d3v image quoting? Who will police the police‽
Only it is. Which was one of the bigger points this thread made.
Regardless of what the standards might be this month, I don’t always want to use some stupid ass layout.
A good example would be my MVS cabinets not suddenly ceasing to exist when the standard changed.
There is a difference between the “lowered A” the MVS cabs had and…
BCD
A
I get that these games are played this way now when they’re tossed in a candy cab. I also get that playing with that layout isn’t for me. If i only have six buttons, I get the latter layout (nope.avi) or the “right hand at comically exaggerated angle” layout. With 8 buttons, I can pass on both.
Just to attack this from another angle, can someone explain to me why anyone would be upset about an extra two buttons on their stick? Is there a good reason for wanting a six button only stick?
Except that even back in the 90’s Neo-Geo games were running on that layout (dedicated MVS cabs are the exception, not the rule). Arcades weren’t suddenly changing the panels on their Astros/Egrets/Impress cabs just for NG games. Heck, even the 1L4B 4 button VS City top panel kit from Seimitsu is simply a 6 button panel with the bottom right two buttons plugged up.
From an aesthetic standpoint, 6-buttons just look more elegant than 8. There’s also the fact (as we’ve been pointing out) that 6-buttons is just plain more authentic. This ties in to the fact that, thanks to their arcade roots, all fighting games are designed to work within the 6-button framework.
Then there’s the fact that some of the most beautiful arcade sticks ever made (e.g. the Virtua Stick High Grade and the old Namco are 6 button) sticks.
8-buttons is fine…
When you put 2 on the side! 
personally, its aesthetics. I find it visually cluttered, a conflict in design, especially when I know 90% of the arcade/fighting/shmup games out there don’t even use all 8, hell, apart from capcom games, most don’t use all 6 either, but we highly consider their (capcom games) importance, so 6 button is perfect. They say simple is best, and 6-button is simpler in my opinion.
But yeah… the industry is not necessarily basing their products and designs on the ‘real arcade experience’ anymore, but more on comfort and efficiency of the player in a home/portable setting.
It also depends on the aim of the product. First you have sticks like Exaprize and Hori EX2, they trimmed it down to the basics because they are what they are, entry level or compact joysticks. Then you get a specialty stick like the Virtua Stick High Grade, it’s 6 button because that’s Sega’s own design on the Lindhberg cabinet, and they wanted to implement that novelty on a consumer joystick.
And then you get to Madcatz TE’s, Real Arcade Pro’s, VLX’s, V.S., Eightarcs, etc. What’s the first thing you think of when you see these arcade sticks? Quality, Premium, Top-of-the-Line, etc. These joysticks are toted as the best money can buy, they come with the best parts possible, they have the heft and weight that comes with the price tag, and lots of options. Options like cable compartments, easy access for repair/customization/retrofitting, Turbo/Auto-fire, and lastly 8 Buttons. 8-button is just another feature of a ‘quality’ joystick these days, because it gives you more options. you can either make use of it in which ever which way you please (ghost buttons, shortcuts, etc) , Or you can use holeplugs and get rid of them (this is very much apparent in joysticks like Qanbas and VLX which usually come with holeplugs, Qanba even went out of their way by making matching colored plugs)
This discussion is never gonna settle on one thing, it’s just like sanwa vs seimitsu, if there’s something that bothers you or want a true arcade experience, especially these days with home consumer arcade sticks that are very customize-able and can be retrofitted as you please, then just do something about it. Today are great times as arcade game enthusiasts because of all the resources we have now.
Last Neo Geo Layout post from me.
SNK wasn’t even consistent with their own layout for it.
Spoiler
Edit better pic
Spoiler
I’m not sure I’m buying aesthetics as the catch-all reason for this resistance to eight button layouts.
The eight button layout lets us look backwards and forwards. Everyone gets the layout they want, and games can move to eight button setups if they so desire.
Give me just one other good reason for the diehard six button love that isn’t aesthetics.
I don’t have to go in options to take off Punchx3 Kickx3.
The existence of non-functional buttons creates the possibility of making a mistake and pressing on the extra buttons unintentionally. I made that mistake on a tournament match once (pressed on the extra button when I actually wanted HP), and it ultimately led to me going home with nothing instead of winning some cash. I haven’t touched an 8-button stick in a serious tournament setting since.
I believe a self infraction is in order.
You saw nothing.
Besides, there’s technically no “infraction” system on the boards at the moment.
I bet if analog sticks were added to retail sticks we’d start defending them as well. Might as well play some COD if I’m going to spend $200 on a controller!
Agreed. I also find it tiring to reach for the non-face buttons. So many games have Select/Back or Start bound to useful stuff in training mode. I propose the following 12-button layout.
[Hm][Se][St][Sh]
[LP][MP][HP][BS]
[LK][MK][HK][BS]
You’d need 3 sticks, 1 digital, 2 analog. And might was well add triggers to that shizz.
That layout might actually be useful for people who use select to plink jabs/shorts in SSFIV.
I wire null-plink layout this way:
[Se][LP][MP][HP]
[Se][LK][MK][HK]
All I know is this; I cant play on an arch. Fucks up my button awareness. And I cant do 8 buttons. If I turn off the last 2, my hands go to them for the firece attacks anyway. Conversely, if I turn off the first 2, my hands still go there for light attacks. It fucks me up and people steal wins all day when I’m forced to use JP/arched/8 button sticks.
When I had a SE and TE, I opted for 6-across. If I needed the removed buttons for UI, I used a pad. Then again, since I dont prefer stick, I’d end up using the pad to play, after a dropped combo, missed super, ect, anyway. LOL.
I would probably only buy a TE, if I had to have a stick again. Along with the SE, Its the only stick that doesnt have to be plugged for 6 buttons which means aesthetics are retained, and can have them in a straight row. There is some other kind of stick I’ve seen, its white/blue/mirrors finish that has the possible 6 across if plugged, but with its face, I think it needs actual plugs.
And for SNK games, I can only do 2 top/2 Bottom setup. The Tilt from years ago had that setup for their SNK showcase cab. I cant even form a combo on SNK actual setup. Somehow, with my 6 button stick, I can play 4 button games without hitting the 2 unmapped buttons. Weird because I cant play a 6 button game with 8.
Wonder who has this stick, and what it looks like now. LOL.
I know a guy who plays marvel like this.
[L] [M] [H] [1]
[S] [blank] [blank] [2]
8 button also works for those that want one stick and play both SF and Mortal Kombat.
[blank] [hp] ** [hk]
[r] [lp] [blank [lk] with “r” being run in the games that support it.
There is the occasional player that uses a strange layout, and for that, 8 buttons prove more useful. Plugs are cheap, and a new plexi is easy to install. Drilling new holes is a bit more of a pain, and it wouldn’t work on every stick. 8 buttons is there because it is better to have an option than have none at all. Think about it, most of our cars can probably drive at 120mph, but at the end of the day, do we really need it? Nope, but the option is there in case we want to go that fast, to do something out of the ordinary. That is why sticks have 8 buttons.
I still have the raw .PSD for that.
For me, it’s all about comfort and what you are used to. It doesn’t matter to me if it’s 2, 4, 6 or 8 buttons, it’s all the same to me. I have seen a few people post in this thread about hitting dummy buttons on an 8 button stick. I personally don’t understand this. When I was in high school, I took typing courses and one of the first things they teach you is to not move your hands. I apply this to my stick use. I rest my hand in the “home” position and don’t move it. From there, I have trained my fingers to know where the buttons are without looking. This is what I was taught and how I trained. Obviously, not everyone trains the same way, I’m just throwing my two cents in. I think that it is because of this that the 8-button sticks are the “standard”. You can set your 4 fingers on the top row and have the thumb on the first button of the second row and from there you can manipulate all 8 buttons without moving your entire hand, just the finger that corresponds to the button you need.
I understand there are those that are more comfortable with the 6-button layout and that is perfectly fine. It does seem that 6-button sticks are going the way of the dinasaur tho as there seems to be less dedicated 6-button sticks around. It does suck but the times keep on changing I suppose…
For me, that is pretty much what it boils down to. It is not really an aesthetic thing (though I do think 6 or less is usually prettier). I got used to a 6 button layout in the arcades and at home. I rest the side of my hand to the left of HP and HK. For me that layout feels the most natural and comfortable, and the other buttons feel like clutter and can be distracting. That said, I can play fine on 8, I just don’t prefer it.