yeah this but about me
Um, I do play third strike it’s my favorite game since I consider it absolute perfection. Yah, a lot of what you listed is pretty difficult. However, only the upper echelon players of 3s are doing those consistently. Especially in tournaments/ranbats. Also, even Daigo admitted that parrying chuns Sa2 is actually pretty commonplace, but the reason why he surprised himself was that he was able to input each parry with all that yelling and screaming. Parrying Sa2 and especially Ryu’s Sa3 (lol) is quite easy actually. It actually makes me wonder whether YOU play the game.
All of the high level techniques that 3s has are like stepping stones which people seem to learn as they get progressively better at the game. That’s why MOV and a few others are the only ones who use quite a bit of option selects besides parry related ones. I guess I was focusing too much on the core gameplay as being easy. Since short short super, low forward super, etc aren’t hard at all to pull off. For some characters in SFIV you need lots of links in your bnbs. 3s has a lot of chains for a lot of characters, which are fairly simple to pull off. Plus, relatively speaking 3s is not as hard as Mvc2, VF5, and GG.
Also, I never said 3s execution was easy. I just found it annoying when I read fanboys foaming from the mouth saying that it’s the hardest shit ever and that SFIV is just easy shit. When both games have hard shit to pull off. Sako in SSFIV shows there’s hard stuff in the game you can do as well, but the core gameplay just like with 3s is not as difficult. Obviously SFIV is lacking in the amount of techniques 3s has, but that’s a whole different story.
that post was absolute perfection
they have no relation
Tightening up the reversal window would do so much for SF4.
I don’t think easier execution is the cause of all casual-related problems.
Casual players don’t want to have to learn anything. The moment the word ‘complex’ comes up, they shit themselves. They don’t want to have to devote any time to the game in order to have a satisfying experience with it, kind of like hiring a prostitute.
So this means that if developers want to catch the attention of casual gamers, they need to push a few key points when releasing a fighter:
- It’s easy to learn and it’s fun. You can do stuff that looks complicated but really isn’t.
- hey! Even if you suck at the game, there is always a way for you to win if you’re falling behind. (not usually true, but things like ultras and reversals make it LOOK like it’s true.
- It looks cool. It’s got characters you like in it.
- ‘advanced players’ (those bastards) won’t ever get in the way of you enjoying the game. We’ve designed it like that.
I think that it’s very possible to push a competitive, well-designed and complex game for a casual market, but rather than dumb the game down itself, the developers NEED to understand that new players often feel daunted by the amount of stuff they have to learn. A solution to this? Provide detailed in-game tutorials and documentation. Add a story mode that systematically drills game functions into the player’s head in a manner that they can enjoy, kind of like what Dora the Explorer does to toddlers.
And most importantly, Training mode should be a noob’s best friend and safe zone. If the game has an interesting training mode with lots of precise, useful, interesting features and explanations, then it can keep a casual player interested for a surprising amount of time. Having a dummy opponent stand there while you experiment and find out how fun the game is can be really satisfying!
And yes, story is important. Casual players value story and visuals over gameplay in a lot of instances, because it’s a quick and easy reward for their efforts. A lot of casual players enjoyed Subspace Emmissary in Smash Bros Brawl more than the actual pvp fighting. Yes, developers should focus on the fighting game’s system first and foremost, but a story mode never hurts when it comes to attracting a casual crowd without compromising game design.
More games need to use VF4: EVOs training system. My sisters are about as casual as it gets & really got into VF due to how helpful the Training system was in EVO.
Tightening up the reversal window doesn’t help the fact that the game was designed for people to be on defense as much as possible.
A tighter reversal window won’t help the fact that throws do shit damage, throw tech brings both players back to neutral, and the stages are too big.
SF4 just holds the defending player’s hand as much as possible with its overabundance of defensive features while making it difficult as fuck for offensive players to do any offense.
Hell even the lenient inputs makes offense hardeer and defense easier cause defensive players get easy mashed out DPs while offensive players have to be tight with block strings and combos in case they don’t fuck up.
It’s pretty ironic that Ono wanted SF4 to be offensive but in reality, it’s defensive.
I really dislike parries, pushblock, just guard and any other defensive mechanic that doesn’t use up meter of some kind. IMO you should be losing a small amount of meter whenever you use one of those.
Guard crush is also something that’s becoming worryingly scarce in fighters. Even Blazblue:CS is devaluing blockstrings because of that stupid new guard pointer mechanic which only allows you to break guard after getting your opponent to block very slow and easily avoided moves several times.
Where’s that video of Ono mashing DP during someone’s block string?
Haha, what?
haha
Also, darkshine, thank you for explaining it more eloquently than I did.
trying to get a noob to play KOF is like the greatest thing ever, just watching there face look so lost and confused is priceless
this but about every good game. suck it noobs
[media=youtube]X3UN9EfmT0Y[/media]
oh wait nevermind, he never blocks
All of this is exactly right. Everything people like to think was hard about old games was really just cheap, and ultimately really easy once you knew the trick. In fact, it’s pretty damn sure none of us would’ve gotten anywhere without the ultimate Godbook known as the Official Nintendo Player’s Guide.
The only real difference is that instead of a deliberate trick, the “solution” these days are more incidental rather than specifically designed. Hence the move to mashfests and the admission of ineptitude that are QTEs.
I pressed the vuvuzela button and it seemed approximately the right course of action. Probably better than listening to SHORYU-SHORYUKEN, SHORYUKEN, HADOUKEN, SHORYUKEN the entire time anyways.
ya, still KOF series is harder for noobs, since they have to learn all the jump-ins, and how to stop jump-ins, how the supers and custom combos work, rolling, and they still need to know 3 characters unlike SF were you can just use 1, and have to know all 3 of those characters and there match-ups
Agreed. That stuff should use at least a tiny bit of meter, if only so you can’t just rely on that all the time. I think combo breakers like Killer Instinct would oddly work well under a system that uses meter for that, as opposed to them being unlimited all the time anytime.