The funniest thing about this is that 2 weeks ago I was programming some XNA controller input classes for a fighting game and I solved this problem in about a minute, basically for every controller direction you just don’t read the d-pad if the analog stick is beyond the deadzone. It literally took me 2 minutes to implement so hopefully patching this will be easy enough. They also need to patch it so that if left is pressed right can’t register which should also be fairly easy. The main problem now is if someone was slick enough to wire L3 to left so that you could hold the thumbstick right and press it in to block every single crossup which is a pretty big advantage and pretty much impossible to detect even if you’re watching someones hands looking for a trick. Now that I think about it it sounds pretty easy to wire an arcade stick so that if you push down on it a little it hits a pushbutton in the center that pushes left and right at the same time. Luckily for arcade sticks though if you pop one open and look at the wiring for a few seconds it would be pretty obvious if one was hacked for the most part.
Yeah it’s really fucking stupid. Test this out: Program two separate buttons for fierce.
Okay, now hold down one of the fierce buttons and try to press the other one. What do you get? NOTHING! Now if they could do that for the attack buttons, why oh why could do not do it for the directional pad? It makes zero sense.
this new bug is the least of my worries. i’ve never played a buggier game than SSF2T:HDR. what the fuck were they doing while waiting for the art to be done? they had like six months to fix most of this shit but apparently they sat on their asses not caring.
Yes, if you look a few pages back, you’ll see that i actually contributed some new info, unlike yourself.
This scene really doesn’t need the old man brigade showing up to “win” threads using AGSF2 brand semantics every single time something new comes up. For every person on SRK willing to sit down and do some research, there are ten people voicing an opinion without doing any testing at all.
I’m not enjoying this whatsoever, but someone needs to stand up to the prepetually grumpy “veterans” who think it’s their job to go around acting authoritative and casting judgement over games they barely play. I pretty much lost my respect for you after you refused to play dog-face in XSF. If you want to stand on the sidelines, that’s fine. But i’m not gonna back down when you come in here and try to make it sound like new games are garbage like everyone else who remembers flipping a coin for Guile.
It is what it is. There will be plenty of time for bad vibes after Evo. For now it’s what we’ve got and this pre-emptive whining gets us nowhere. If you have new info or an idea for Evo rules changes, we’re listening. Otherwise all you’re doing is kicking up old dirt.
Actually that wouldn’t work so great because holding one jab button while pressing the other gets you nothing. You’re gonna end up getting in your own way a lot. At best, it’s only slightly better than using two fingers to mash on one button.
Yeah, they could have fixed it if one of the testers had caught it in time.
The reason it doesn’t work with two buttons is because Capcom games keep track of held buttons. You have to release it for the game to let you attack with that button again. I mean, that’s like expecting your character to walk faster if you hold forward on d-pad and analog stick at the same time.
This whole issue existed since the very first SF2 game, but it wasn’t a problem because the hardware always took care of the potential glitch. It wasn’t until the last generation of consoles that we had controllers with two separate directional sensors. Like Preppy mentioned, obviously they found a way to solve it for Hyper Fighting on the Xbox360. Your character will simply stand in place if you try holding opposite directions, which is what happens on FBA and MAME as well.
Then you picked a particularly poor thread to get on your soapbox. ST is a game that the “perpetually grumpy veterans” actually have a relevant and well-founded opinion on, and I play HDR all the time (as does one of the other “perpetually grumpy veterans,” Milo).
I don’t know if you had some canned argument ready to fire at me the next time I mentioned roll cancelling or something, but you shot your load in the wrong thread. I play ST all the time, I’ve entered more ST tournaments than any other game since 2003, and I’ve played HDR pretty much non-stop since it came out.
Not once did I say that HDR was a bad game. Nor did I say that this glitch is gamebreaking. Had you actually read my posts instead of furiously mashing Reply, you would have seen that the only objection I made was to the people claiming that the glitch is insignificant because offenders will always be obvious. That’s it.
Looks like where about at the point where you will have to open up your stick at tourneys and show it to the judges before it’s legal. I never really thought about it before but it would be pretty easy to wire up some silly shit on a custom stick for example put a pushbutton under the joystick at a particular position and connect it to a pcb and you could have macros that would be nearly undetectable where the joystick would hit the pushbutton if you held the stick at a particular angle and pushed it down a little like L3 on an analog stick. Of course it’s really easy to anyone who’s ever made a stick to see something like that going on.
awesome, now do it in assembly on code written over 10 years ago, we’ll wait.
This topic needs to die. :lame:
I think it is pretty reasonable to say the EVO rule makers will adjust the rules if this really becomes an issue. There not going to create an tournament environment were this kinda of BS can transpire.
Secondly, with all the new turbo sticks coming out, there will be plenty of other bullshit to worry about with this game.
You’ll be faced with many more* turbo* happy Chuns/ Hondas/ Blankas/ Dictators, than a guy with a custom stick made especially to abuse a technical oversite, so he can walk and head-butt.
-INHO- fatboy :china:
I think your note is off course here. He’s saying that as an amateur, he was able to do it easily with a modern framework. You may be right that it might be more difficult to do in the case of HDR, but that doesn’t make it okay. Backbone is a team of professionals. They didn’t do their due diligence in quality control.
grumpy “veterans”
LOL.
Seems like a lot of needless fear here. You can theoretically nerf the tactical advantage by:
- on XBLA/PSN, always Host the match if you’re not playing a charge character (cheaters would only want to Host themselves, whereas people who don’t care would be fine joining you)
- at tourneys, charge characters get P2 side always
- if you lose at a tourney to a charge character, change sides
The thoughts about hacked sticks with extra buttons seems unlikely given that “strange” extra button on your custom stick wouldn’t make any sense. An 11 button MAS stick might be suspicious because you could potentially wire up the far left buttons to give you this effect, but again - just have anybody you’re even lightly suspicious of on the P2 side, and if they force the issue, call the tourney judge.
Those theoretical nerfs sound both annoying and incomplete (crossup blocking?) to me FWIW.
I think that hosting is random on PSN scoreboard matches too.
I haven’t played tourneys but I’m surprised that they don’t insist on provided joysticks.
Or better yet, have an Evo rule where all players are allowed to ask the opponent to try out their controllers for two minutes after a match is concluded. I don’t think suspicions would arise often enough to slow down the tournament. If it’s for a game that’s running late, the two players should have to find an open TV/console, but that won’t be too difficult either.
Again, this thing should be pretty easy to spot unless someone is being really subtle with it. Almost every charge application makes it obvious. The most difficult thing to spot would be the anti-crossup blocking trick that someone mentioned earlier, which should only work from one side as well. Besides, there’s always constant video footage of almost every match at Evo, certainly of the players who go far. The threat of being caught cheating on video and being banned from entering Evo the following year is no small deterrent either.
For a game like ST, i think rapid-fire buttons are a hell of a lot scarrier than this glitch and that’s never been a problem before. Personally i don’t like any of this paranoia because at the end of the day, we’ve always trusted the player base not to cheat and i don’t think that should change now.
Yes, I 100% agree. This is my big concern. Every new joy stick coming out in Feb (Hori & MadCatz) has the option.
No matter how good you are, Turbo Hunda = HUGE pain in the A$$!
Eh, turbo is less of a big deal here compared to vanilla ST since they made the mashing specials so much easier.
And in general, trusting human beings not to cheat has not exactly been a recipe for success. We need to develop a solid method for handling this and any other exploits which could arise in the future.
I disagree. I think it’s an even bigger deal in HDR because now you can do mash special moves from neutral. They required five button inputs in O.ST which meant you could never kara cancel into them the way that people kara into Raging Demon. Now you can hold rapid fire fierce and get Hundred Hand Slap without having to be clever about setting it up.
But that’s missing the point. Most of the truly scary combos in ST are links, which are difficult to time under pressure. Rapid fire means you’ll get those combos all the time. You never have to worry about mistiming jump-in combos either, which means you can do your jump attacks earlier in the air the way the CPU does it.
You’ll also win most tick/throw situations since you’ll be inputting a button every other frame - possibly every frame if you hold down two rapid fire buttons. Reversals will be incredibly easy since you can just do the command motion ahead of time and hold down the button. You’ll get it every time since rapid fire is either pressing a button or negative edging a button on every single frame.
There’s also a lot of other minor benefits like getting hella damage out of holds and escaping holds with minimal damage.
The mental aspect of this is huge because mashing is normally very distracting. So is trying to time a reversal throw to escape Rog/Sim traps. With rapid fire buttons, you just hold down the button and worry about what you’re gonna do next. Either you get the upper hand in the situation or you know that you couldn’t have done any better. There’s no second-guessing yourself or worrying about adjusting timing.
Here’s my attitude:
If you need to cheat (turbo buttons, super secret analog stick, whatever), then you’re a scrub to begin with, meaning you’re going to crack under pressure and don’t have the necessary intangibles to win any ol’ way. So, go ahead and cheat, who cares. It’s not that serious.
^^^ Wish I said it myself. Straight and to the point.
^^^ Oh wait I kinda did… Do I get a cookie? Cuz F*ck man, I could REALLY use a F’n cookie!
PS. Congrats Shirts on the 1st place finish this past weekend! :karate:
Sup, Big Dawg. More like congrats to Afro and old man Valle. Although I didn’t have to play many matches since early on Afro was OCVing fools, the ones I did play, I played like sheeyacht. =) I won a few, but didn’t have to play many.