Yeah, no. Been a part of another community not in anyway related to FGs and so many females had their personal shit dug up and spread around until they got the wrong female’s stuff (lawyer parent) and yeah, let’s just say a bullet was dodged there.
See why can’t there be more posts like this?
Because that post is idiotic ostrich fodder lacking any real content?
That… that’s barely a post.
You can’t just say “NO IT ISN’T!” and expect that to fly.
I live in the Atl where its basically raw 24/7 down here. We have women gamers…they don’t get treated terribly…in fact they join right a long with the “get in that ass.” talk. Hell one of women gamers actually helps with running our monthlies. xesaie you’re just posting a whole lot of bs and hyperbole. Of course there is gonna be some isolated(keyword) cases where females are treated bad but for the most part, everyone is accepting. Calm that noise…
I’m at the end of my fortitude here, so don’t worry.
The thing I’ve come to at this point is that people just don’t want to see it. I’m not gonna convince them to take a look at their attitudes over the internet.
Or at least not to admit it.
I'll just have to cut off from here, hoping that people are actually thinking about it, and that any passersby will read this discussion and see the points.As a 90s arcade player there has been the worst or all things done in an arcade before, fights, racist comment, sexism whatever. I’m from Alabama a small scene and we have had multiple fights and high tension time in the arcade all of the time. But that is not the big issue here.
The biggest problem is the “stream” and the exposure it gives to everyone in the world and the prospective money it will bring in. Commentators at most local events are mainly there for color commentary not really play by play with the exceptions being UltraDavid, Ski and Chen and a few others. They treat their commentary as a job not as a tool to spew whatever statement they want to appease the “stream monsters”. Where can you get away with this in the professional realm of any job you take that you are getting paid to do? No where. You will be immediately fired or severely reprimanded.
You don’t need to censor the commentary but you have to understand what is acceptable to say in a work-like environment and what is acceptable to say when you are in the arcade enjoying in the company of your boys. It reminds of this past Evo when Yipes did local commentary in the room at Evo while UltraDavid and the rest did commentary across the stream. Why was this done? Because Yipes is unfiltered in what he says, with 20k+ people watching the stream they didn’t want him broadcasting, instead left the few guys who take commentary as a near job to do it and let Yipes play to the audience there. I love Yipes commentary because it is colorful, not racist, not sexual or whatever. It brings flavor to the matches, I wish he would do commentary all the time. But when you are pushing a product you want to sell you may have to decide whether you want swearing to go out the masses or want something semi-professionally done.
The Cross Assault thing was deplorable no matter how you look at it. For all of you saying she should have spoken up. Go watch when Jared was talking with Aris about the difference between Starcraft and fighting games and they brought her in to speak, she started to say the comments he made her uncomfortable, then they ran over her with the idiotic stance that racism and sexual harassment is what the FGC is about and you should feel uncomfortable. Please.
We have to do better and it starts at the top where Inkblot has condemned this type of behavior. If you don’t understand that and you are from the 90s arcade timeframe and you are now in your late 20s like I am. You need to look at yourself and see where your life is going.
Is this a problem in FGC? Or is this a problem in life itself? And let’s look at how it’s handled in life…
I mean, you can see this at the most basic level even in children. Look at they act in the school/on playground/etc. If theres no supervision around they will pick on minorities in any way possible. Or hell, some people will pick on anyone whether they are a minority or not. The problem is they learn to take advantage from a young age, and these people are more or less the same way in to adulthood. If they can get away with something, they will.
Now how does this apply to the FGC? People are still going to get away with what they could, and to stop it there needs to be some form of rules or supervision to stop it. It’s as simple as that.
People have to realize there is a line between making someone salty and truly being hurtful. There’s no distinction between that right now. People like Aris say stupid shit like “that’s what the FGC is about”, and sure saltiness is unavoidable, but not being directly hurtful.
That’s not saying people can’t trash talk or anything, feel welcome to trash talk. But there should be a line, and if someone goes over the line there should be some form of moderation to tell them to calm it down or they will be penalized. This would not be hurtful to the FGC and only encourage people not to go over the line.
It feels like the last day or two is the beginning of a civil war within the FGC. You’ve got the grass roots we play for the love of the game side and the e-sports get that money side of it. Gotta be politically correct so we can have more shows side and the women don’t belong in the FGC side. I just find it funny how the powers that be are so quick to be PC and apologetic over something they have no control over. If you’re gonna get butthurt over stream comments put a disclaimer on first like they do on Blu-Rays that says something to the extent of the views and/or opinions of commentators do not reflect the beliefs of Level Up, I Play Winner, etc.
Your right, they have no control over it, but only because they don’t have any moderation in place to do so.
If they are apologizing for it, they know something happened negatively, then it seems they should attempt to have some control over it, no?
It’s silly to argue that they have no control over thing when in reality it’s only happening because it’s allowed. What do you think would happen if a country decided that it’s not illegal to steal? And then they say “sorry, we had no control over it”…
um… I’m saying anime because I am referring specifically to Japanese Cartoons? your example was comic books which isn’t animation soo not sure what that comment is about, and I know teen titans (Marvel / DC) also does animations but you’ve never mentioned it soo i still dont know what you’re trying to say.
Japanese anime do the same to their female chars, and quite often for their male fan-base. And in those anime directed towards females, the male chars are usually quite feminine as well or other features to make them more attracted to women. Its just what their target audience wants to see.
Which in sense is exactly the same as your comic book example, though I thought anime being a better example because its more obvious, and more known IMO.
Why is this an issue? If what they’re saying is slander then prove them wrong. If girls can beat 99% of any male challenger then what can they say.
This whole stereotype view is in our culture. This IS a MALE dominant society, until you’ve accept that fact we can argue all day. The Media is playing on this to get more attention. They don’t give a shit about the well-being of anyone other than their own. Any kind of discrimination gets a lot of attention because theres always an army of mindless readers who’ll agree with anything the media throws at them. Stemming from the fact people are always trying to claim equality but its simply impossible. There will always be discrimination.
Is it tough being a girl, yes, but hasn’t it always? Until the female population can prove themselves to the Male dominant society they’ll always be looked down upon.
you can’t control what people say. That’s probably why any game that is online has a disclaimer ONLINE INTERACTIONS NOT RATED BY THE ESRB. put a disclaimer on streams so that when people speak their mind and it’s not PC and people get butt hurt they can point out the disclaimer that warned them of the freedom of speech.
That’s BS.
So you never been in a professional setting where whoever was in charge said “Hey, watch the language please”?
FGC is trying to grow as a professional setting as well. Why should it be treated any different? Hell you can even allow language for all I care, but anything that could be considered serious harassment can only bring negativity to the community.
Even these forums have rules, so why shouldnt the tournaments themselves?
That thing is just there so that they can’t be sued. They still have the ability to control what is spoken in those chats. If a player is “reported” then their account can be banned from online play, which in essence is control.
I know, that’s what makes it a dumb handle imo.
Okay so just for the heck of it I decided to sort the comments of “The Dark side of FGC” article by most popular posts. And it’s not a shock at all that the most highest rated posts were that for people that are against any sort of censoring of the FGC. I think it’s pretty clear that FGC is not E-Sports and has it’s own identity.
However it seems from reading the most recent comments that there’s nothing that can be done. There’s too much money being tossed around now, SRK and EVO are getting a lot of sponsors and these people are making threats saying that FGC needs to be censored whether they like it or not, or they will pull out.
And SRK has made it’s choice, they want to continue to make money and they aren’t shy about it. If that means catering to sponsors over the voice of the FGC, then so be it. The only thing I want to say now we should stop with the hypocrisy, FGC is no different from MLG or another other E-Sports community.
I’m not saying that SRK is shunning the entire community, the logic is that if we get more sponsors then we get better streams and more money for tournaments etc. so the ends justifies the means. I don’t agree that with the fact that in order to become more PC we need to go after the dedicated players that made the scene what it is today. But it’s too late the wheels have been set into motion, and we need to get used to the new FGC that now lives in fear of what non-fighting game players think of us.
It’s exceptionally “unprofessional” of them. This is what bothered me last year with the whole yellow card bullshit with Justin - the Cannons say they want the FGC to be more professional, and then do something completely unprofessional like enforcing rules retroactively. If a situation arises that requires the creation of a new rule, so be it, but you can’t go back after creating the new rule and apply it before it happened. Trying that shit in a corporation would result in labor board hearings and lawsuits, and if laws were retroactively applied we’d literally have thousands more felons in Northern California alone with all of the weapons law changes made in the last decade. Add to that more of my rants from earlier today, that the concepts of professionalism (doing your job, and doing it well), and being polite and PC are not actually linked together in anyway outside of the customer service field (where, gasp, being polite is your job), they simply come off as hypocrites.
Singling out one community for a what’s essentially societal problem isn’t productive. All we get are threads like this, curated outrages from hypocritical gaming blogs fishing for clicks and an endless controversy over who’s selling out and who isn’t. No one here on SRK or in any gaming ‘community’ is going to have the time or resources to undo the attitudes people harbor that they then bring with them to the tournies. I’ve seen others try, I tried, and failed utterly because everyone assumes they’re entitled to an opinion no matter how uninformed. That’s the case in the outside world, too, though. Often people do not want their leisure time turned into a place where discussing hot button issues is the norm, so that’s why people trying their damnedest to engage in apologetics and weak justifications for other people’s behavior. You all just sound stupid, though, seriously. It’s also not going to improve the situation at all.
The best the community/PR managers running the site here can do is admonish people to self-censor, but that call is being handled in a way that encourages the ‘gaming press’ to be sensationalistic and more than a bit smug – and paint with an overly-broad brush. This occurs more and more often because people have an axe to grind on both sides of the debate and nothing more. It’s also a spectacle for a site like Kotaku or Giant Bomb to draw people in. So, there you go.
Look at your user name for fucks sake first of all. Next up, no, I sincerely doubt the sexist undertones have more to do with the lack of females in the FGC than the fact that society at large does not consider video games a valid hobby for young girls. There’s also this to consider - the genre with the highest F to M ration is the MMORPG and I assure you, nothing that the FGC could ever hope to do short of actual physical contact, could even begin to compare with the shit that happens in those games, and the only reason physical contact can surpass it, is because there is no chance of physical contact in MMOs.
Sure, people could stand to be nicer to each other, and some people do take it to far, but we also live in a society that currently makes it a priority to be offended by things as much as possible, because as we are today, humans thrive on drama.
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/harassment
Going strictly by the definition of the word, you’ve harassed quite a few people, especially considering that insults tend to annoy.
E-sports isn’t even soft-core porn caliber.
It’s really quite simple, look at it in these terms. The FGC is like an underground no holds barred martial arts tournament. You got guys killing each other, using chairs and baseball bats, eye gouging, rabbit punches, no rules. You got rowdy shady people, fistfights, anything goes.
Now on the other hand you have the UFC. The clean version, tons of rules, can’t hit people in certain areas or use weapons, commentators gotta watch their language, all that.
Now in this case, some of the fight promoters who runs this bigshit underground thing, they want more money. They’re noticing more and more people kinda wandering in after hearing “brutal fight match!!!” from friends who saw some shit. Well now the promoters have a dilemna: to make more money and get the fame they want for their contest, they’re gonna need to go mainstream. But to go mainstream, you can’t have cage matches with dudes fighting with baseball bats covered in nails. You can’t have an announcer screaming for “that bitch ass faggot to get fucking raped!” You’re gonna have to tone that shit down, or all the mainstreamers are gonna see that and go “wow you people are fucked up wtf I don’t wanna see this shit!”
Now it’s happened. It’s becoming mainstream. Sponsors are coming, Inkblot and Wizard are saying shit, we gotta clean this up. No more fistfights in backalleys and warehouses at night on the docks. No more cage matches. No more crazy shit going on at events. They gotta make it more like UFC, at least in small steps first, to make sure they can reach their goal without alienating all the old dudes before they get there.
This shit with Aris is like them having a HUGE mainstream match with all the rules in place, and some dude just gouges the dude’s eyes out live on camera for all to see, and when asked wtf he was doing says “hey look, we always did that shit here man, if you aint killing somebody you aint really fightin!” Now the eye is on them, the guys promoting are scared shitless, they don’t want this guy exposing people to the roots of how shit was, they want people to see the new clean version to lure them in. This guy gets sacked, apologies made and comments about how he was just some bad apple nutjob. Marn is like the dude who commentates the next match and says “LOL dude all sad cuz he lost his eyes lmfao”. Now he has to get sacked too, otherwise people will think the promoters condone this stuff.
Now it’s come to this, the thugs at the warehouses want their hardcore underground cage matches to the death with no rules, the promoters and some of the newer guys or older guys who want more money and bigger fight purses are trying desparately to sweep that old image away and forge a new more acceptable one. Naturally the hardcores are pissed and see this as selling out, the promoters see this as making more money and getting a return on their investment.
You gotta choose, you can’t have your underground death matches on live streams with mainstreamers seeing it. You either stay underground, or you stop slaughtering people in the ring. Don’t like what Inkblot is doing? Hold your own tournies, forget EVO and all that. If you want that fame and money, then yeah you better do what is required to get it. No different from organized crime, running in the street shooting people while screaming works fine when you’re starting out, but if you wanna work with mafia guys and getting that crazy money, you’re gonna have to put on a suit and act civilized and do what they want, or get booted out.