2015 UMVC3 SRK Tier/Theory Discussion. 7/10 First Page Tumblr: Power of snapback, Future power teams

[alejandrosh]

posting “smegma” beam should be a 1 day ban or something

[bloodabeast]

Serpentaurus what is up with the retarded move names?

please don’t ask cause there’s another nigga in this thread who does that exact same shit

[HyperShieldSlash]

I love you guys, making me feel special <3 I can’t wait till Smegma Beam users outnumber Missiles players… It’s just as derpy, but less characters get derpy confirms from it

[Ouroborus]

Who truly benefits from a maximum wesker dhc?
Damn near everyone corner carriers, so the damage will end up being ass.
Why would you ever waste 2 bars baiting a bionic arm? Not to mention whats stopping that Spencer from doing a dhc of his own?
Semi-safe isn’t safe, not to mention Wesker is putting his body out there.

because if you DHC at the very last frame into rhino charge, spencer can’t do anything. no x factor, no dhc out.

[CasualHero]

M.O.D.O.K - Spiderman - Dr Doom

Puts Thor She Hulk to shame

Spidey/MODOK/Dr. Doom is also gets in that ass.

I love it, it’s filthy.

[Raas]

You know what phoenix teams need to do to stay relevant imo. Phoenix teams are the ultimate momentum based teams. To stay relevant they need to BURN METER AND KILL CHARACTERS when they have an opportunity. The front shell should be able to TOD imo.
Does the opposing team have an anti phoenix character? Snap that fucker in and kill him. Phoenix is a nightmare anchor without level 5. You still get the headfuck factor of Phoenix if she’s getting close to level 5.

Yeah, sorry if this sounds dumb - but I wonder if there’s a better way to manage a phoenix team? Of course once she’s in there with level 5 and XF3 she can random out the whole game, but generally she’ll have to contend with other potential randomers or just flat out die on incoming/whatever tech.

So I was wondering - what if she was treated like other power up chars with the intention of getting her on point as soon as possible?

Say best case scenario you hit their first guy TAC into doom kill them with an infinite. 5 meters/done. Now she’s just holding back your team since you can’t ToD properly without putting yourself into a potential snap situation, run a greater risk of getting meter stolen, and while you’ve now streamlined their path you still give them an opportunity to set up with the getting meter/leveling/whatever you need. Something they get more chances at due to the reset nature of the phoenix teams. So why not just pull her in immediately? DP is supposedly one of the best chars in the game right? So P/DP + 2 assists should be fairly unblockable and if it botches you can have x/doom X factor or not and plenty of time to pull it back. I suspect if played right DP might force X-factors.

But that’s ideal, right? If you’re in that situation you’re sorta in a game to lose anyway. So more likely scenario, you get axed at the start of the round land a hit with doom and get close to 4 meters hopefully while killing their char. Swap in Phoenix(or better, does Doom have any safe tag setups?) use her with assist trying to run out their resources(XF2 Phoenix can still infinite right?) and then if it botches you have doom with or without XF with some decent meter probably playing a fair match against whoevers left. Plenty of comebacks have been made in that situation.

I just feel like Marvel already being so random and Phoenix in a way being the epitome of random, this seems more stable overall. Sorry, I don’t get to play a lot anymore so if there’s something glaring I’ve missed I’d love to hear it.

[GomuGomu]

lvl1 Frank is still way better than Iron Fist is. He has clean anti-airs, some tricky solo mixups, can combo from all of his throws, and has more ambiguous crossups with an assist. The point wasn’t that a great player can use him and be successful, the point is that lvl1 Frank has just enough if you pick your moments carefully he has the option you need to get your hit

Level 1 Frank is not better that Iron Fist lol. Iron Fist has better go to buttons, better damage, better mixups, and the only throw he cannot combo from is a forward throw at super jump height.

[Kef]

posting “smegma” beam should be a 1 day ban or something

dat Don Ramon avatar.

[LegendaryDJ]

I know Serp didn’t just compare Thor to the magic from Kingdom Hearts. I know I did not just read that. You can no longer call yourself a Thor player or a Thor fan. I’m revoking it.

[Discarnate]

I know Serp didn’t just compare Thor to the magic from Final Fantasy. I know I did not just read that. You can no longer call yourself a Thor player or a Thor fan. I’m revoking it.

FTFY.

KH is good

for a party game

Spoiler

[Steelguttey]

FTFY.

Melee is good

for a party game

Spoiler

FTFY

[Nos99]

Who truly benefits from a maximum wesker dhc?

Everybody does when it does that stupid crossup-out-nowhere thing and gets free damage. I’ve seen wesker users just throw it out there and win matches because of it (especially if they xfactor or DHC to continue)

Happy accident sure, but it’s something. shrug

[serpentaurus]

I know Serp didn’t just compare Thor to the magic from Kingdom Hearts. I know I did not just read that. You can no longer call yourself a Thor player or a Thor fan. I’m revoking it.

lol those were some final fantasy 7 magics. SOV + Okami shuffle THC is 2013 tetra-disaster

Spoiler

[media=youtube]sylZ9A5FlWA[/media]

and both are mid tier

/retarded comments

[Discarnate]

FTFY

Spoiler

You know you want this shit at your party
[media=youtube]ZNMX988Xqi8[/media]

Anyways, catching up on the thread, some Frank Wests do well on stream all of a sudden hes god tier. Show people endless amounts of Viper Tech shes still ass, show people ridiculous Dante meter build combos, mixups, tools, hes still ass. Thor has an airdash, flight mode, scarce at best results, and an elbow and hes GDLK.

I can’t even.

EDIT: What was I thinking. We should just tier characters based on effort needed.

[VASaga]

Spidey/MODOK/Dr. Doom is also gets in that ass.

I love it, it’s filthy.

Yeah, its one of the endgame teams for M.O.D.O.K for sure.
Once M.O.D.O.K zones you into a corner, its a wrap. You are eating a killer illumination or an ultimate web throw if he has 2 bars. It’ll = death.

Webball is also underated as an assist but it def works magic for M.O.D.O.K. Its so great because webball comes out really late and well behind the point character so it interupts rushdown.

Spiderman & M.O.D.O.K are gonna be late rising high tier characters.

[HyperShieldSlash]

Thor is GODlike.

[LTP]

While I LOVE me some jamming bomb. If you touch a character it’s better to kill them. What’s worse than a jammed character? A living one. In the realm of welcoming mixups in todays day an age you might as well be jammed. Good luck guessing. If the opponent manages to touch the ground they can always team hyper to screw wait out the jam. In other news Magneto is fast with a superior option select, as much as I like DOK/Missiles. Magneto/Missiles is much more effective due to the sheer speed and option select of it.

Too bad if the pushblock is done a certain MODOK suffers from a RIDICULOUS pushblock glitch. Truth be told I’d still rather block MODOK than Magneto anyday. Magneto practically always has a free high/low if he’s close to you. Characters like Magneto can standing L MOST of MODOKS approaches easily if it’s not covered.

If armored moves weren’t attached to ass characters in general in this game I’d say the blaster feature is a benefit. Being at 0 on block isn’t necessarily a good thing when everyone else has faster normals than you. Crouching M. is a nice touch to stop straight forward approaches however. Bombs however if not covered are just asking to be punished with ridiculously slow start up. Barrier has its utility, but it’s also the bane of MODOK. Some attacks will actually go through it at the right rotation. Not to mention he can’t cancel the animation.

Definite point for DOK. Magneto with the right team does excellent versus DOK however with magnetic blasts and I can’t count how many times I’ve done Psionic Blas* DISRUPTERED then continued to get my assist punished with a shockwave pray the DHC isn’t strong.

This I can give DOK and one of the reasons why I hope one day my ass or someone else can actually show this stuff off. I think however that the strongest DOK teams have very REAL counters with teams sporting many of the 10 top points.

And Dok gives up what for all of this? The inability to chicken block and bad get off me options in a game that’s all about avoiding those situations, and in a game with alpha counters, dumb grabs, and snapbacks. If you were forced to block as Dok, the odds of survival with another character is going to be more or less the same against a competent opponent. Not to mention that Dok has some of the best tools to avoid those situations right from the start of the round.

Unfortunately I still don’t see it. The ability to just fucking do it is to strong in this game. Ironically, DOK is much more of a thinking mans character in a very reactionary game. So many setups with DOK while Magneto can just flail around like an idiot with easy OS and conversions.

Jamming into a snapback is still a very good strategy, and allows for more user error while disrupting team synergy. If you want to maul through a team in order, you can’t make mistakes, and if you do, you’re going to be facing an anchor your opponent always uses versus their point character as anchor. Also, saying that leaving a character alive can be a disaster, as implied in your statements, contradicts your next couple statements saying the incoming character is also virtually dead. The opponent can’t THC on incoming for a good while either while jammed, and will be on the anchor slot, making it very easy to punish. It seems like you’re referring to simply jamming the opponent and not snapping, which I agree really isn’t necessary with the unblockable reset and ToDs, though it still makes for nasty resets.

The pushblock glitch is unfortunate if you want to rushdown, but in most pushblock situations, you’re going to be reverting back to zoning anyway. Perhaps it can be seen as a grace in a sense.

People are still get blown up by characters like Hulk, so I consider it a plus. The likelihood of doing a L cube point blank without assist coverage is little, and even if you do, you can buffer a grounded air dash up back or go for a throw. I agree that you should NEVER use bombs or barriers without assist coverage (though bombs in the air can be ok depending on the matchup), which should be gotten out with blasters or cubes. You can get a barrier out on pushblocks though.

The Magneto vs Dok matchup is interesting, but I’ll explore that another time on the Dok forums when I can put together an in depth analysis. Both characters certainly have tools to deal with one another.

I’ll be honest, I find myself hard pressed to find a matchup that I don’t like with point Dok backed with strong assists anymore (like EoA and missiles). Perhaps it’s due to by inability to go out to events, and the rare times I do, I run a train through most everybody (given I can use a 360 pad). The only ones I found problematic are Vergil, Hawkeye, Strider, and Skrull, but after I explored those characters thoroughly, not only do I feel comfortable fighting them, I found ways to shut down a lot of their seemingly good options of getting in on Dok (given good assists). I’m not trying to say Dok is the best, but that something like Dok/(Strange or Dorm)/Doom is certainly competitive and are strong teams (albeit front heavy… though I believe that provides more consistency than most team constructions). If you could list some potential counter teams, I’d be happy to explore them.

[Zansam]

Spoiler

You know you want this shit at your party
[media=youtube]ZNMX988Xqi8[/media]

Anyways, catching up on the thread, some Frank Wests do well on stream all of a sudden hes god tier. Show people endless amounts of Viper Tech shes still ass, show people ridiculous Dante meter build combos, mixups, tools, hes still ass. Thor has an airdash, flight mode, scarce at best results, and an elbow and hes GDLK.

I can’t even.

EDIT: What was I thinking. We should just tier characters based on effort needed.

Oh come now it shouldn’t be surprising. Same thing happened with Nova when Infrit took 2nd at EVO. People argue all the time that results don’t matter but the theory thread always goes abuzz when a lesser used character places well. I saw it coming. I’m with WorstPlayer though, the Frank discussion was fun/interesting on hearing some people’s opinions but I’m getting tired of correcting people and hearing all this crazy Frank talk on both sides of the fence. Be careful what you wish for I guess…

Regarding this top 10 in each slot stuff, it’s interesting but I think it’s very much a forest from the trees thing. Looking at who goes where is important, but how to put them together is equally (or perhaps more) important.

[WorstPlayer]

Jamming into a snapback is still a very good strategy, and allows for more user error while disrupting team synergy. If you want to maul through a team in order, you can’t make mistakes, and if you do, you’re going to be facing an anchor your opponent always uses versus their point character as anchor. Also, saying that leaving a character alive can be a disaster, as implied in your statements, contradicts your next couple statements saying the incoming character is also virtually dead. The opponent can’t THC on incoming for a good while either while jammed, and will be on the anchor slot, making it very easy to punish. It seems like you’re referring to simply jamming the opponent and not snapping, which I agree really isn’t necessary with the unblockable reset and ToDs, though it still makes for nasty resets.

The pushblock glitch is unfortunate if you want to rushdown, but in most pushblock situations, you’re going to be reverting back to zoning anyway. Perhaps it can be seen as a grace in a sense.

People are still get blown up by characters like Hulk, so I consider it a plus. The likelihood of doing a L cube point blank without assist coverage is little, and even if you do, you can buffer a grounded air dash up back or go for a throw. I agree that you should NEVER use bombs or barriers without assist coverage (though bombs in the air can be ok depending on the matchup), which should be gotten out with blasters or cubes. You can get a barrier out on pushblocks though.

The Magneto vs Dok matchup is interesting, but I’ll explore that another time on the Dok forums when I can put together an in depth analysis. Both characters certainly have tools to deal with one another.

I’ll be honest, I find myself hard pressed to find a matchup that I don’t like with point Dok backed with strong assists anymore (like EoA and missiles). Perhaps it’s due to by inability to go out to events, and the rare times I do, I run a train through most everybody (given I can use a 360 pad). The only ones I found problematic are Vergil, Hawkeye, Strider, and Skrull, but after I explored those characters thoroughly, not only do I feel comfortable fighting them, I found ways to shut down a lot of their seemingly good options of getting in on Dok (given good assists). I’m not trying to say Dok is the best, but that something like Dok/(Strange or Dorm)/Doom is certainly competitive and are strong teams (albeit front heavy… though I believe that provides more consistency than most team constructions). If you could list some potential counter teams, I’d be happy to explore them.

You ran a train through everyone at a major? Seriously?
(Not that I don’t think you’re not good, you’re a lot better than me.)

Take some of the likely suspects top tier teams against DOK and tell me what you think.
Start with trenchcoats, various DMC setups and Doomy/Ammy Shells. You can start with
Magneto/Doom. Feel free to discuss it here. This is good fodder as to why people may want
to reconsider MODOK for top tier.

I do think there is a distinct disparity however in general casual play and tournament play. Primarily in terms of movement. If you suck at movement DOK will fucking murder you. If I find a player whose got their movement though air plinking, yipes style wave dashing, solid air throw game. DOK gets ripped.

Sides, I’m hijacking this Frank talk

[tick_tock]

I love you guys, making me feel special <3 I can’t wait till Smegma Beam users outnumber Missiles players… It’s just as derpy, but less characters get derpy confirms from it

It gets beaten clean by disruptor. Disruptors startup is so much faster that you never get plasma beam off. It’s the one thing that keeps plasma from being a tip top tier assist. Also, Iron man’s beam is a lot better for a lot of characters bc it leaves the character standing for combos and has better hitstun. Seriously, Iron man’s beam is one of the best in the game. It’s so damn good for a character like X23 or wolverine.