and 12 out ranks him… how?
everything you said 12 has way worse.
This is always the rallying of people who think Sean is decent. The only thing good about him is his shoto normals. Think about why you think Sean is a poking character. Is it because he has really great pokes like Chun, or is it because its too dangerous to try to combo into any of his specials because they do piss poor damage, are not hit confirmable, and are several punishable. Seans pokes are maybe as good as the other shotos, none of which are really poke characters. Just because his normals are the only somewhat safe things he has doesn’t make him a poke character.
@bigvador:
If you think hadou burst is anywhere near as good as shippu, then you really don’t understand the game.
his sa3 is hit confirmable with c.mp stand close. hk
his sa2 is confirmable with standing close mp.
and thers the short short combo which is confirmable 0_o
his moves are confirmable.
@bigvador:
If you think hadou burst is anywhere near as good as shippu, then you really don’t understand the game.
[/quote]
i never said that the hado burst is better then the shinpu u must have miss read what i said its like the shinpu its not better dddaaaaaa it seems like u take me for a rookie
Okay, lets see: Twelve vs. Sean
A crappy jump - uhhhh…air dash? one of the highest jumps in the game?
The worst normals of all the shotos - his pokes are one of his strongest points, and he has good max-range moves as well (standing roundhouse)
The worst mixups in the game - sean’s are worse.
His dragon punch loses to throws -N/A
Lands crouching from his special moves, even ex, so he gets extra-hurt when messing up - Twelve doesnt land crouching from SA1, his only realistic SA choice.
No usable non-ex special moves - N.D.L. , A.X.E…
Poor ability to deal damage without ex attacks or supers - twelve MIGHT lose on this one
No ability to punish a whiffed, blocked, or parried attack without ex attacks or supers - Twelve’s crouching roundhouse is decent for this.
Difficulty building meter for ex attacks and supers - Twelve’s Cr.MP is an excellent meter-builder.
Only Alex and maybe Twelve have a worse super choice - Twelve’s SA1 is better than anything sean has.
I won a round at tournament recently with sean everyone laughed. Because i pulled out a sean roll cancel into hyper tornado =X
Sean just doesnt have options.He has low priority so unless you play one hell of a mix up game(which is how i play sean) you will probably just own you computer
None of you mentioned the rolL!!!
a crappy jump - uh… sean’s super jump is just shy of twelve’s super jump and yet you call it crappy.
worst poke of all shotos- normals are almost the same, stand mk stuffs out alot of things and moves forward. stand hp better range than ryu’s and hits crouching opponents. f.hk good agaisnt urien Q and hugo, unpunishable from far, can use as cross up, and good agaisnt jumpers. lk spin kick makes a great poke and it hits crouching characters.
worst mix ups in the game - besides having no fire ball, he has the most mixups of all shotos. twelve has a couple (and almost all of them require fly to start)
his dragon punch loses to throws - it does but its still hard to time it. if I input low dragon smash before you input throw youl get hit.
lands crouching from his moves. - true but only for a split second and it takes timing to hit him while he is in his crouch form. (twelves air move ends in crouch also. even ex)
no usable non ex moves - roll , sean tackle , lk spin kick, banana kick once in a while.
poor ability to dmg without ex moves - everybody is like this. yang does crappy dmg so he relies on his ex mantis. urien relies on ageis and good charge timing.
yun needs his genie jin, ibuki does low dmg also… etc.
no ability to punish whiff block or parried attack. - Sean has a trip also. parry into stand hp, dragon smash.( like other shotos) or begin mix ups. what else do ryu and ken have?
difficulty for building meter for ex or supers. - umm… sean’s cr.mp is way faster than twelve’s cr.mp so twelve has a crappy method to build bar.
bad super choice- agreed, but he relies on his ex’s like yang and alex(maybe even ryu). and he is able to universal shoto hit confirm (cr. lk lk) at least.
why are people arguing with this guy? lol.
:xeye:
I didnt write that list…It was posted up above, and I added the Twelve vs. Sean comparisons.
lol oops my bad il edit it out.
edit: I dont really know what to edit.
so you still think twelve is still better ranking than sean?
Definitely. Both of them are extremely challenging to play, but the difference is that Twelve has far more unique moves. The majority of sean’s moves, with the excpetion of a select few (roll, SAs…), are the same as ken or ryu’s. Twelve’s moves are unique, and some of them are very cool. And, Twelve has arguably the best mobility in 3S, the highest grab priority of any character, and at least 1 useful super.
Look at high-level tournaments: You see at least a couple Twelve players who play competetively in high-class play (Yamazaki, Chikyuu…), but you don’t see a single Sean anywhere.
well its probably because they go with the mindset, why play with sean when I could choose ryu or ken?
im pretty sure if somebody like daigo or whatever starting beating some people with sean, his rank would go up.
yeah I was playing twelve today to prove some points, and his animations are so kool 0_o
I remember hearing that there are plenty of Sean players in Japan, but they never get anywhere. If anyone started winning with Sean, people might start thinking higher of him, but no one ever has. You’d think after 8 years of this game, at least 1 Sean player would make a name of himself, but it hasn’t happened. Theres only no names on here saying hes a poke character with a good mixup. Take your Sean to Evo this year and see how far that mixup gets you.
I’m not really gonna argue, just gonna say stuff, take it or leave it.
Sean’s jump is crappy because it’s so tall and floaty, almost like Necro’s but without the drills and good air normals. It can’t be compared with Twelve’s air dash, which is something entirely different and, despite the fact that he can’t parry while air dashing, is way, way better than anything Sean has.
Sean’s standing forward, standing roundhouse, standing fierce, toward+roundhouse, and toward+fierce (in short, all of his different normals) are all worse than the comparable normals the other shotos have. Ken’s normals are awesome, Ryu’s and Akuma’s are still really good and Sean’s are way below that. And unlike those guys, who can use their normals as pokes but can also use them to combo into bigger and better things, Sean’s stuck with just using them as pokes. His crouching roundhouse is slower for some reason, even.
He has the fewest mixups, and this isn’t debatable; I’m really not sure how anyone would think he has the most. Are you counting roll/dash grab tricks? Because you shouldn’t be, they’re nearly useless. Are you counting axe kick shenanigans? You shouldn’t be, because anyone decent can parry them on reaction. His toward+fierce is probably the slowest overhead in the game and can’t be comboed from. His throw range is horrible and he usually has no dangerous combo to make his opponents choose to play it safe and block. And unless you have super, and unless the super you have can actually be comboed into from a distance or after confirming, then his basic crouching short or forward/close standing roundhouse/uoh games won’t deal damage and won’t scare anyone. And chances are you’re not going to have more than one bar of anything, meaning that if you do land a super, you go back to having nothing scary at all.
With the exception of Twelve, nobody has as hard a time dealing damage without meter as Sean does. Yang’s regular slashes still deal good damage and set up another mixup; Urien’s pokes are very damaging and let him space well; Yun can still deal damage without Genei Jin and has excellent mobility anyway; Ibuki does great damage and stun and virtually all of her combos lead to new mixups. Everyone else can not only deal damage more reliably, but they can set up new opportunities for mixups all the time and those mixups they set up are more dangerous.
Punishing well doesn’t mean doing a crouching roundhouse; when that’s your best way to punish, you know you have a bad character. Everyone else (except Twelve) can do some combo or some big damage attack; without super, Sean can’t. If you parry something, great, you can punish, but depending on parry is not a way you can win.
Sean has a hard time building meter because he can’t use his special moves or do combos, which are the two best ways to build meter. Even when he does use his special moves, they don’t build much meter, and even when he combos it’s at most two hits without using ex/super, and two-hit combos don’t build much meter.
Sean and Twelve are both crappy, but Twelve is still a usable crappy. His air dash gives him much better mobility and mixups. It lets him set up throws and combos, it lets him get of bad situations, it provides mixups, it lets him press the attack or run away better, etc. His ground normals are also on a similar level as Sean’s, that is, they’re decent, but Twelve has way better air attacks. His special moves are also totally usable and actually not bad, and he builds meter better than Sean because he can build meter in the air or using his specials. In short, Twelve is at least even with Sean in almost every respect, and in many he’s definitely superior.
Look, there’s a reason you see people using every character other than Sean in high-level tournaments, and it’s not because people don’t use him. One of my friends lives in Japan and plays 3S there and he says lots of people use Sean and they’re really good with him – but that they either don’t use him in tournaments or they do use him and never get anywhere. People have been playing this game for nearly a decade now, and what, after however comparatively short period of time you’ve played it you’ve discovered something so radically different about Sean that you’ve made him into a viable character? Come on. You don’t think that people have figured out and tested just about everything possible with him? You don’t think way more talented and way more experienced people have tried to use him in tournaments before? I mean, it’s a pretty egotistical claim, saying people who call Sean bad just aren’t as good as you.
Also, I played in the Bay Area for years, and I don’t know who this tournament was with, but it sure wasn’t with anyone who’s played in the scene there for any period of time. I know how people play there, and they play well.
Realmente no voy a discutir, apenas yendo a decir la materia, a tomarla o a dejarla.
El salto de Sean es crappy porque es tan alto y floaty, casi como Necro pero sin los taladros y los buenos normals del aire. No puede ser comparado con la rociada del aire de doce, que es algo enteramente diferente y, a pesar de el hecho de que l no puede parry mientras que el aire que estralla, es manera, manera mejor que cualquier cosa Sean tiene.
La situacin de Sean adelante, estando parada la casa de mquinas, estando parada feroz, toward+roundhouse, y toward+fierce (en el cortocircuito, todos sus diversos normals) son toda peor que los normals comparables que los otros shotos tienen. Los normals de Ken son impresionantes, Ryu y Akuma siguen siendo realmente buenos y Sean es manera debajo de se. Y desemejante de esos individuos, que pueden utilizar sus normals como empujes pero puede tambin utilizarlos a combo en cosas ms grandes y mejores, Sean pegadas con apenas usarlas como empujes. Su casa de mquinas que se agacha es ms lenta por una cierta razn, incluso.
l tiene los pocos mixups, y esto no es discutible; No soy realmente seguro cmo cualquier persona pensara que l tiene el la mayora. Usted est contando trucos del gancho agarrador de roll/dash? Porque usted no debe ser, son casi intiles. Usted est contando shenanigans del retroceso del hacha? Usted no debe ser, porque cualquier persona lata decente parry los en la reaccin. Su toward+fierce es probablemente los gastos indirectos ms lentos del juego y no puede ser comboed de. Su gama del tiro es horrible y l no tiene generalmente ningn combo peligroso para hacer que sus opositores eligen jugarla caja fuerte y bloque. Y a menos que usted tenga estupendo, y a menos que el estupendos usted tengan pueden realmente estar comboed en de una distancia o despus de confirmar, entonces su cortocircuito o forward/close que se agacha bsico estar parados juegos de roundhouse/uoh no repartirn dao y no asustarn cualquier persona. Y las ocasiones son usted no van a tener ms de una barra cualquier cosa, significando que si usted aterriza un estupendo, usted va de nuevo a no tener nada asustadizo en todos.
A excepcin de doce, nadie tiene como difcilmente poca que reparte dao sin metro como Sean . Las rayas verticales regulares de Yang todava reparten buen dao y fijan para arriba otro mixup; Los empujes de Urien son muy perjudiciales y lo dejan espaciar bien; La lata de Yun todava reparte dao sin Genei Jin y tiene movilidad excelente de todos modos; Ibuki hace gran dao y lo atonta y virtualmente todos sus combos conducen a los nuevos mixups. Cada uno no puede repartir solamente dao ms confiablemente, pero pueden fijar para arriba las nuevas oportunidades para los mixups toda la hora y esos mixups que fijan para arriba son ms peligrosos.
El castigar bien no significa hacer una casa de mquinas que se agacha; cuando sa es su mejor manera de castigar, usted sabe que usted tiene un mal carcter. Cada uno (excepto doce) puede hacer un cierto ataque combo o cierto grande del daos; sin estupendo, Sean no puede. Si usted parry algo, grande, usted puede castigar, pero dependiendo del parry no es una manera que usted puede ganar.
Sean tiene un metro duro del edificio del tiempo porque l no puede utilizar sus movimientos especiales o hacer los combos, que son las dos mejores maneras de construir el metro. Incluso cuando l utiliza sus movimientos especiales, no construyen mucho metro, e incluso cuando l los combos l es en la mayora dos golpes sin usar ex/super, y dos-golpee los combos no construyen mucho metro.
Sean y doce son ambo crappy, pero doce sigue siendo crappy usable. Su rociada del aire le da una movilidad y mixups mucho mejores. Lo deja instalar tiros y los combos, lo deja conseguir de las malas situaciones, l proporciona los mixups, l lo deja presionar el ataque o funcionar lejos mejor, el etc. Sus normals de tierra estn tambin en un nivel similar pues Sean, es decir, ellos es decente, pero doce tiene ataques mejores del aire de la manera. Sus movimientos especiales son tambin totalmente usables y realmente no malos, y l construye el metro mejor que Sean porque l puede construir el metro al el aire o usar sus specials. En cortocircuito, doce es por lo menos uniformes con Sean en casi cada respecto, y en muchos l es definitivamente superior.
Mire, hay una razn que usted ve a gente usando cada carcter con excepcin de Sean en torneos de alto nivel, y no es porque la gente no lo utiliza. Uno de mis amigos vive en Japn y juega 3S all y l dice que las porciones de uso Sean y ellas de la gente son realmente buenas con l – pero eso o no lo utilizan en torneos o lo utilizan y nunca consiguen dondequiera. La gente ha estado jugando este juego por casi una dcada ahora, y qu, despus de que sin embargo perodo del tiempo comparativamente corto usted lo haya jugado usted ha descubierto algo tan radicalmente diferente sobre Sean que usted le ha hecho en un carcter viable? Adelantado. Usted no piensa que la gente ha calculado hacia fuera y ha probado apenas sobre todo posible con l? Usted no piensa que la manera ms talentosa y la gente experimentada de la manera han intentado utilizarlo en torneos antes? Significo, l soy una demanda egotista bonita, decir la gente que llama el malo de Sean justo no es tan buena como usted.
Tambin, jugu en el rea de la baha por aos, y no s con quines era este torneo, pero seguro no estaba con cualquier persona que ha jugado en la escena all para cualquier perodo del tiempo. S la gente juega all, y ella juega bien.
what he said -.-. I know alot of its off…but im white!
Yeah, you’re right.
let me everybody a question do you guys and girls(if any of them play) think that sean is a good person to use
Thank you.
I could have translated myself as speak Spanish, but I just went and did it the cheap way on a translator. Hence some of that shit doesn’t make sense.
Sean is terrible and it is because his entire game gets destroyed by reaction. If you tech throws well and obviously wait for anyone of his special moves at any time, you win. He has no offensive game compared to the regular mix ups of any shoto. except all other shotos are far more dangerous and all have lots of great moves that cancel off of low forward. and yeah he has no good options in the air.