AEMAKOTO Guide and Q&A: Ask all your questions here!

Classic Fighting Games Ultra Street Fighter IV
1641

Does hp not connect on a crouching ibuki if she’s hit with a tsurugi?

1642

Ugh why do I have to go to work lol :s I just thought that maybe we can make certain moves meaty with the pushback of c.lp>lp? Like mp>c.lp>lp>meaty? It would be sick if we could get more combo’d meaties.

1643

Thinking about learning makoto and i got some questions

  1. Tried st.hp HC st.mp for 30mins on Oni, only to find out it does not work on him from a point blank st.hp. Any other characters like this?

  2. When should i use her command normals that move her forward? like f.mp f.mk ++

  3. Should i try to anti air with fukiage? if yes, only LP or does mp/hp have uses ass far AA? (they seem slow)

  4. EX hayate lp.fukiage in corner seems hard on some chars. Is it just my head? Any chars it does not work on?

  5. Where can i read about mixups after certain knockdowns? The sticky threads seem really outdated. Like what should i do after a sweep?

1644

  1. I don’t know of any others outside of Oni, sorry.

  2. f+MP is her key movement normal (and one of her key normals, period), and f+LK is useful when trying to “walk” against zoners when you have more clearance, as its distance is farther than f+MP. f+MK is a novelty, a dash is almost always more useful, though f+MK can AA neutral jumps at the right angle and timing - but that’s a guess and not on reaction. f+HP into Yamase is one of her stronger normals, with a good hitbox at its max range and a fat 220 damage for a hit - it is kind of jumping bait, and if an opponent is already charging a FA and is ready for it, you can get FA’d between f+HP and Yamase.

Basically, f+MP and f+HP are her biggest movers and attacks, f+LK is good for safer ranges where its recovery means less. I like to try and “reversal” f+LK after blocked fireballs at a lot of ranges. f+MP deserves its own paragraph on its frame trapping, AA, and situational advantages - but I’m playing Diablo 2 right now and I have precious little time before my partner gets back :).

  1. Yes, AA with Fukiage. Lots. My favorite ways to ease the burden of an 8 frame non-invincible DP online is to use f+MP a little outside sweep range and look for the jump, to buffer poke with c.LP/c.LK and look for the jump, and to watch for it with sparing uses of footsie s.HKs/c.MKs, both pretty great in certain match-ups. Watch out for empty jumps though, nothing sucks worse than AA Fukiage losing to empty jump U1 from a grappler.

  2. Yep, different characters fall at different speeds. It’s useable on all character, but some are close to 1-2 frame links.

  3. They’re not outdated, except for the backthrow ones. I suppose I should update that, huh?

Read the sticky for c.HP mix-ups. You can safe jump after, it just takes manual timing.

1645

Realy helpful stuff there. Thanks!

1646

Hi guys, beginner here, started playing vsfighting some months ago, with Makoto. It’s a long bumpy road but i feel i’m improving day by day :).
Came here asking for help several times already and it has always been helpful, so once again here i am!
I’ve got quiet a few questions, related to some real basic SF4 knowlege, which i’m obviously lacking and keep me from improving further.

  1. From my noob experience, after a knowckdown, it’s seems that reversal FA+backdash is overall better than ‘naked’ backdash. When is the later a better choice?

  2. Once again, after being knowckdown, why should i prefer guard over backdash? I realize it’s a stupid question but in all honesty i dont really see a clear answer. The only downside i see about backdash is it can be OS’ed, so what i generally do is backdash till i see my opponent OS’ing it, then i backdash less and block more.

  3. Is backdash really invulnerable from startup? Sometime i’m hit by meaties, am i just mistiming my reversal backdash?

  4. What is the best answer to somewhone who do a lvl3 FA on your wakeup? Backdash? Throw? Reversal lp hayate (so armor break)?

  5. What to do against people who antiair with FA? The only answer i found is empty jump throw.

  6. How in hell are you supposed to know if Seth divekick is crossup/fake-crossup in corner and where he will land on the ground (front/back) ? Just experience? :frowning:

  7. What to do against Sakura tatsu pressure? I’m aware they are respectively 0,-3,-2, +4 so basically pressing button is kind of dangerous (at least for me, my timing not being top notch). I tried f+lp with some succes, but i always fear to be hit by a cr.hp counter hit, backdash also kind of work till they OS it with ex-tatsu, so after being caught i end up blocking till the end of time… What you guys do in this situation?

  8. Also got problems with characters who got a ‘command dash’ move, like ibuki’s special dash, blanka’s hop, abel’s rolling. Are they at disadvtange/neutral/advantage after crossing me up? Can i punish them after makoto changes side? Or the damn thing is safe and i should just try to block in the right way?

  9. Yesterday i fought a guy who just spammed FA, I mean literally every 2 sec, never seen that before. He didnt even charged it, lvl1 FA everywhere, during his pressure, during my pressure, in footsies range, outside footsies range. If i pressed button i took a counter-hit everytime, if i blocked he just dashed/backdashed out the FA. Most of the time he was outside throw range, and the FA were so instantly realeased i couldnt see them coming. I ended up loosing perfect one after the other and felt horribly helpless. What could/should i’ve done? Playing super safe, not poking, just trying to punish his attempts to go in?

  10. I have a hard time getting fukiage to consistently hit after a corner ex hayate. I’m aware timings are different depending who you juggle, but on some characters, like Ryu, it SEEMS that i need to delay the fukiage and not doing it as soon as i could. If i do it too early the fukiage will come out and whiff. Am I imagining wonky hitbox behaviors? Is it really in my head and fukiage always needs to be done as soon as possible? And yeah i know i could mash the fukiage input but i cant resign myself to do so, i want clean timing/input as i’m learning to play. ^^

I realize it’s some really basic stuff and not really makoto related, but i’d be really gratefull if one of our makoto master took the time to answer me. Thx guys.

1647

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Hey hyene! Full of questions I see, I’m a bit of a noob myself, but I’ll do my best in answering! :smiley:

  1. Both FA-backdash and naked backdash are used to bait your opponent. They can be dangerous though, while they work against some reversals…other they aren’t so effective against, like raw tatsu, flash kicks, ex SRKs, and some ultras. And yes, sometimes it’s easier to bait your opponent into doing something with a naked backdash, as FA-backdash is a very common bait universally, so some players are more likely to fall for naked backdash than FA-backdash. Also, the FA makes it inherently slower and can limit your options afterwards! So keep that in mind!

  2. Blocking is amazing my friend. Like seriously. If you get too backdash happy, your opponents can start doing more than just OSes. They may start reading you, which again could lead to you eating an ultra or a very damaging combo. Just try to not become to predictable on your wake-up! Don’t rely too heavily on reversals either.

  3. Someone else is going to have to take this one, but I wanna say…nah, backdashes aren’t completely invulnerable on start-up. Especially if your opponent hits perfectly meaty. This is why you see some people wake up with FA backdash (for ibuki’s kunai for example). Again, don’t quote me on that, just my impression.

  4. Lvl 3 FAs on your wake-up…well it depends. If they’re timing it perfectly (which doesn’t happen often), backdash is probably the quickest way out. A jump back will put you in juggle state if they land the FA, which will lessen the damage of the combo. If they’re timing it late, a neutral jump attack or late tsurugi will probably net you a full jump in combo, or you can do one of the armor breakers (ex oroshi, reversal lp hayate) to break it if you’re confident it will hit. Like I said though, FA-backdash is a common bait, so you don’t want to be doing that every time. If they’re timing it early, it’ll whiff and you can do a ground combo.

  5. Anti-air FAs are usually lvl 2 at the most, you can do empty jump ex karakusa if you’re feeling lucky! Empty jump throw is the most reliable and least risky of all the counters though.

  6. Hmm…yeah pretty much experience and good guesses when it comes to cross-up or not, sorry :\

  7. Sorry to say man, you’re going to be blocking a lot in certain match ups as makoto. This is true at all levels of makoto play as far as I can tell. I’ve yet to find a rufus v mak (of equal or so skill) match where the mak isn’t blocking for 80% of the video. Sakura tatsu pressure is one of those situations you just have to diffuse with mak. Look for a gap, like a neutral jump or an improperly timed normal. Depending on the distance, an ex karakusa can grab her outta the normal (don’t rely on that though, but it’s an option). Cr. mk OS throw tech is great in this match too. I’m not a good guy to ask about this though, I’m terrible at this match up :\

  8. Any hop/dash move like that you can jab them out of it and lead into a hit confirm like cr. lp -> s. lp -> s. mp. This applies to oni’s slashes too (you can u1 the ex slashes if you’re quick on your feet too). If you’re expecting a throw, you can use the cr. lk throw tech OS and sometimes knock them out of the hop/dash too, but otherwise you should use a hit confirm.

  9. I’m just gonna go ahead and link this: Vryu’s how to deal with FAs
    Although not directly related to this guy’s lvl 1 FA playstyle, it’s still helpful. As for that guy…sounds like some better footsies would have helped. If he keeps backdashing after blocked FAs, you can punish with fwd HP (yamase), ex hayate, or dash in choke if you’re feeling lucky. Buffered pokes into hayates will help your footsies a lot too, if ya don’t know what I mean (you sound like you do, I can tell you put in the time to research) here’s a great (dated, but still great) explanation of basic OSes: OS basics (I knew this stuff when I watched it, but I still found it helpful, so there ya go)

On a related note, sonichurricane.com has one of the most robust footsies guides I’ve ever seen, and even veteran players could get something out of it: OMG FOOTSIES

  1. I assume you’re playing 2012, as I’ve read a few reports here on SRK that that combo can be more difficult on certain characters due to their fall speeds now. I dunno though, us PC players won’t have 2012 till February so…yeah, good luck I guess? :smiley:

Phew, hope that helps Hyene!

1648

For #9, just back dash away and punish the recovery with C.MP > Hayate? Assuming it moves them forward. Otherwise you probably could have back dash and then used F.MP or Yamase. S.LK > S.MK target combo would work too instead of back dash since it’ll break the focus armour (hits twice). Of course I hate focus attacks as well. :\

1649

Yeah unfortunately, makoto appears to be major focus bait. Only lights seem to recover fast enough to avoid getting hit. Is that the same for other characters?

1650

I’ve been thinking of getting an alt but I’m having difficulties choosing which one, so i figured to pick someone that’s good at dealing with Maks harder matchups.
Any tips on who that could be?

1651

PairedPlague gave a very helpful response to your questions, yet I have a little bit extra to add:

  1. When you’re knocked down, FA backdash is a very powerful option. It messes with inputs so they you can’t get OS’d, it escapes meaties, and it gives you a bit of Ultra meter for your trouble. If you’re taking a grounded meaty, not a safe jump, you can start from down-back and use LP+LK+MP+MK to possibly tech a throw, then backdash. Some characters who can’t regularly meaty with an armor breaker, nor have a command grab or dive kick will have to take risks to beat this type of wake-up.

  2. Online, that’s pretty plausible, but it’s a bad habit to often backdash. You’re exposing yourself pretty badly with Makoto’s long backdash, and you can get walked down by some characters and punished. Your opponents, even if they aren’t good at the game or have OS’s, will try to punish a backdash after you’ve done it 2+ times, by jumping or some stupid shit, so use it conservatively.

  3. Backdashes are invincible for the first 8 frames. Some characters have such crappy backdashes that it seems like they’re able to be hit before they even go anywhere, but that’s just distance related.

  4. Meaty FA on wake-up can be beaten by EX Oroshi, Ultra, or backdash. It usually won’t be meaty though, so you’ll have to block or backdash. In the corner there are fully charged mind-games with high FAs, so if you jump you’ll get hit, block you get hit, etc. There’s ALWAYS a way out, it can just be a huge guessing game when.

  5. Start holding back when you jump in, or be ready for it. If you react to it, you can empty jump, LK Karakusa, and it’s really hard to stop. If you hold back, you can react to the FA by hitting back once more after using j.HP and backdash to safety, then use Yamase or s.MK xx MP/EX Hayate. Empty jump backthrow works fine too.

  6. More like guessing.

  7. Against LK Tatsu pressure, it’s tough. If she’s close enough, throw will beat any of her follow-ups aside from EX DP. If not, FA backdash or backdash CAN get you out of trouble. I’m pretty sure you can tech with c.LP+c.LP+c.MK to beat another LK Tatsu canceled from normals, so you have that going for you.

  8. Start neutral jumping (or jumping more), buffer poking with LP Hayate instead of others, and if they’re level 1, you can really punish depending on the character. Some level 1s are amazing even on block, some will get that character punished bad if they dash up.

  9. Ryu is harder to Fukiage. If you see the Fukiage, and it whiffed, you did it too late, not early.

1652

Except for Sagat, most of her bad match-ups are physical characters who can get in on her easily (or with good risk vs. reward in their approach). For this reason, I’d say Balrog would cover a lot of her match-up woes.

1653

Thanks.

1654

Thx everybody! My questions were real noobish but you took the time to answer me very clearly, i really appreciate that, guys. :slight_smile:
My gameplan is still really weak and i know i rely too much on what i know / what seems to work. With your help i hope i’ll start to widen my vision of the game, loosing some bad automatic reflex and start thinking more.
Once again thank you all!

1655

Wanted to drop a huge thanks to all the people posting in this thread, There is SO MUCH GOOD INFO HERE! It has really helped level up my Makoto drastically!

1656

If my opponent NJ’s 90% of the time after getting hit with MP or HP Hayate (They’ve seen me reset with Karakusa a few times in other matches.), what’s my best punish outside of Fukiage, which will be published like crazy if I do it during the 10% of the time my opponent doesn’t? I’ve tried cr.LK into EX Hayate, which works just fine, since most of my opponents can hardly punish a blocked Hayate, anyways. I tried st.MP, but I may be doing it too late because I’ve had them jump out on me.

To be specific, I noticed this against a Sakura player, so given her EX Shoryu’s properties, I’m not too worried about being punished for keeping up the pressure after the Hayate hits…

1657

You can use Karakusa os Fukiage (copyright v-ryu 2010)
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I think after a hp hayate you can raw ultra1 if you expect a jump, just be wary of characters that can change their trajectories mid-jump.

1658

You can also do Kara normal throw OS MP Fukiage.

1659

If you mean immediate U1, that won’t work because the opponent can’t move/press buttons for 2 frames. I think you meant reactionary AA U1, though.

This. Same thing with f+MP and f+LK, do them and if the opponent cleared the normal with a jump it’s a free Fukiage. I like to just do c.LK xx (PP+PP) EX Hayate in most cases against people who probably won’t mash, there’s pretty much no escape from that except mashing and, oddly enough, blocking.

1660

This is what I meant, perhaps I should have explained it better.