There spoon feeding us little by little which I noticed some time ago. I said this before, ‘Capcom is lucky there weren’t any other fighters out at the I shortly noticed Guy was a bad charicter. I would have dropped this game a long time ago and gave my money to another deserving company’. He was the only charicter I was interested in playing and turned out a failure. I truly feel like Capcom will buff Guy close to his Alpha status near the end of the life cycle of the game (by that time I probably won’t care). But for now we have to put up with the frustration, which I think was intentional from the begining. When I was just about to drop this game (for KOF’s) because of the way they treated Guy, the mysterous update occured to get my hopes up again… ‘I guess I’ll wait and see what the future holds’.
capcom has to do something with Guy he is limited in every department except punish.
Guy needs walk speed to be viable and more dangerous.
Man they are making us wait… idk what to think now if they are putting Guy’s changes in the same group as yun yang oni and e.ryu…btw i twitter’d ono this site link for us.
If you don’t make mistakes and play properly I don’t feel Guy is actually as bad as some of you say. Of course I wish I could just play him properly too. On that note I do love the idea of making that command elbow down-forward/down mp to lessen the chance of me messing it up as I tend to do for the first few matches on the machine until I adjust to the looseness of the stick I’m on. Giving Guy average throw range would be a great thing too though. With the walk speed those would be my favorite buffs.
My Ultimate Wishlist:
- Guy Hiryu alt that we got teased with a while back.
- A ground based command grab. Essentially, make his powerbomb from his current QCF + P flip a ground based powerbomb.
He wouldn’t need anything else, he’d be borderline insane with a ground based command grab, all his current tools, and NO nerfs.
PLEASE CAPCOM. IZUNA 4 COMBO ENDER. DON’T CARE HOW, DON’T CARE IF CAN’T BE FOLLOWED, DON’T CARE IF NEEDS 4 METERS, DON’T CARE IF DOES 18 DMG, BUT PLEASEPLEASEPLEASEPLEASE…
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Faster Walk Speed: Yeah.
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+1 in TC > Run Stop, Really? People are bitching about EX lunge wich is +1 in block, and you want that shitstorm over here? No way. TC >> Run Stop is 0, +1 will become run stop all day 4 free (meterless). Not gonna happen. No.
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Elbow really need to be overhead, but I doubt it will make it (3 different overheads in the same character? lol). If not an overhead, at least put +1 or +2 on hit, for easier combos (I suck xD).
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EX Hurricane SHOULD not whiff if done properly (Juri anyone?)
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It would be great if Super as AA hit the first hit, then the rest. Is lame to hit the first hit and send the FOE to the other side of the screen
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FF Chain cancelable in the last hit will be nice… Cancelable in various points of it looks totally over the top…
.BONUS POINTS: More DMG on Izuna (Give back the 200DMG glory!!).
BONUS POINTS 2: tats FADC. Top tier if is the EX. :rock:
- Guy Hiryu alt that we got teased with a while back. YEAH
- Normal command Grab is insane, man.
Edit:
1)Program the Bushin Chain Trigger glitch as seen in SFA3 into Guys move set; then making the 3rd hit of Bushin Chain into his old Elbow animation that causes the same kind of reeling hit stun that turns your opponent around on counter hit (like such attacks as Alex’s Flash Chop or Ibuki’s Jump or Far standing Fierce Punch target combos from STREET FIGHTER 3: 3S) So that if you follow up with 4th hit, it will cause a wall bounce…
Ok SERIOUSLY, because of ridiculous request like giving him a teleport and other such strange things that would be out of character or out of play style, this is why we end up w/ a sub par version of this character pushed on to our community of user by the development team. That and the likely reason that some of these people in this said community of users just sit back and take it instead of being vocal about them changing it to at least somewhat familiar respectable standards. And to anyone who would say something like it wouldn’t have been possible for them to Put an Alpha style Guy in this engine, i call Steaming piles of bull crap on that one (look at such changes to character property changes like Rose’s soul throw or Gen’s Links/target combos to mimic his chains, Ibuki right off the bat was fashioned after her SF3 self, same for Dudley with all the target combos down to most if not all their cancels, Yun+Yang etc so don’t give me that
it seems its up to one such as myself to be a voice of reasoning for reasonable requests after viewing the various requests being made that either go against his established (albeit at this point still incomplete) play style or plainly doesn’t suit the spirit of this patch… Ok so the 2 main factors that the users here seem to feel plague Guy here in AE are:
1)Low Mobility(a view i don’t quite share here which I’ll explain later on…) and…
2)Inadequate normals, whether they be on the ground or in the air
If the battle director and his team takes time to conduct a more thorough research into the nuances that makes up the whole of Guy’s play style, then we would see a lot less of his current deficiencies…
Now i’ll list a number of viable suggestions that will help flesh out his play style to a level where i feel will make him more competitive across the board
A)Chip/guard damage property to Bushin Filp Elbow
Pros:
as a special move, it should have more of a benefit than just being an air to ground attack, and feel less like a move being there just for the sake of completing his move list, by causing guard damage like just about any other physical striking special.
Cons
a fair trade off for a move that is easily punishable on guard in majority of situations
B)Canceling property to 1st hit of crouching medium kick
Pros:
expansion for more mix up options/strategies for just allowing the change of this 1 minor yet useful property
would slightly address the issue of Guy’s low mobility issues stated earlier mentioned by other users. Which now would be available through the use of canceling into his either “Bushin Flip” options, “run” specials and even a “FADC/SADC” if you choose to deplete those hard earned 2 EX bars
Cons:
from the limited and inaccurate range of the hit box on crouching medium, it would not be one of those safe go to options a %100 of the time. But then the whole point behind the suggestion of this cancel is to promote a wider diversity of canceling options to select from that will help to kept his play style fresh in the years to come, something i feel his alpha counter part has an slight edge over his SSFIV version
C)Address the poor hit box deficiencies encountered with his air normal attacks and other characters. I mean why does he not have an air attack that hits more on a vertical angle that isn’t prone to whiffing?
Pros:
maintains some layers of mix up options/strategies
also very slightly addresses low mobility issue
Cons
the plain simple fact that some of his options/strategies and links get shut down against certain characters due to the bad hit box/spacing restrictions
D)FADC property to Bushin Chain’s 3rd hit and Cancel Property to Bushin Chain’s 2nd hit
Pros:
adds a layer of mix up options/strategies
also slightly addresses his low mobility issue
Cons
1st hit is STILL avoidable by crouching posture
You’ve used up 2 ex bars in doing FADC if you so choose to, which is situational in that had to have even built up 2 bars to access the properties
E)Reduce start up frames on Specials/Super/Ultras… This is where i feel he gets his slowness aura from, as his move set was never exaggerated to be this slow. His walk speed seems fine to me as it should just be only above average and no higher really again like Alpha.
Pros:
Will easily address the issues of slow mobility most users mentioned here
Cons of not doing this and solely addressing his walk speed:
He still ends up w/ the same “slowness aura” with regards to specials/supers/ultras. with only a fraction of the options that should have been possibly if the battle director and his team designed him as faithful to his alpha counter part as you could possibly get w/o overdoing it…
F)Change property of Neck Flip to that of CFJ style; and also turn into a TRUE armor breaking property by reducing to a single hit knock down on a grounded opponent
Pros:
You no longer have issue missing a 2nd hit to Focus attacks
You’ve now gained an alternate means to mount wake up pressure
Cons:
You’ve lost an ability to perform a “Situational” combo
You’ve lost an additional hit (which all the prior suggestions would more than make up for in these loses imo)
I’d like to hear some feed back on these ideas for re-balancing…
A properly used Guy doesn’t look “slow” at all. C’mon, Guy could be a red whirlwind in your screen. Increasing startup on supers / ultras, will be benefical, sure, but needed to be competitive? I don’t think so. Combo into U1 mid screen will do it with same frames.
Add you call that Cons? It’s like “SRK FADC U1 need 2ex to do it, wich is bad”. LOOL That’s not realistic. Even the chars with heavy mixups have their limits…
Run Overhead missing 2nd hit on focusing characters is bad, but run overhead is… you know… a hit + overhead move. It will be much better to have a run >> lk+hk “slash kick” with normal dmg but break armor properties, un-cancelable.
See below last hit:
Really fixing his hitboxes (no more stupid whiffs here and there), and slightly faster walk speed will totally do it for me.
i agree with flexov. hitbox changes and walkspeed is all i want. as i’ve stated before… TC works perfectly on block. it’s on hit where the fierce will still whiff on a certain good number of characters. characters i’ve had it whiff on off the top of my head… ryu, vega, cody. jump ins not losing outright to lows needs to be fixed. i feel like his crossup needs a larger hitbox just so that i can crossup sim and rose midscreen. guy completely loses his 50/50 crossup mixup on them after a knockdown. but overall i just want walkspeed. i think guy’s normals are great. i love cr. strong, st. forward, st. strong. increasing his walkspeed would make his normals far more potent. i’ll take solid play due to good normals and walkspeed to play footsies over mixups anyday.
i understand there’s an argument that guy is supposed to be a mixup character in this iteration. you can’t just run mixups right off the bat though. it’s like running akuma mixups without finding a smart way to knock the opponent down, like a well spaced whiff punishing sweep. mixups are used to open up opponents once you’ve let them know they aren’t jumping in for free… you can go toe to toe with them in a ground game… and you know how to punish their mistakes. once that’s been established you run your mixup game once you have the momentum and you keep them guessing. there’s a place and a time for mixups… but as i said… i’ll take solid play over a heavy mixup game any day. as guy is right now… can you play solid… of course. it’s not impossible. i’ve always put a strong emphasis on fundamentals over anything… so this is how i play. however, i shouldn’t feel like using my fundamentals, my footsies, spacing, zoning correctly, should be this difficult. i shouldn’t be met with resistance because the character isn’t what he has and always been up until now.
I mention this for the benefit that the battle director or whoever is responsible for approving these suggestion in the first place will actually see theres at least a partial down side to these suggestions made instead of potentially only reading into the benefits
In what way is FADC able 3rd hit of Bushin Chain unrealistic or a non viable option?
A)it would allow for more mix up options/strategies(which shouldn’t be a bad thing if the pros and cons balance out the options existence
B)helps to support the differing styles of players instead of being restricted inside limited “styles of play” so to speak.
Outside of maybe one situational setup i can think of(involving a CH crouching Hard Punch or maybe CH close Hard kick?) , how many other mid screen combos does U1 land in without it whiffing/dropping?
I guess that could also work but i think a more practical use for that move would be if they go for the CFJ approach with that move and have it as follow up to his ninja sickle, with the added attribute of armor break. It would be even more well suited to an engine such a this one here… And possibly command a little more respect to Guy’s space
edit
MADma3str0:
i guess improved footsie option is another Pro i forgot to put down in my haste to finish up my 2 day old reply before it becomes irrelevant (draining work schedule)
but yeah after a couple of days of playing, i could feel something being off about this character just from a basic stand point… so i guess besides the iffy hit box and hurt box issues, then i guess its his walk speed thats whats holding him down then? And then how about that for Houzanto, theres virtually the same start up for LP and MP versions? I mean its things like that which also doesn’t feel right to me
FlexoV:
Just re-reread your post again and i have to say that having an over head bushin flip elbow would be over the top. To have various cancel points in Bushin Chain would not be. (though one being the Roundhouse might be boarder line LOL) Anyone w/ an extensive Alpha Guy background would know this. That would be like an extensive Dudley or a Ibuki player from a 3S background or a Gen player from A2/3 background saying that Target/chain combos having various cancel points would be over the top. “Increasing start up on supers and ultras,” beneficial? that just doesn’t make a lot of sense here. Please stop trolling this threads not looking good otherwise…
CHANGES ARE ANNOUNCED… will be posting soon as translated properly !!
well … guess we went unheard…
• The hitbox on Guy’s Neutral Jump Hard Punch has been increased in size.
** • Angled jump Medium Punch and angled jump Hard Kick have also received expansions to their hitboxes.**
** • The blog notes that when it says hitbox size increase, it mostly means they extended the bottom for each one.**
** • Guy’s ground throw range has been increased. The blog says that it’s now the same as Ryu’s.**
** • Elbow Drop (command normal version) can now be activated with the joystick in the down-back position.**
** • If you choose not to perform an attack after the Izuna Flip, there is less recovery time on the ground.**
** • EX Hurricane Kick got a hitbox adjustment so that the opponent gets juggled into all of the hits easier.**
Guy’s throw range has finally been increased! It’s the same as Ryu’s now.
OH… they also gave him a faster walkspeed but I believe this is when he is walking backwards… not sure on the forward we’ll see. -prays-
Kiryu posted a tweet that looks interesting. If someone can translate that would be awesome. Here’s the tweet.
ガイ超強化！！！ 投げ間合い拡大はもちろん、後ろ下がりの速度が上がったのはかなりうれしい。（投げ間合い強化＋前進だと強すぎたのかなーとか） 肘の コマンドがZERO仕様になったのもいいと思うけど、もう真下で慣れちゃったよw UCは変更なしか－。旋風脚と首狩りは、やっと普通になったよ
Google translate says:
Guy ultra enhanced! Throwing of timing the expansion came up behind the falling speed of course, quite glad. （ throwing timing enhancement + forward and too strong for Kana-or ） but I think good elbow command becomes ZERO specifications anymore underneath a 慣れち I’m w UC without changed?-. It became barely usual whirlwind leg and wannabe head
I would like a better translation, but that clearly says that Guy’s ultra is enhanced. Thought?
• The hitbox on Guy’s Neutral Jump Hard Punch has been increased in size.
• Angled jump Medium Punch and angled jump Hard Kick have also received expansions to their hitboxes.
• The blog notes that when it says hitbox size increase, it mostly means they extended the bottom for each one.
• Guy’s ground throw range has been increased. The blog says that it’s now the same as Ryu’s.
• Elbow Drop (command normal version) can now be activated with the joystick in the down-back position.
• If you choose not to perform an attack after the Izuna Flip, there is less recovery time on the ground.
• EX Hurricane Kick got a hitbox adjustment so that the opponent gets juggled into all of the hits easier.
… they increased Cody’s Walkspeed altogether… CMON GUY GET THAT ACTION!
no he’s saying Guy is better… “Enhanced Super Guy”
Oh I see, damn, I was hoping for some buffs to his ultras, like maybe having Ultra 1 lock in so it can be used midscreen.
throw and j.mk are nice but other than that… i’m extremely disappointed
If they gave him better walkspeed,and made his normals stop whiffing off dumb-ass nonsense…(shit whiffs on hit,against crouching sagat in the corner?) come on now… Id be a happy man with those alone. The hitbox on jump Heavy kick was always kinda weird though.