT Activation, Corner Only
j.HP > b.HP xx CA > HP DP (2 hits) xx VT > HP DP [586/536]

3 Bar in VT
j.HP > s.HK xx s.HK > s.MK xx LK Tatsu > HP Hado > HP DP xx CA [522/507]

3 Bar in VT, Corner Only
j.HP > b.HP > HP DP xx CA > HP DP [568/468]

[RandomBS]

I don’t know where the top tier comments are coming from either. I’m seeing high mid tier, at best. If I was a hardcore tier whore I wouldn’t touch him, but he’s my 20+ year main so I’m rocking him regardless. Pretty technical play involved without much more reward (and in some cases, none) over several other easier characters.

Is this satire?

[Valoon]

Right no I am thinking about his vtrigger. I feel like it might not be worth it to use two “charges” of it in one combo (the most known is fireball into dp) unless it kills.

The two in a combo basically drain his vtrigger bar. So you loose a lot of potential air fireball utility for example.

What do you guys think ?

[Dime]

Right no I am thinking about his vtrigger. I feel like it might not be worth it to use two “charges” of it in one combo (the most known is fireball into dp) unless it kills.

The two in a combo basically drain his vtrigger bar. So you loose a lot of potential air fireball utility for example.

What do you guys think ?

Situational. How often will you be able to get his v trigger fireball into DP off?

You can simply omit the DP or the fireball if you want to conserve meter. But the thing is let’s be realistic, if you have v trigger that means you are half life or 1/3 life… is that really the time you want to be conserving meter?

Imho it’s always going to be situational but if the combo will give you the lifelead at the very least I say go for it. Because you get a setup afterwards anyways.

[Valoon]