zangief can do that? i know he has active grab frames, but i thought cancelling whiff into typhoon was a remix only thing with hawk.
i think its a whiff glitch that originated from ST. I remember reading from another thread about this. originally I thought it was just roll back. but some other guys said they confirmed it was not roll back.
I haven’t been able to replicate the SPD cancel thing with my programmable controller.
So I was right all along, the super doesn’t whiff. Yet another reason to play this game on the 360.
Yeah the SPD whiff canceling thing is how Zangief’s SPD has active frames. It technically doesn’t actually grab on any frame except the first frame unless you press or release punch buttons. I confirmed it by tested it out in emulator (kawak’s frame-by-frame mode in ST). If you try meaty grabbing the CPU set to jump, you will notice you can’t grab them by timing the SPD early unless you mash buttons/piano (ps3 version).
T. Hawk’s super also has no whiff if done correctly on the ps3 too. I’m assuming whoever tried it on the ps3 did 720’s instead of the new motion.
on the topic of ticking into super, i’ve found an anomoly in the way hawk’s 720 behaves in remix.
i’ve been playing a lot of hawk lately in st, and hearing about how his super doesn’t have a whiff animation in remix, i got excited with the possibility of having his crouch jab x2 --> super still be safe on reversal if it were negative edged. unfortunately, this isn’t the case. i can do this on an st cab, emulator, and classic mode probably 8 or 9 times out of 10, but when i went into remix to try it out, it just wouldn’t happen. out of like 20 or so attempts, absolutely zero worked. i didn’t get a whiff after the 720, which is cool but pointless because for some reason the game just won’t let the super come out. i tried it on both sides, rotating in both directions.
to clarify the motion (from 1p side):
- start in crouch-block, tick with jab
- rotate 360 clockwise, returning to crouch-block (jab animation keeps him grounded)
- tick another jab, holding it down along with strong and fierce
- rotate 360 clockwise, again returning to crouch block
- release all 3 punches to get the negative edged super
papercut or jiggly, throw me a bone here
don’t do old 360 motion in HDR. try this instead. tick, tick, forward up position roll back to down back position twice then end in back position. if the super doesn’t come out you will end up walking back or stand blocking back. if you want to end in down back position after the second tick start from up position and do 2 half circles and end in down back position.
the super can be done with 2 half circles forward ending in forward jump position or 2 half circles back ending in back jump position. you can control where you end your motion by starting the motion at different angles.
even though the game says you can do hawks super using the old 360 and 720 motions, I don’t’ think this is true. I think using the old commands will screw things up.
i see, i’ll give that a try. it’s weird that the 720 motion will work on a jump in, though.
The only way I know of to be able to do a 720 is by starting and ending in up. Otherwise, I’m pretty certain there’s no other way of doing it the old way. So with that being said, you cannot NE a Super in dowb+back in HDR. The closest you can get to being safe is doing :hcf:x2, and holding back while releasing punch. You’ll block standing.
No reversal i can think of hits low so why does that matter ?
Only actual reversal that hits low that I can think of is Cammy’s Super (I think).
But other than that, I don’t know how negligible it is that you can’t block in down+back.
you’re right jiggly, HDR doesn’t take the commands I suggested in my previous post. you end up jumping instead.
i guess i’m out of luck. aqua snack is able to safe negative edge the super off of a safe jab jump-in, i wonder exactly how he’s doing it.
I know how, I’ll show you in person. its pretty easy actually. hard to explain how ever.
we’ll put in some work in the lab tomorrow, i got some new shit to show you.
So I already knew Bison’s juggling MP bullshit rapes Hawk whenever he leaves the ground, but last night I was playing a really good Ryu (Ken Mexicano) that proved to me over and over that Ryu’s jumping MP has the same effect (beats Hawk’s jumping LP, hawkdive, etc). What do the Timothy Hawk masters do when they are playing Ryus that posses this knowledge? Kind of throws off my “neutral jump outside of sweep range until I get a good angle to dive” strategy.
Thankfully I rarely run into Ryus that know how handy that damn MP juggle is…
as tempting as jumping is, you’ll realize that putting out solid ground pressure is the way to go. bait that sweep and stuff those pokes. jump-ins are cool when you score a knockdown, preferably with a crossup, but hawk’s ground game is too sick. i win a lot more matches when i force myself not to be jump happy. you gotta make THEM feel uncomfortable being in your ground space.
I have a decent ground game with hawk, but against master zoners it is really damn hard to get in without dat hawk dive or neutral jump antics.
if you’re trying to dive on reaction to fireballs you gotta stay just outside of their jump arc. sounds obvious i guess. otherwise if you’re just outside of sweep range you have a lot of shit to stuff most everything they have. i throw out an occassional crouch strong for the guys that like to mash on hurricane. throwing out random ass roundhouse hurricanes seems to be a new trend.
St.MP, St.RH, and psychic DP through fireball are key against Ryu and Ken.