Video Game General 3.0 - You know what should come back? Pre-rendered backgrounds!

Akhos · August 6, 2015, 2:42am

But I’m human just like the rest of you.

And even if I weren’t, that’s discrimination. My opinion matters just as much as anyone else’s.

Bious · August 6, 2015, 2:44am

I will never pull off Clark’s 2k2UM Grab HDM.

Or half the shit Jhun can do.

Or even play Angel.

Davidstar · August 6, 2015, 2:44am

didn’t really care for banjokazooie.

orochizoolander · August 6, 2015, 2:46am

LOL, I read your post in Peter Griffin talking to Meg voice. Yooka-Laylee is looking terrific I would count that as more of a RARE game than anything made by them in years.

I’m a big fan of old RARE, but DKCR 3D is way better than anything they ever made IMO. I’m in love with that game.

kAb · August 6, 2015, 2:50am

Anyone want to party up for some splatoon squad action? Update drops at 10 pm EST. Come join the one true roller in some domination.

Cyntalan · August 6, 2015, 2:51am

So what zoo is doing now is akin to when some dumbass says something really fucking stupid, then people jump on him calling him out for saying something really fucking stupid, said dumbass goes “HAHAHAHA I TROLLED YOU!” to try and cover up the fact that he said something really fucking stupid and was called out for it.

XthAtGAm3RGuYX · August 6, 2015, 3:00am

Let’s not pretend Mirrors Edge was good for anything other than running/jumping over shit, and quick melee disarming tactics. The story in that game was shit. In that vein though, Mirror’s Edge was like a fighting game. Who gives a fuck about the “Why?” when you have really good gameplay?

Speed running the levels was a blast too

Hawkingbird · August 6, 2015, 3:14am

I haven’t kept up with Mirror’s Edge 2 news but will it have multiplayer speedrunning? I feel there’s some untapped potential there.

Saitsu · August 6, 2015, 3:18am

You don’t count for anything either.

Negative-Zer0 · August 6, 2015, 3:20am

ExposedD- 10 wins

Orochizoolander- 3 wins

NAP · August 6, 2015, 3:31am

I guess I was a bit hasty in saying I don’t like any Rare stuff. I do like the DKC games on SNES and Perfect Dark was cool. But I think the majority of their library is pretty boring, although well made. I realized this while watching the Giant Bomb quick look of the Rare collection released this week. There’s like nothing on it I’d really care about playing.

orochizoolander · August 6, 2015, 3:32am

This mentality is what lead to the creation of games like PSASBR, SF4, MVC3, and was explicitly the driving force of HDR and we all know how that turned out.

Meanwhile ST, 3S, MVC2, CVS2, GGXRD, SFA2, KOF98UM, and other games which are among the most revered in the genre emphasize both mental strategy as well as physical execution, not watering down one for the sake of the other. Do you see the difference?

The flaw with your argument is you’re arbitrarily dismissing half of what makes the fighting game genre unique from others in the first place, without execution barriers you would be left with checkers, chess, battleship, whatver board game of choice you get my point. The “execution barriers serves no purpose” argument has been debunked for years now, it doesn’t hold water because you’re assuming that the execution of moves, combos, whatever itself is not “the real game” as you put it, when in fact it’s just as essential a skill as having strategy that’s why virtually every top player in every fighting game practices to ingrain it into their muscle memory. Also the “at high level play everyone’s execution is second nature” argument is also bullshit proven by the fact that so often top players who have spent hundreds of hours practicing execution drop combos and fuck up in tournament. Execution in fighting games is never second nature, name any top player and I gurantee I can find footage of them fucking up at least once in a while, players always have to be aware of their execution and not slack on it for a second if they want to win, just because the Daigos and Tokidos make it looks easy doesn’t mean it is, even for them.

Now I hope you don’t over simplify this post and equate what I’m saying to “all fighting game controls should be written in binary code and require 4 arms to input within a .000000001 frame window”.

@Pertho Got anything to add to this? I know you love armchair theory fighter lol.

Saitsu · August 6, 2015, 3:33am

orochizoolander:

GespenstRitter:

An execution skill ceiling is all well and good and something to strive for in your game, but execution entry barriers serve no design purpose and only prevent people from getting into the real game as fast. At high level play, they don’t matter since everyone’s execution is at a point where it’s second nature, anyway. There’s a reason why actual fighting game designers all agree that making entry-level stuff easier is better for the game. You don’t gain anything by making a Shinkuu Hadoken a pretzel motion or requiring you to manually cancel the landing lag of your jump-in attacks in Street Fighter.

This mentality is what lead to the creation of games like PSASBR, SF4, MVC3, and was explicitly the driving force of HDR and we all know how that turned out.

Meanwhile ST, 3S, MVC2, CVS2, GGXRD, SFA2, KOF98UM, and other games which are among the most revered in the genre emphasize both mental strategy as well as physical execution, not watering down one for the sake of the other. Do you see the difference?

Overplayed your hand with those two answers by a mile.

Bious · August 6, 2015, 3:46am

Saitsu:

orochizoolander:

GespenstRitter:

An execution skill ceiling is all well and good and something to strive for in your game, but execution entry barriers serve no design purpose and only prevent people from getting into the real game as fast. At high level play, they don’t matter since everyone’s execution is at a point where it’s second nature, anyway. There’s a reason why actual fighting game designers all agree that making entry-level stuff easier is better for the game. You don’t gain anything by making a Shinkuu Hadoken a pretzel motion or requiring you to manually cancel the landing lag of your jump-in attacks in Street Fighter.

This mentality is what lead to the creation of games like PSASBR, SF4, MVC3, and was explicitly the driving force of HDR and we all know how that turned out.

Meanwhile ST, 3S, MVC2, CVS2, GGXRD, SFA2, KOF98UM, and other games which are among the most revered in the genre emphasize both mental strategy as well as physical execution, not watering down one for the sake of the other. Do you see the difference?

Overplayed your hand with those two answers by a mile.

A2 is good answer.

A3 is bad answer.

Saitsu · August 6, 2015, 3:54am

Bious:

Saitsu:

orochizoolander:

GespenstRitter:

An execution skill ceiling is all well and good and something to strive for in your game, but execution entry barriers serve no design purpose and only prevent people from getting into the real game as fast. At high level play, they don’t matter since everyone’s execution is at a point where it’s second nature, anyway. There’s a reason why actual fighting game designers all agree that making entry-level stuff easier is better for the game. You don’t gain anything by making a Shinkuu Hadoken a pretzel motion or requiring you to manually cancel the landing lag of your jump-in attacks in Street Fighter.

This mentality is what lead to the creation of games like PSASBR, SF4, MVC3, and was explicitly the driving force of HDR and we all know how that turned out.

Meanwhile ST, 3S, MVC2, CVS2, GGXRD, SFA2, KOF98UM, and other games which are among the most revered in the genre emphasize both mental strategy as well as physical execution, not watering down one for the sake of the other. Do you see the difference?

Overplayed your hand with those two answers by a mile.

A2 is good answer.

A3 is bad answer.

Not what I was aiming for.

Both MvC2 and SFA2 were not bastions of physical execution at the conceptual level. They were made to make things easier from previous games and give players more rewarding things for doing less. Remember the MvC3 backlash for the control scheme? MvC2s wasn’t much better in that regard.

Any physical execution demands that both games give, and I admit that they do, were purely by accident more than anything. Don’t think Capcom had Sentinel Unfly combos in mind when making MvC2 as it was.

RagingDemonStorm · August 6, 2015, 3:55am

How did you playing DKC and it didn’t make you immediately play DKC2. I implore you to PLAY DONKEY KONG COUNTRY 2! Best 2D platformer of all time. Fact.

Rare developed some great games and I’m happy that these young whippersnappers can play games like Blast Corps and Jet Force Gemini but miss out on their IPs that are tied up in MS/Nintendo BS…

Bious · August 6, 2015, 3:57am

Saitsu:

Bious:

Saitsu:

orochizoolander:

GespenstRitter:

An execution skill ceiling is all well and good and something to strive for in your game, but execution entry barriers serve no design purpose and only prevent people from getting into the real game as fast. At high level play, they don’t matter since everyone’s execution is at a point where it’s second nature, anyway. There’s a reason why actual fighting game designers all agree that making entry-level stuff easier is better for the game. You don’t gain anything by making a Shinkuu Hadoken a pretzel motion or requiring you to manually cancel the landing lag of your jump-in attacks in Street Fighter.

This mentality is what lead to the creation of games like PSASBR, SF4, MVC3, and was explicitly the driving force of HDR and we all know how that turned out.

Meanwhile ST, 3S, MVC2, CVS2, GGXRD, SFA2, KOF98UM, and other games which are among the most revered in the genre emphasize both mental strategy as well as physical execution, not watering down one for the sake of the other. Do you see the difference?

Overplayed your hand with those two answers by a mile.

A2 is good answer.

A3 is bad answer.

Not what I was aiming for.

Both MvC2 and SFA2 were not bastions of physical execution at the conceptual level. They were made to make things easier from previous games and give players more rewarding things for doing less. Remember the MvC3 backlash for the control scheme? MvC2s wasn’t much better in that regard.

Any physical execution demands that both games give, and I admit that they do, were purely by accident more than anything. Don’t think Capcom had Sentinel Unfly combos in mind when making MvC2 as it was.

A2 is actually more complicated than A1.

Saitsu · August 6, 2015, 4:01am

Bious:

Saitsu:

Bious:

Saitsu:

orochizoolander:

GespenstRitter:

An execution skill ceiling is all well and good and something to strive for in your game, but execution entry barriers serve no design purpose and only prevent people from getting into the real game as fast. At high level play, they don’t matter since everyone’s execution is at a point where it’s second nature, anyway. There’s a reason why actual fighting game designers all agree that making entry-level stuff easier is better for the game. You don’t gain anything by making a Shinkuu Hadoken a pretzel motion or requiring you to manually cancel the landing lag of your jump-in attacks in Street Fighter.

This mentality is what lead to the creation of games like PSASBR, SF4, MVC3, and was explicitly the driving force of HDR and we all know how that turned out.

Meanwhile ST, 3S, MVC2, CVS2, GGXRD, SFA2, KOF98UM, and other games which are among the most revered in the genre emphasize both mental strategy as well as physical execution, not watering down one for the sake of the other. Do you see the difference?

Overplayed your hand with those two answers by a mile.

A2 is good answer.

A3 is bad answer.

Not what I was aiming for.

Both MvC2 and SFA2 were not bastions of physical execution at the conceptual level. They were made to make things easier from previous games and give players more rewarding things for doing less. Remember the MvC3 backlash for the control scheme? MvC2s wasn’t much better in that regard.

Any physical execution demands that both games give, and I admit that they do, were purely by accident more than anything. Don’t think Capcom had Sentinel Unfly combos in mind when making MvC2 as it was.

A2 is actually more complicated than A1.

I was referring to in terms of SF2 (though obviously feature wise there’s more to it). …I’d rather pretend A1 never happened.

Akhos · August 6, 2015, 4:02am

Just out of curiousity, what was the problem with SFA1?

NAP · August 6, 2015, 4:09am

It’s just like vanilla SF2 and SF3 New Generation. Just not as fleshed out as the later games in their respective series.