AEMAKOTO Guide and Q&A: Ask all your questions here!

Classic Fighting Games Ultra Street Fighter IV
1661

Okay guys, I’m gonna make an official Safe jump/OS/Setups guide, possibly for the Rindoukan Bible, possibly its own topic. I’m not an expert on OSs, I’ve basically usually stuck to the basic c.HP/U1 OSs with a smack of c.LP OS s.LP/Yamase. I’m gonna need some suggestions. Here’s my testing guide so far:

  1. Safe jump OS c.HP
  2. OS U1 off of c.MK/c.LP/safe jump
  3. c.LP OS s.LP/Yamase
  4. How safe jump Tsurugi mix-up dodges reversals and if it hits their backdash. Testing mid-height (IE combo-able with s.HP) MK and HK Tsurugi, and closer to the ground MK Tsurugi.
  5. MP Oroshi OS U1/LP Fukiage (these exist, in certain match-ups!)

I feel these are the integral OSs to Makoto, and basically my testing so far has been these things. I’m not keen on checking for safe jump OS U2, as it’s very distance related (because of U2’s travel time) and one testing could work mid-screen but fail a step farther. No “normal OS U2” will work, except on the worst backdashes in the game.

I plan to do this and add notes and suggestions on what-beats-what, and risk vs. reward (IE talking about how a safe jump’s mid-height HK Tsurugi will dodge all of Dudley’s reversals but “trade” in a sense with Dudley’s counter). Of course I’d try to add as many wake-up options as I can, like for instance Mossad Man’s post-EX Hayate HP Oroshi beating reversals. But I’m just a man. *I’m not a robot! *Gonna need some help here.

Some things I’m gonna be adding:

  • The always loveable Fukikusa.
  • Empty jump c.LP+c.LK+c.HP OS late crouch tech to target backdashers while looking for SRK/throw.
  • OS jump to catch Bison’s teleport.
  • c.LP+c.LK+c.HK to catch Fei Long’s CW mix-ups if he tries another one.
  • Plink LK+LP with Karakusa to OS tech a throw.
  • c.LP+c.LK+c.MP+c.MK to FA/throw OS backdash.
  • f+MP OS MP Fukiage in the corner.
  • When to use c.LP+c.LK+c.MK tech while under pressure.
1662

Any advise on the Juri match up? Nothing I do seems to work on her, and I simply get rolled by the character constantly.

The combination of fireballs I can’t tsurugi over, fast normals and constant pinwheel pressure is a wall I can’t break through

1663

Ah right, you mean one of them good Juris…Yea I have no clue. I have a good one on my friends list that I sometimes play…haven’t figured out what to do exactly aside from trying to stop her from starting her fireball wall…how about we just call it the firewall. Which is pretty freakin’ hard. :-\

1664

That Genkibot by any chance? Probably the only good Juri on Australian XBL.

Getting in on a good Juri is nightmare, neutral jumping over fireballs at mid range is a good way to bait a hk fireball which, when you see you can dash forward to close the gap. I find that it’s basically the same as fighting a Sagat, Dhalsim or Guile, slowly back them into the corner and try to keep them there.

Once in s.mp and s.hk are great normals to utilise, s.mp for pressure and s.hk I find will beat out everything she throws out at you and will also trade with pinwheel a lot of the time in your favour. Once you knock Juri down though is where the fun begins, juri’s wakeup game is very weak as EX Pinwheel is horrible as a reversal, her backdash isn’t too good and thus, she is susceptible to sj os u1 if you choose it. Her counter is beaten by throws and Oroshi.

As for punishing Juri, her lk pinwheel is -4 on block which is punishable by cr.lk x ex hayate mk and hk pinwheels are -8 and -11 respectively and can be punished by u1 or s.hp xx followup, ex pinwheel is -14 on block but is generally too far out to punish with u1. Her divekick can be punished by throw only if it’s not properly spaced (hits at the waist or above).

As for defending against Juri, her main poking tool is cr.mk buffered pinwheel or pre-stored fireballs or she can also use her far s.hk which is an advancing hop-kick which goes over low attacks, both are beaten by s.hk. The bulk of Juri’s damage seems to come from her immense corner pressure, she can lock Makoto down for days with fireball/normal pressure in the corner so I advise you to just be patient and block/tech while searching for an opening to either get out or reverse the situation for example: if the Juri errantly jumps at you then lp fukiage > fwd dash > lp fukiage followup EX tsurugi does huge damage and puts Juri into the corner (input would be lp fukiage > fwd dash > hcb+lp which will autocorrect into fukiage).

Another area where Juri can do damage is with her air-to-air jf.mp which puts you into a juggle state, it can link to ultra 2, juggle into EX Pinwheel or be used for some nasty resets so try to limit your time in the air. Something to watch out for now is Juri’s Feng Shui Engine which is extremely devastating in the right hands, once activated Juri gets extremely mobile and he EX Pinwheel gets more invincibility. What I like to do when she activates away from you isto stick out cr.mp buffered EX hayate so you can tag a dash in. If she activates it on Makoto’s wake-up is to just try to block, she has a slow overhead which she can combo off in FSE so be wary and as far as I know she doesn’t have any fuzzy guard setup vs Makoto thankfully.

I think that’s the breadth of my knowledge against Juri, I’ll add more if I can think of anything else

addendum: Don’t get too reversal happy on Juri, her close st.mk is considered airborne so it beats out EX Karakusa and it will also beat out EX Oroshi due to it being 2 kicks.

1665

What OSs are there for Dhalsim’s wake-up to cover his non-U1 options? All I can think of are safe jump HK/HP OS HP Hayate, and in the corner, meaty MP/HP Oroshi OS U1 (Beats EVERYTHING he can do except U1, Super, and of course blocking … auto-correct U1 FTW).

Couldn’t get any universal U2 OSs going off of anything, nor Fukiage, nor EX Hayate.

I’m on Dhalsim. Hoping to finish the initial testing of all characters within an hour or two, and have the guide in a form of sorts by tomorrow! Hopefully!

1666

On Shiro’s twitter:
1)

  • Against big character, if you use backjump HP when you are at +12 after a backthrow, it will do instant overhead. For example:
    *vs gief/seth: backthrow -> backdash -> dash -> backjump HP
    *vs sagat (1F later wakeup): backthrow -> forward jump attack -> backjump HP
  1. EX oroshi -> dash*3 -> MP oroshi:
    On hit: +5
    On hit (crouching): +4
    And it will hit airborne if opponent backdash (short backdash), giving 76 knockdown frames.
    (seems to be a bit like AE anti-yun wakeup oroshi)
1667

Something else I’ve been meaning to ask for a while, and again, a question I probably should have asked when I started playing Mak. Heh.

So, best ways to set up safe jumps? I never use them on knock downs, I typically go for something like Meaty MP. Oroshi, bait wakeup DP’s, cross up etc. but feel I should use safe jumps more. I think I have a rough idea, like backthrow => some attack to get timing precise => jump + attack but I do not know. Need the experts help :slight_smile:

And while I’m at it, cross up tsurugi? Is there a particular trick to it? Is it character specific? I remember being told that it destroys Guile, but I’m yet to do it properly, only managed it twice by accident lol. (And they weren’t even on Guile’s or wakeup or whatever I don’t think)

1668

For Back throw the 2012 safe jump set up is just a dash. So you dash forward and then neutral jump MK for the safe jump. Note that you can’t safe jump 3 frame uppercuts like Ken and Ryus. You can safe jump 4 frame start up moves though.

1669

Were any of the other timings on her safe jump set ups changed in 2012? I’m using the PC version, so I’m still on vanilla AE. I’m at the point where I’m trying to get familiar with her safe jump timing as well, but I’ve been disinclined to learning how to get them down if I have to relearn how to do it whenever the 2012 patch hits for PC

1670

I want to say only the knockdown frames for her backthrow were changed (58 frames in 2012 if I remember right…I could be way off though), so her safe jumps off her other knockdowns are the same (cr. HP, ex oroshi, HK tsurugi, etc). I’m still on PC too, so again…I could be wrong. ¯(°_o)/¯

1671

I’m pretty sure the back throw was the only one that changed. I imagine you’ll get used to it quickly since it’s suck a simple safe jump.

1672

Thanks guys. That alleviates my fears. I’ll likely take it to the lab a bit later to try and get more familiar with her set ups

1673

I use this cute combo off a lvl3 crumple in our non-2012 arcades: focus lvl3, dash, focus lvl2, dash, ultra 1.

For some reason, this no longer works in 2012. Why is that? I know it isn’t the best combo in the world, but it was one of the best for dealing damage plus meter gain to end a round. I just wanna understand what changed that made this combo whiff nowadays.

1674

Her forward dash properties changed, I’m not entirely sure how. I know she doesn’t get as much push-back when she dashes up to characters, but I’m not sure if that would account for your cute combo whiffing or not.

1675

V-Ryu gave us all the gift of a 3f reversal safejump setup a while back. it works by spacing so the first active frame whiffs and the reversal shoryu doesn’t reach Mak until frame 4 instead:

s.hp xx exoroshi, s.hk whiff to n.jump mk.

Can’t test until later but can’t see any reason why it wouldn’t still work in 2012 changelist.

1676

FA2 never scales well after a FA3, basically you can always MK Tsurugi for more damage and meter and less scaling on further hits.

j.HK or j.HP, I’ll make sure to emphasize that in my new thread when I get it going.

56 frames.

1677

Granted there are better combos out there, but I was just doing the double FA combo into Ultra 1 for style points. Not to mention, it was the only juggle into U1 that I knew of.

I just don’t see how Makoto’s new dash made this combo impossible.

1678

It is actually possible. It is just not a juggle anymore. Either way, the Tsurugi one is more flashy IMO and does like 200 more damage lol. Style points = telling your opponent to look at their lifebar lmao. But to each his own, of course.

Oh and re:juri… If her EX Spin Kick is -14, you have a 1F punish with Yamase. I’ve never tried it, has anyone else? Yamase has 13f startup…

1679

If Tekken X Street fighter (not the capcom one) has Makoto in it, will you play it? Being that it will be 3D and all. From a “grappling/ hand to hand fighting” stand point, I think she would fit right in

1680

Definitely, but it will be hard to keep me from picking Rolento and King.