Fixed for accuracy
we house 25% of the entire worlds prison population here in America. Incarceration is the only thing we lead the world in presently (other than the amount of adults who believe in angels) it’s a fucking problem that is obviously affecting the rest of our performance.
That’s because you smoke weed man. That shit only counts as drugs from a legal stand point.
Look at this though. If hard drug use is allowed uninhibited across the board without intent of helping said people cure their addiction without thousands of dollars, kids will happen a lot more while the mother is using. Fast forward a few generations, a large portion of our population will be potatoes with severe medical conditions/brain damage because the mother was smoking/injecting for the whole development period. My best friend’s mother was and still is, addicted to meth, including when she was pregnant. Said friend has had undiagnosed heart and lung issues since the day she was born, and when they appear at random, it results in complete inactivity for maximum length of an entire week. She doesnt have the energy to do anything, and breathing is a painful task. That kind of shit is pretty much guaranteed to happen, and most people dont even get it that well. It can be anything from missing organs, non-functioning limbs, and all kinds of mental problems of ranging severity.
Unrestricted use of hard drugs has many far reaching effects besides “That’s bad for you! It lowers your life expectancy!”
For the sake of argument, let’s say fine. Fuck it. All drugs are now legal. Do you really think any place of employment that pays outside of minimum wage will let you keep your job if on drugs? No, they wouldnt. Your drug use hinders your performance, and the professional standards for their business. Now bosses are dishing out drug tests, and cutting anyone who doesnt pass. Congratulations, now the unemployment rate is leaps and bounds over 8%.
I do agree though, that possession and use, should not be a criminal offense. Only dealing should be. The catch though, is that users NEED to be in some kind of program, and have to do some kind of check in to make sure they are on track. Now what the punishment should be for those arent really following through, that is open for debate as I dont have an answer for that one right now. It wouldnt be jail time though. That is a waste of tax money and prison space. It can’t just be free reign with whatever you can put into your body. There needs to be a very defined line.
^lies
you do know opiates and coke have been around far longer than laws prohibiting them
here’s a little secret
They weren’t a problem until those laws existed
Someone sippin that D.A.R.E. Kool-Aid 
Meh. Just legalize this shit and put the people selling it in jail.
Let dumb mother fuckers use if they want. Not like laws stopped them in the first place. So let them have their fun and if jobs start making drug testing mandatory then tough shit for the junkies.
I never understood this fascination people have with drug testing and jobs what I do off the clock is my business
I think if someone is on hard drugs (not saying weed so all you religious potheads can get off my case) we should try as a society to get them off of it. Not with jail time or threats or fines with serious physical and mental therapy.
Unfortunately the current “war on drugs” is a complete sham and they have no interest in actually curing people of their addictions.
There is no such thing as “hard drugs”. It’s just some bullshit word made up by faggots who try and justify their drug use as something less “severe” than others.
because drugs are another perspective, and another state of mind that people find enjoyable. Do you know why that heroin addict steals? Because drugs are made artificially expensive due to scarcity, and because he doesn’t have a job to pay for his habit, because he got fired for doing what he wants on his own time.
Can I ask you a question? Why do you play video games? It’s a waste of time, money, and energy, and you don’t get anything out of it other than personal satisfaction. Now, isn’t that the same question you ask people who dabble with drugs?
You only think drugs are bad because your religion, your government, your parents, your peers have told you they are bad. When in reality, they aren’t. Take for example
Sugar (surcose) is as bad as it gets. No nutritional value, makes you fat, highly toxic, extremely addicting, dulls you, etc. Why is it allowed? You do know that when it was scarce, people enslaved an entire continent to harvest this new substance, massive wars where waged, and iirc there was a religious movement against it. Yet it’s allowed, nobody talks about the issues of sugar consumption like they do against amphetamines, opioids, other assorted stimulants and or psychedelics. Even though excessive consumption of sugar is crippling families and individuals, and will cripple our economy in ways we didn’t think imaginable when all old people start failing.
By starving a market, and punishing users for simple use, you create the problems that exist today. When heroin and morphine where legal, opioid users wheren’t painted in the same way they are today.
Opioid users are stigmatized by this idea that they are thief’s, liars, violent, etc. But in the late early 1800-1900, their stigma was that they where lonely introverts who just kept to themselves wasting their life away abusing opioids.
Drug laws created by crusaders are never the answer, in fact, laws made by crusaders in general are very dumb.
@XthAtGAm3RGuYX, refer to the whole, certain rights/privlages are to be revoked thing I mentioned. Stop buying that whole bullshit about families failing, and children being the victims of rampant use. Divorce does more damage to kids, but no one bats an eye. Think about your position, and realize how much it’s shaped by bullshit propaganda and agenda’s that feed you shit on purpose.
In the automotive industry, the reason for drug testing is for insurance reasons. But it would be nice to have some kind of testing similar to alcohol breathalyzers. That would also motivate unemployed smokers into finding work as the intimidation of having to pass a UA would be gone/lessened.
Not really. Just from my experience, someone doing hard shit is bad for everyone in their immediate vicinity. This all sounds fine and well until you have a violent altercation with a coke head who doesnt feel pain. I dont like to entertain the notion of having drug use being declared kosher by the government. Weed is one thing, and I dont even smoke. All weed does is make you sleepy, happy, and hungry. Also the glaucoma stuff. Otherwise, I think it is a bad idea to just let people have at it.
Be smart, don’t start.
Straight edge 4 life.
Fixed further.
I hate to sound like a hippie, but it’s all in the prison-industrial-complex, and also the military-industrial-complex.
As long as conflict is gainful for those with power, connections, and wealth, they’ll keep it going this way.
Why is their existence tolerated? It’s not like they’re careful about being targeted. One bullet, one body, as they say, and that would not take much, or much motivation.
As long as still live, they have a chance to make this happen anywhere they set up shop.
Return them and everyone and everything that benefits them to nothing, I think.
They’ve done enough harm.
I guess I lied when I said I’ve only ever done one a single “hard drug” in my life, because I forgot that at one point in my life I was sorta addicted to opioids. I am an advocate for the stance that people should be allowed to do what they want as long as it doesn’t directly harm others.
I myself, however, have single handedly experienced the opioid “trap” for myself, and let me tell you it is hell, and no matter how much you try to forget about it or how long you’ve stayed away from it, the thought of the pure bliss you experienced while on it you will NEVER forget. It’s why I can relate to heroin users (I have never done actual heroin, just opioids) who have become sober, but can relapse at any given moment. Opioids really are that fucking good, and trick your brain into never forgetting the experience, and you will ALWAYS want more as soon as you remember how amazing it was.
This experience with opioids also comes from when I was in high school (fucked up time in my life), so I do know exactly how some drug addicts feel, even though I wasn’t ever a junkie, I was always looking for more, I just never resorted to becoming a scumbag to get my fix.
And to think that this all happened because I decided to try some morphine pills I found in the medicine cabinet. There were over 100 of them, and after the first does, all 100 were gone within the next week. I’m lucky I didn’t OD on them I was taking so much.
This is the reason why I don’t do any “hard” drugs, because I’ve practically scared myself straight from them, and is why I only stick to the green goddess nowadays.
So yeah, I completely understand why the majority of people would be weary of letting drugs become somewhat legal, but it does work as long as it’s implemented in a safe and effective way, where rehabilitation is encouraged if it has become apparent that you are buying/using too often, or your health or safety of others has become a concern.
That was well thought out, thought provoking and well written.
“Hard drugs” basically means “not weed” as far as I know.
Some might argue that the idea of the stereotypical drug addict life aids in keeping people off drugs and let’s not confuse the issue here, drugs are bad for you. That “other state of mind” is just your brain frying temporarily.
On price: Do you see the price of cigarettes? Absurd prices. Do you really think coke will be cheaper than that?
Video games aren’t even close, it’s an enjoyable personally rewarding way to spend leisure time and it doesn’t physically harm me and I can stop any time I want which I have proven multiple times to various authorities.
Sugar is a problem but with proper restraint and exercise it’s not going to be an issue. I eat sugar, life is fine I’m in ok shape.
But I’m not saying everything makes sense, cigarettes, hookah, cigars, alcohol, all legal. All awful but a shot of vodka doesn’t make you an alcoholic the way one needle to the vein makes you an addict.
Punishing the users is a bad idea, which is why I say treat them. Yes people have other problems but drugs are definitely more harmful and less manageable than sugar and video games.
if my any one of my 13 kids ever does drugs its a straight disownment. if they had time for drugs they have time to actually be good at other stuff in their life like painting or signing or playing sports or marvel 2
How do you explain the religions, and philosophies that arise from trips? This “brain” frying is a inherent instinct that creatures want. There are known cases of animals consuming psychoactive compounds. It’s something that we crave inherently, I’m also not confusing the issue here.
Drugs are bad for you, but it’s also tied to that “other state of mind”. In order to have a complete discussion of drug use, you need to include this other nonsense. You can’t have a discussion about drugs without the sum of it’s experiences, because you are basing your argument on personal experiences, and philosophy. Why should your opinion that
“other state of mind” is simply your brain frying,
be more meaningful to the discussion, than the abstract need for creatures to seek this other state of mind?
When I dream, and “God” speaks to me, was that “god”, or was that my brain frying on DMT?
do you know why a gram of pot costs +25$ today from a collective, or 20$ from a street dealer? At least what’s considered “top shelf”: exclusivity, production costs, taxes, hype (the collective gets to charge a convenience charge)
do you know why a pound of sugar costs roughly 8$? especially when you consider production costs, and taxes? Because it’s mass produced.
Do you know why a pack of cigarettes costs about the same? taxes. Taxes alone constitute the price of cigarettes, nothing more nothing less. If drugs are legalized and regulated, that’s the direction in which it will gravitate to. Alcohol suffers from the same problem. It’s heavily taxed, except alcohol is taxed per license rather than per package. The distillery needs to pay hefty taxes on a gallon basis, plus licenses to distill alcohol, and restaurants and stores need to pay a alcohol dispensary fee to sell alcohol. It just so happens that it’s cheaper to make alcohol. It’s only a matter of time before the price of marijuana skyrockets.
So yes, cocaine can be dirt cheap, if it’s what the masses want, and it’s mass produced, but it’s not. But by having the same system in check for the productionof alcohol and tobacco (not distribution and sale), will ensure that people won’t be stealing, killing, or sucking dick for their fix. And we can all agree that this is the biggest issue with drug use.
says who?
I have friends who do methamphetamine during exam time. They stop after exams are done. I have friends that abuse MDMA, they stop just as easily when it’s job hunting time. It’s all relative, just like your experiences that convince you it’s OK to claim the things you are claiming.
How do you explain the people who play for so long that they die? People who grow an online persona and addiction to being online all the time? Or the addiction children exhibit regarding their video games?
YOu wouldn’t agree with somebody saying drug X should be legalized because I and a few friends can stop when we want, right?
Sugar is a problem. Even with excersie, diabetes can still develop, and long term abuse leads to issues. If you want to talk about proper restraint, then I can say that about any drug. amphetamines, opioid’s, psychedelics, dissociative, etc. You answer your own question with your own statement. You just don’t know it because you assume on anecdotal evidence that it’s quite the opposite and not possible.
and this here then becomes the problem.
a shot of vodka doesn’t.
yes a shot of vodka doesn’t get you hooked, it’s biochemically impossible. did you know you can eat methamphetamine, and the degree of addiction is exponentially less than smoking, and infinitesimally small compared to injection? The degree of addiction is of that degree, specifically because of the delivery method.
why is crack cocaine more addicting than cocaine? It’s the same drug. The answer is because one is snorted, the other is smoked. Those details matter.
Lets examine several opioid class drugs
all three top skeletal structures are opioid class drugs. Did you know all three have extremely varying degree’s of addiction? who’s to say that you can’t regulate the sale and and personal use of something like codeine, or perhaps oxycodene? It doesn’t have to be morphine or herion. Unlike alcohol, opioids aren’t stuck at in one configuration.
sugar has actually been pretty harmful, and continues to be more harmful than other drugs.
obesity rates have skyrocketed in Mexico so fast, that Mexico is now the fattest nation on the planet, and is projected to have the highest rate of diabetes soon. As thrust said in another thread, the raise of obesity in Asia is also sharply on the rise. IN the United States there are so many baby boomers and diabetics, that when their health starts failing, our economy is going to take a massive hit that’s going to have profound and lasting consequences comparable to the great depressions of the 30’s and late 00’s.
We also have such a large population of children with diabetes, you can’t use what you are saying as a justification. Drug addiction rehab is so cheap, compared to a lifetime of drugs for diabeties and other fat related diseases thanks to massive sugar consumption.
I don’t drink, do drugs, etc. And I think it’s bullshit people are jailed for doing drugs. Provided it doesn’t hurt anyone else, it’s not worth jailing over.
There’s no argument for incarceration here. None. At all.
You’re really passionate about drugs, why?
Doctors. The few fringe cases of guys that got so hooked on some MMO they died is no where near as close to the amount of death brought on by drugs.
I’d be willing to bet the % of people that can quit games on a dime is much higher than those who can quit drugs.
Restraint from processed sugar is a hell of a lot easier then restraint from drugs. Because there’s always natural sugar, because bread has carbs which will feed your body sugar. Sugar is something everyone has, cutting back on it isn’t easy but it’s certainly not drugs because you’re never truly off it provided you’re not in the early stages of an Atkins diet.
Scientifically you are essentially just hurting yourself to feel different or forget yourself. I could be wrong but the “experiences” are all just hallucinations, there is no value to them other than the value you place on them after the fact.
Granted, it will solve the crime aspect but can you even imagine a society where drugs are considered ok by law? Some kid can turn 18, do a line at a party legally and ruin his entire fucking life. It’s just not worth it.
I’m not debating sugar is harmful or that people with a problem shouldn’t get help. I am saying that it is a more gradual issue you can take control of. Drugs hit you immediately, snort one line, inject one needle and for most people you’re pretty much done.
In an ideal world people wouldn’t be stupid enough to do this shit but really? You’ve convinced me it’s way too complicated an issue and frankly I don’t think anyone really wins no matter which way we slice it.
Saying “treat everyone” is very idealized yet “legalize drugs” is just anarchy.
I always thought of it as that unless the problem is directly harming others (Organized crime, abuse, etc.) then it isn’t a public issue. I don’t care if you’re a heroin addict. With crimes rates going down with the price of heroin, I fail to see why I should really care about paying for rehabilitation. I think being educated before hand (in public school) is the best way to advise kids not to get into hard drugs. If you can’t get a simple lesson through your head, you can’t be rehabilitated.
it’s not about the drugs, it’s about the freedom of choice that people have. It’s about getting rid of laws that are put in place by dumb people, using dumb reasoning to justify their agenda and their self righteous crusade in enforcing what they believe is right and wrong. Whether you like it or not, people have the right to choose, and you can’t base arguments for laws on hypothetical’s.
you know there’s a difference between doctors, and researchers that study the human body. Just because a doctor say’s so doesn’t make it so, granted some doctors are bonafied researchers.
And again, no shit. Once that blood brain barrier is crossed, and said compound provides instantaneous ecstasy, it becomes hard to quit. That’s biology for you, but the whole point of that example was to show you that the same level of addictions exist on both sides, and your anecdotal evidence isn’t a good argument.
Sex addicts have a hard time quitting, chronic masturbators have a hard time quitting, anybody with a real addiction is going to have a hard time stopping.You still haven’t addressed the child addiction issue…
You base that on?
Why are there so many diet fads?
Why do people yo-yo with their weight?
Why do people start eating when they get stressed?
Why do people eat a lot when they get emotional?
Why is weight loss and management a billion dollar market?
Why do people have such a hard time losing weight?
Why do people give up so easily when losing weight?
Why are there so many support groups regarding weight loss?
Why do people keep eating sugar after having their feet cut off, diagnosed with diabetes, weight 400+lbs?
sounds like an addiction and problem comparable to “hard drug” use.
I can keep going, and all your answers will boil down to
They didn’t have the will! (which can also be said about “hard drug” use, using your logic)
So no, the idea that restraint form processed sugars is a hell of a lot easier than restraining form drugs is dumb. Especially since people get hooked on sugars for life and then have an incredibly hard time breaking free from their addiction. have you ever wondered why folks make those “inspirational” life changing videos, and people respond positively to them as if they stopped doing hard drugs? Because that shit is as real as other types of addictions, they simply manifested in different ways (physical vs mental addictions). Ways in which society tells you is easier than drug rehab. Just because people don’t have long cold sweaty nights with pain associated with them doesn’t mean the severity of the addiction is less. Mental addictions are harder to break than physical ones.
And I was talking about surcose, you can include fructose in there also, another simple sugar that isn’t comparable to complex carbohydrates found in vegetables and whole grain oats. People who completely lay off simple sugars suffer from common substance abuse withdrawls.
cravings, irritability, migraines, fatigue, etc. But it’s not to the same degree, the symptoms are there
I’m not understanding this, an abstract experience cannot be quantified by science. I’m talking specifically about the abstract pleasure’s derived from use, and using quantifiable means is illogical, in an area that’as already illogical.
I can, and it’s not as fucked up as this reality.
There wouldn’t be the strain the prison system already puts on the economy
We wouldn’t be wasting billion of dollars on non issue, NASA or our schools could use that money
The militarization of police wouldn’t be as severe
There wouldn’t be the marginilization of minorities like there is today…
And your example doesn’t do much.
A kid who just got his licence can go out for a drive, and he decides to drink. He can not only ruin his life, he can end the life of another. why allow alcohol if he can not only ruin his life, but the life of others. Why give him the right to drive if statistically, he’s gonna fuck up?
A kid who just turned 18 is given the right to vote. He can not only make the wrong decision because he is incapable of making the correct decision, he also affects the lives of everybody in his community for choosing incorrectly.
There are so many examples that can be used in place, that your example isn’t a very good one.
just like drugs. You just say it’s not because you think…
which is false because the stimulating effects of sugar also hit you immediately. There’s a study that shows you can’t eat ice cream and be mad at the same time. Think about that, and think about all the cliche’s about females (and fat folks in general) dumping their feelings into a tub of ice cream. They use that instead of “hard drugs” to escape their realities.
In an ideal world people would have the ability to pace themselves and respect their pharmaceutical of choice. The way you phrased it, tells me that you’ve bought in into the whole standardized mindset children are taught so they won’t dabble with drugs. Which is good and bad, because it then leads to an incomplete assessment of the subject, and keeps people from choosing for themselves.