i wish we can combo into ex palm…but only in my dreams and pc hacks…
Hi guys, in the official rebalance thread I’m trying to compile a buff list for every character - I think it would be more fun (and maybe helpfull) than everybody making one separatelly.
Right now what I gave to Yang is:
- cr Lk: +10 dmg (30)
- cr MP: +10 dmg (80)
- Tourazan: L +15 dmg (75), M +15 dmg (75), H +20 dmg (80)
- H Byakko S.: +10 dmg (150), chip and stun like in AE
- Target combo 2: +20 dmg (150)
- Lk: reduce start up with 2 frames (3)
Basically all his AE damage and his LK. But since I’m not an Yang mainer, I would like to hear what you guys want - can you compile a list with buffs for Yang ? then I will add them.
My sugestion would be - not to pick - his cross up back. It would probabelly give way for more unblockables and more vortex. But if you would preffer instead of his damage something else…
if yang can’t have his cross up back then we need his AE dive kick back. something really needs to give with this character. it makes no sense to have the worst dive kick out of the cast and no cross up.
kyoku is very good bro. but i feel its just testament to his skill rather than the character. also, lets not act like yang is capable of placing ( let alone winning ) any majors of significance. i even doubt my current main ( ken ) in this regard and he is a shit ton better than yang.
i don’t want AE yang to return, but i’m not going to sit here and lie to myself and say yang is good in his current state when he clearly isn’t.
Definitely a buff to either his dive kick or j.mk cross-up. While he has good walk speed, his normals aren’t good enough for him to primarily be a ground based footsie character and I doubt that’s what his character archetype is meant to be. As it stands right now, his dive kick is used sparingly and his cross up is used very rarely and mostly only in set-ups (and still doesn’t hit Rose). As such, he needs some sort of effective aerial attack. A buff to one of these two moves would help him greatly.
Also, one that I think everyone agrees on is making ex. command grab throw invincible. Right now there’s very little reason to burn meter on ex. command grab when regular command grab will basically net the same result. This buff would give Yang a reason to get close to grapplers and help out with some bad matchups (Abel, Hawk, Honda) and one horrendous one (Gief) without running the risk of being grabbed for ridiculous damage.
If you have to take some buffs away from the list to compensate I would remove the damage buffs to his normals and target combo. He needs the damage buffs to his rekkas though IMO.
Well Kyoku placed 5th at the Japanese 25th anniversary qualifiers. I’d call it a major.
As for changes I’d want:
- Far fierce cut 1 frame of start-up to make it 8 frames and then take 2 or 3 frames from it’s recovery to make the recovery 17 or 16. Then take one active frame from it to prevent it from becoming too dominant a tool in footsies. I think it would make it a tool good enough to even out the Gief match-up. Then again buffing it too much could make his footsies too good.
Before someone says I’m tripping about making his footsies too good just think about the combination of cr. mk, st. mp, st. lk, sweep, st. mk, st. hk which is already better than Chun’s frame-wise and the hit-box is more than good, a divekick and on top of that a st. hp with good recovery.
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As I said earlier I’d like that his overhead would get buffed to get a better high-low mix-up game going. I thought earlier that it would be good if it would be +3 but it would probably be too much. If you’d hit it meaty it would be too easy to combo after. Maybe make it +1 on block and +2 on hit. If no changes to frame advantage then maybe give it 18 frame start-up.
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St. lk would be good if it was 4 frames. Then it would still be comboable from cr. lk and also a stronger tool in footsies. I really can’t think of a reason why it couldn’t be 3 frames though.
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I think cr. lk should get it’s damage back if we’re thinking of damage buffs. It’s the only bnb that does below average damage. Everything else is decent enough.
Buffs I don’t want to see:
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j. mk back. I’m quite happy without him being another character based on okizeme. On top of great okizeme he also is a character who happened to have arguably the best corner pressure and the best corner carry in the game.
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Throw invincibility on ex command grab. Sure it’s useless now but it still was a tool too good to have. It would have way more of an impact on other match-ups than grapplers and I doubt it would change much against Gief. The problems with that match-up lie elsewhere. A buff to st. hp would be a more balanced approach.
Buffs I don’t need but won’t mind I get:
- Divekick recovery reduced. It would help in a couple of matches but also it could make a lot of match-ups nigh lopsided. For a tool that travels such a distance it’s good as it is.
oh yea, he did get 5th. well, it was just his day. but i honestly don’t think yang can consistently place like that.
but i’m fine with yang j.mk not returning if he gets his old dive AND his standing short back. i don’t understand why y’all so afraid to let yang have these things back. he wouldn’t even be good as characters such as cammy. but he would definitely benefit greatly.
I don’t see why throw invincibility on the command grab was/is too powerful. It’s basically just an opportunity for you to spend a meter to outguess your opponent, which I think Yang sorely needs.
Throw invincibility is good only against Abel
I actually don’t want j. mk cross up back, it’d be stupid easy, and any old scrub would use him. I’m so used to his dive kick now too that it’s not something I really desire, but at any rate my list is very simply:
-St lk returned to ae status
-Damage to ae status
-More active frames on lk dp (more active frames on all dps would be nice, but lk dp needs more for a better aa)
Buffs that would be nice to have in addition to the other 3:
-Possibly a buff to st hp, but it’s not awful as it is now
-More block stun on j mk?
-St lp hit box extended downward. Being forced to do a specific combo on 3 members of the cast because of their hit box is such a nuisance to me
I really don’t feel he needs much, but he definitely needs something.
Rekkas do not need damage buffs or cr mp.
Like ive said before Yang definetly needs a better hitbox on j.mk or like cerberesfx said move the hitbox back where it was if that solves the issue on him being unable to cross up on characters like Rose.
I see a lot of Yangs asking for damage buffs but not seeing many actually maximize his damage already for example see a lot of yangs in footsies do cr mk xx rekkas x2 fadc > st mk > jhp: for 239 dmg but they can instead do cr mk xx rekkas x2 level 2 FA > st mk > jhp and get 259 damage and its not something that is hard to do.
Only damage buff i’m fine with is cr lk as it wouldn’t affect his other combos that already do good damage.
I think breaker has the best idea, what Yang needs is just better footsies, that is the only area that hes really lacking.
My overall listing for Yang is.
J.mk adjusted so it can cross up on every character.
cr mp: +1 on block +4 on hit less push back. damage nerf to 60
cr lk: hitbox reverted to AE 2011.
st lk: start up 3 frames.
hp palm: active frames now 10.
lk dp & ex dp: fadc is -1 on block now.
hk roll kicks: have projectile invincibility back.
2 frame recovery nerf on dive kicks undone.
Yang is one of the characters that was nerfed beyond what was warranted i.e Vanilla Sagat and Super Guile.
They should have kept his j.mk, it was such an important tool and is a tool that vortex characters like Akuma still have…
I think the only nerfs that Yang needed was damage(because he gets it so consistently in AE before patch) and meter build on palm.
And by damage nerfs, I don’t mean across the board nerfs, just a decrease on the popular mixup/reset normals i.e Jump Hp etc.
Ok, I took a look of your proposals, and I made some changes. This is how the buffs for Yang looks now:
- cr Lk: +10 dmg (30)
- st far and cl. Lk: reduce start up with 2 frames (3)
- cr. LK: undone the hurtbox nerf from AE
- Roll Kicks: - return the hitboxes to AE status
- M, H Palm Strike: hitbox active period +3 frames (12)
i would cry if yang received this/
- old palm frame data to help vs grapplers.
- better s.mp hitbox (yun like)
- far hp knocks down on counter hit.
- 3 frame s.lk
- fix input priority of teleport if that’s possible
- better hitbox and autocorrect properties to lk dp.
- lowered hurtbox on cr.lk like before.
I’m firmly against giving him the crossup back
I’ve been going over and over about what Yang needs and I’ve come up with a couple of requests. Lol probably ended with a couple buffs I was against at some point.
-Cr. Mk extend the hitbox in front of the hurtbox giving it a little more range and more priority. If not then give it two more active frames.
-Cr- Hk extend the hitbox to his foot.
-Far St. Mp change hitbox back to AE status at least.
-St. Hp remove 3 recovery frames.
-Cl. St. Mp lessen the pushback on it on block. Improves frame traps making him a formidable frame trap character.
-Overhead make it +1 on hit 0 on block.
-St. Lk 3 frames. Yes it’s good but for example Sakura’s is almost identical.
-Lk DP fadc -1 on block.
-Cr. Lk everything back to AE status
-Make EX Rekkas third hit push you back like in 3rd strike so you could make it safe by timing it.
I don’t think it would make him OP or anything. It would just make him be a contender again.
The Ridiculous Bonus request: Give EX Rekkas 3rd strike levels of stun.
I hope the teleport for mk and hk has the same startup as the lk version
St.lk goes back to 3f
The first 2 hit of Target Combo goes back to safe on block
The target combo nerf came for a reason. It was braindead in footsies. Sure Yun’s was better since his st. mp has a load of active frames and a better hitbox but that doesn’t change the fact that it was dumb for being basically mashable footsies. People used to just mash st. mp and buffer hp so much it was silly.
Still I think his st. mp needs more active frames and a better hitbox. It would be more of help.
give yang his old dive back please.