Say we both agree women need more heroes to look up to in SF than they currently have, I still don’t see how a womens only tournament will improve that situation. I think we just need a woman with some balls, like this Rui Naiwei, to get really good (I can’t imagine she got interested by some goofy event like this). I don’t think someone timid enough to need a womens only tournament to pull them into the scene is going to be someone who will someday be womping on fools in the main tournament.
I have a feeling you’re completely pulling this out of your ass because I can think of like dozens of interest groups who, as a whole, dislike the idea of transgendered people, getting sex changes, cross-dressing, playing opposite-gender roles, etc more. Feminist groups for the most part are interested in human rights and things like that. Honestly anyone who gives a shit about women’s rights at all is technically feminist, so saying that feminists are trans-hating, no bra-wearing, hairy-legged man-haters is a sweeping generalization. If you want to hate on feminists go ahead but you sound like an idiot saying stuff like “SRK totally showed up those bitch feminists by allowing trans people to enter this tournament”… come on now.
Agreed. Though I have to agree with Pherai, holding a girls only tournament isn’t going to do that.
You really think the only reason there are less female players than males in the FGC is because they don’t realize it’s possible to become good? I think the actual reason is because they’re just plain not interested. Video games are fun for us but not everyone feels that way. I’m not interested in monster trucks, and if they had an all-girls monster truck event I still wouldn’t be.
Honestly if you want to help girls and guys “realize” there are girls who play games, all you have to do is get chocoblanka out here, have her enter the real SSFIV tournament, and you’re set. But that’s still not going to make girls play to become pros. Having that sort of ambition comes from a lot more than just watching a video of a fellow female giving a beatdown.
I’m having a really hard time imagining this tournament turning different results.
I think I should have worded what I said better. I was referring to the video I posted, where Weirdgonzo “put a pro (Bronson) in losers” by beating him in winners. If you really think the misenterpreted idea of having pros play losers in a girls tournament is a good idea… all I have to say is I think it’d probably be a complete waste of a pro player’s time. There are pro Tekken players in my area and every time I play them I figure I’m completely wasting their time (and I’m pretty sure I am). I do it anyway because it’s a great learning experience for me, but I do it sparingly. Jumping into a pool of sharks isn’t a good idea when you barely even know how to swim.
I’m not going to respond to the rest of what you wrote because I already feel like I’ve completely wasted my own time responding to what I already have. You don’t seem to have any experience with this sort of thing or have a clue what you’re talking about and you make these generalizations about women that make me wonder how many women in this community you’ve actually discussed this issue with.
A lot of girls aren’t interested in fighting games not because they’re “too afraid to play with boys” or “don’t think it’s possible for them to reach the level of guys” but because they’re just plain not interested. I’m actually kind of offended that you think girls need to be coddled in order to gain some courage.
jimmy: (jumps out from behind super yans computer screen) HEY GIRLFRIEND!
super yan: what the fuck, how did you. who the fuck are you!?
jimmy1200: GIRLFRIEND YOU CRAAAZY! 
(jimmy has a huge smile on his face) what you doin tonight?
super yan: just posting on srk, hating men even more everyday, especially men on srk. you know, these fucks…(gets cut off by jimmy)
jimmy1200: i have a bleached asshole (huge grin continues)
super yan: …
(always sunny intro music plays)
ha ha. im bored, and not angry today. i feel good!
This thread needs more…
u__________________________________________u
i think the most depressing thing i have seen so far is the fact that two of you guys agreed that this tournament is just as insulting a slavery seriously even though i have taken it way out of context wtf
in all honesty, WHO THE FUCK CARES.
do you guys realize you are practically writing essays defending this girl tourney. How about people just STFU and let the girls play.
Everybody thinks this tournament is either disrecpectful, lame, stupid, humiliating. Do you really think EVO staff is running this tourney to do all those things to girls? no.
Everybody just stop bitching already.
Well, having brought up the example of go, Rui Naiwei is the extreme example - a female player who is better than all but a handful of men who ever lived.
But, there are also women-only go tournaments, and what they have helped to do is establish a more general female presence in the game as professionals who play and teach the game for a living. That doesn’t mean that these women dominate the top men - but still, being professionals produced by their system, they show levels of skill at the game greater than all but the top male professionals, and certainly better than any amateur. Perhaps I focused on Rui Naiwei too much - reason I brought her up is that she’s beyond ‘skilled professional’ - she’s better than all but a short,s short list of players in the entire history of the game.
I keep coming back to the go analogy, because although there are huge differences between the Asian go scene and our SF scene, there are also parallels - in that it’s a field that requires a highly specialized degree of skill to become extremely successful at a competitive level, and there seem to be no gender-based differences in terms of one’s inherent potential to be awesome at it.
the thing that the go world has done, particularly in Japan, in order to try to get more women involved in the game, is the establishment of ‘rengo’ tournaments - ie pair go - in which one male and one female are teamed up to play the game (they take turns alternating moves, with no verbal communication allowed…sorta like duplicate bridge)
One consequence the establishment of rengo tournaments has had, is that it has forced men who wish to participate to take a keen interest in the health of the female game and the strength of the female players…and it’s that keen interest that our scene needs to reproduce, I believe. Perhaps pair SF events of some sort would help to establish more strong female players in this way - because then it would be in the interest of the men to help the women ‘level up’ as best they can…
again, i’m in favour of having the women’s division @ Evo and think it’s a great idea. But perhaps a pair event would get better results for the overall growth of the game by forcing the guys to take a more active interest in helping the women they’re paired with, and could help our scene to produce a genuine Strongest Woman in the World!
A lot of people do.
Cool story sis.
Interesting discussion here IMO actually, though it is probably all for nothing.
I just wanted to point out that this analogy is not accurate, for a lot of reasons (sarcasm?).
-Literally, giving spots in the tournament =/= giving a separate tournament. The analogy would be for SBO to have a separate foreigners-only tournament, or for evo to reserve spots in the semi-finals of the main ssf4 draw for the top placers in the women’s tournament.
-SBO is a competition first and foremost, and reserving spots in their draw is pro-competitive. It makes SBO a true international championship, and if/when non-japanese competition becomes significant, provides a way for them to get to SBO without risking the expense of flying out to japan for the last-chance crapshoot. A women’s side event accomplishes none of these things. There is no significant women’s fighting community that is not represented or has difficulty getting into evo. Competitively, the women’s event has no merit whatsoever. The only theoretical benefit is in the form of some “community building,” which is dubious to begin with (like saying “we need more of x race playing fighting games”), and we can only speculate that it helps to accomplish even that.
-I seriously doubt the SBO organizers actually care about giving motivation to foreigners, and I doubt competing in SBO adds much motivation for anybody really to level up in a game. I imagine SBO cares about making SBO hype, and bringing in “the best players from around the world” makes things hype for everybody.
Basically, I agree with what people have already said in response to your post–some people do care and don’t mind responding in paragraph format to make their points. (If you have a problem with reading said paragraphs, then don’t.)
And besides, passively reading through the disgusting amounts of text already devoted to this discussion doesn’t really help people I think–if people themselves want to engage in the discussion at hand to get a better grip on what other people are saying and what THEY themselves are actually saying, more power to them.
There’s no way this tourney is sexist towards females. Are they being put on display to be laughed at due to sub par skill levels? Well if thats the case then any serious female player will recognize this as an extra opportunity for more $$$. After all, it’ll probably end up being everyone’s girlfriends vs eachother. The key word here is opportunity, which these girls have been given in abundance. I mean cmon, you can enter TWO ssf4 tourneys?!
If you feel offended at the prospect of being treated like you “can’t hang with the boys,” then you clearly aren’t seeing the bigger picture.
Are they being put on display to be laughed at for sub par skill levels? No. Are they being put on display? Yes. I think you are the one who is having trouble seeing the bigger picture. If a girl wants a chance to shine and show her skills, or she just wants to enter for fun, that’s a great thing for the community—so enter the real tournament. Judging by similar tournaments and tournaments like this in the past, this is going to be a huge step backwards for not only girls in the community, but the FGC as a whole. Obviously this is just my prediction. The fact is that nobody knows what kind of results this tournament will give. I could be wrong, it could encourage a lot of girls to enter the scene and play fighting games seriously just as a lot of guys do. Or it could end up with a lot of girls being offended by comments made and not learning anything from the experience… OR it could be a mix of the two (more girls playing but not for love of the game but for attention). The fact is, nobody knows how this is going to end up, this thread is full of speculation and opinions and I think the thread is still open because those different ideas are worth reading, even your own which I completely disagree with.
As for “giving opportunities”… some of us recognize the difference between being given an opportunity and being “babied”… this seems more like the latter that’s why some people have a problem with it, myself included. It’s about sincerity.
this tournament is like separate but equal: not cool (although here even though the girls/blackpeople have to use a different bus, they are allowed to get on the boys/white bus too, and in fact, are required to ride on the boys/white bus before being allowed to get on their separate but equal girl/black bus)
reserving a few spots for girls in the top few brackets at evo would be like: affirmative action (a decent idea until the playing field is equal, at which point it should stop)
NOTE: i am not equating racism with the evo tournament, i am using it as an illustration for example purposes only.
NOTE 2: if you hate affirmative action, take it up with the US Supreme Court, I’m not on it, so don’t bitch about it to me
Don’t bring it up as a “decent idea” if you only plan to use a scapegoat to escape criticism. That’s hella weak
I personally agree with affirmative action (in limited scope, i generally accept the way it currently functions, but worry it might be scaled back too soon). Were I on the supreme court I would agree with them about it as well.
Satisfied?
ya haha
I’d argue its a poor idea to give the winners of the ladies tournament a bracket spot in Evo, but since thats not even happening, I don’t feel like introducing yet another tangential argument into this thread
good call, i was just trying to point out the examples, not necessarily saying it should be done or trying to sidetrack this already volatile discussion.
holy shit jus had to see the thread for myself since Rom said that this hella blew up and people are really serious about this…oh yea this it Hargi, Hi Miranda and Rom lol
Girls love the idea. Why bother?