ugh there is so much reading between the lines i don’t know where to begin
the original intention of my first post was to say that taking character’s moves and inputs should not be altered to be more accessible to the masses.
the character is fine how they are gespenst complains about vega’s ultra inputs raging demons inputs when there is nothing wrong with them.
he proposes to change their inputs and in doing so changes the character and the unique feel that came along with it.
“Both Sol and Ryu have QCF+P and they both do VERY different things. Sol can’t even use his as a long range attack and is actually meant to keep the opponent grounded, whereas Ryu’s is basically the opposite.”
i’m not saying having the same input makes every move with that input the exact same thing…wtf i never said that.
i’m speaking executionally, having no execution twists makes them boring. like making raging demon a qcf motion input for people who don’t know how to use it properly.
“Different inputs only really create a different feel if they are extreme, like the difference between charge moves, short motions, extended super motions, and 360s”
this is what am getting at.
akuma with raging demon input creates a unique execution twist on the character and making it like everyone else’s input takes that away.
i know it doesn’t “need” to be changed ,but that’s what a lot of people are saying about moves and street fighter 5 and praise a lot of the changes.
“Of course having different inputs changes things, but having the same inputs STILL allows for things to be different also because we aren’t talking about giving characters the EXACT same moves.”
i never fucking said giving giving same inputs gives you the same moves wtf.
.
“It doesn’t “need” to be changed, it’s changed because that’s how the designers intended it in this iteration, and they changed not only the input but the actual move itself.”
and exactly it doesn’t need to be changed ,but people complain about certain motions or inputs being difficult therefore capcom is changing them to make them more accessible. which is what i am against. people need to learn how to play the game themselves and practice instead of asking for things to be easier.
“JUST FROM WATCHING THE VIDEO, that Vega still plays NOTHING like Ryu, Ken, Chun-li, Birdy, Cammy, Nash, or probably any other future character.”
wuuuuaaaatttheeee fuuuuuucckkkk i also didn’t say making inputs the same makes the characters play the same.
i’m saying we need to keep unique executions!
they need to stop making fighting games easier.
god damn!
Charge motions mess with positioning. You have to space yourself differently if you want to get a charge for a move, or sacrifice your ability to charge to move forward.
Its like no one few people here have actually played a fighting game. this is 101 shit you understand as you play the game.
Ok, you’re right, I read into “everyone having the same inputs for everything is boring and bland” because I didn’t think you actually cared more about the actual execution method of the move moreso than the actual effect the move has in the game.
"i’m not saying having the same input makes every move with that input the exact same thing…wtf i never said that."
I know you’re not, and since both you and I know that, because I made the above assumption, I said what I did, but again, I didn’t realize you were only talking about the input.
"akuma with raging demon input creates a unique execution twist on the character and making it like everyone else’s input takes that away.
i know it doesn’t “need” to be changed ,but that’s what a lot of people are saying about moves and street fighter 5 and praise a lot of the changes."
This is simply a matter of taste then as you can argue one way or the other about the value of the input difficulty versus the actual result of the input and what is more or less important.
"and exactly it doesn’t need to be changed ,but people complain about certain motions or inputs being difficult therefore capcom is changing them to make them more accessible. which is what i am against. people need to learn how to play the game themselves and practice instead of asking for things to be easier."
Removing(in reality, reducing) execution barriers does not negate the importance of practice at all. It just cuts out the time spent learning HOW to do, and instead lets you skip to learning WHAT it is you should do.
Point is, you were only focused on the execution, and games like Rising Thunder are specifically NOT focused on that and want to avoid it in favor of what makes fighting games interesting for many other people, which is really only the mind games, which still require plenty of practice. It’s just that instead of practicing SF4 combos, ultras, links, etc. People will actually practicing things that are of far more tactical importance than simply even being able to play at a basic level.
I was thinking about all of that stuff, and you didn’t mean any of that.
Point taken.
I’m not sure who this is directed at, but if it’s me, this is specifically why I mentioned that the moves would have to be rebalanced if you change the inputs. I completely understand the implications of the differences between a motion special and a charge special.
This doesn’t invalidate or make it bad design if a fighting games removes those things. It’s only bad if they actually fail to meet their intent with the design. If you just don’t like it, cool, you don’t like it. No problem then, just don’t play or support it as a product.
From someone who’s actually played the game, SFV plays very differently from SFIV. Combos alone are quite different since you can no longer get combos from chained crouching lights (except for a few cases). That, plus the fact that crouch tech OS has been removed changes up the game quite abit.
Then there are other meaningful changes such as the fact that backdashes no longer have strike invulnerability. Meanwhile, you can no longer get hard knockdowned for days as the game follows the 3rd Strike rule of having no hard knockdown whatsoever outside of supers.
The movement is also somewhat different, some characters actually have decent walkspeeds. More importantly however, dashes are really fast, almost 3S fast, which makes using dashes combined with throws a viable option.
This, plus the new Crush Counter mechanic seem to indicate that they want a game that is more about using medium and heavy pokes (especially since scaling is now harsher, so you can’t wast hits on light attacks).
It’s actually telling that there are some people complaining about SFV not playing like SFIV, or in one case, saying that the game will be boring because it’s more focused on fundamentals then IV.
sigh
@GespenstRitter, once again you have no idea what you’re talking about. As others here have pointed out.
I’ll re-post what I said in regards to charge moves, and add on to it:
It’s not just the restrictions in how much you’re able to throw the move out, it’s the restrictions on when you’re able to use the move in certain situations. A lot of charge moves are really good in their own right and are made charge moves so you can’t use them whenever you want, hence helping to balance out their strength. Like take Bison’s scissor kick for example. It’s made to be a very safe and fast move that’s good at whiff punishing and is useful for safe chip. You want Bison to be able to do that at any time? Let alone while walking forward?
Or Guile’s flash kick again. It’s a good reversal with good range and is fast that has invincibility. As such, it’s limited to only being used if you’re crouching. Which means you’re not moving. Which means that you’re not throwing projectiles and you’re giving up space to your opponent who can just walk towards you now. And you can’t anti-air with it if you throw a Sonic Boom, or start moving, and the opponent jumps at you. It’s balanced around being a charge move.
As for the raging demon input being how it is, that one’s easy. It’s because it’s designed to be able to be cancelled out of any of his normal moves. Unlike the comparable 720 command grab supers. This allows the raging demon to have similar restrictions that 720 command grabs are designed to have (can’t just walk forward and do it…though granted in SF4 you CAN do that if you’re fast enough), while having an input that you can input it quickly when doing a set-up with it (e.g. clst.lk tick to Raging Demon, or SF4 far st.hk to Raging Demon [cancel the recovery], or overhead to raging demon [cancel into raging demon before the overhead comes out]). This also is designed to prevent you from constantly buffering the input as you’ll end up whiffing moves constantly as a result, which can lead you to just being whiff punished.
I’m sure others can add on to this.
Please just stop talking about stuff you don’t understand Ges, you’ll look less like an idiot that way.
If Raging Demon’s input wasn’t what it was, everyone and their Aunt would be doing Kara Demons for free in every game.
Final Fantasy XV cinematic trailer titled “Dawn.”
More information regarding the trailer will be unveiled in the upcoming Active Time Report, scheduled for August 5, 2015, at 9:00 a.m. Pacific Daylight Time (PDT) / 12:00 p.m. Eastern Daylight Time (EDT).
I find that is often confusing Meta for the trill of competition.
I do understand you got to get in the technical side of the game to get competitive.
I used to go to weekly Magic the Gathering matches, some the people I play against do attend regionals and invitationals.
In a number of ways Magic gets just as if not more meta then fighting games.
The meta in TGC are more obvious and more forwards that Fighting games but there two vary different styles of games with very different factors.
In a TGC your collection, choices for your deck and a bit of blind luck goes into factor.
For the FGC its more eye-hand coordination and your skills at video gaming in general.
For both the meta goes into your strategy, how you go about your moves.
Like example before you finish planing out your Plan A you already have Plan B laid out, and then in mid match you end up pulling something else (something no one saw before) out of you ass right as the whole world is watching.
And easily a single match of Street Fighter IV has more strategy than a game of chess (although Chess gets more credit as its just mental strategy).
What I was saying in the end don’t get so lost in the Meta you forget the actual game, people forget the Game for what it is.
And people being more consistently able to do the move is a bad thing? I don’t know where you’re going with this.
Are you not able to throw Sonic Booms with [1]3 in SF? Because you’re able to do so in P4U and KOF, which is why you can combo Sonic Boom motions into Flash Kick motions. You can also do running Flash Kick in those games. I don’t know how SF’s input parser works, so I’m asking.
Anyway, don’t patronize me. I know why some moves are made charge moves, but I just don’t think that making a defensive poking character requires them to be a charge character, and there are ways to get similar effects to charge moves without making them charge.
The fact that standing 720 is possible kind of makes the “you need to jump first” restriction kind of moot. You’ve also got KOF characters that have one-frame super command grabs that don’t require you to jump because it’s HCB x 2, and it doesn’t cause egregious balance issues, so I don’t think the jumping restriction is particularly necessary in the first place. So the Demon doesn’t really need it either.
If Vega stays a motion character I’m playing him.
these mafia screens are looking great
You’re right that a defensive poking character doesn’t have to be a charge character, but that’s not even the point I was trying to make.
Let’s take your Nash Sonic Boom example. You increase the start-up. That balances it better for a motion character. But it greatly reduces its effectiveness in multiple ways. For one, you’re increasing its total frame count. This makes it much more vulnerable to you getting jumped on or it getting punished in general, which increases its risk. This also means that you can no longer use it for true blockstrings except maybe with heavy normals. The only benefit is that you aren’t restricted in when you can use it.
Changing a move from a charge move to a motion move changes the effectiveness and balance of a move in much greater ways than you’re willing to accept. If Guile was changed to a motion character he would function completely differently.
You completely missed my point. It’s not only about the “can’t do this while standing” thing. It’s the fact that it’s DESIGNED TO BE USED FOR KARA CANCELS! The input is meant so that you can’t just tick into it off of anything, e.g cr.lp, walk forward, raging demon. It’s meant to be used in specific situations, e.g. the multiple examples I gave you in my previous post that you ignored. Having the Raging Demon input makes it so Akuma can’t abuse it with his fast walkspeed, but in the situations you can use it, the raging demon input is faster than a 720 motion, or I’d argue even a double hcb motion.
Why are y’all arguing over this shit if you like the way things are in the old games and have a thousand reasons why it’s so good play them. You don’t even have to wait 9 mos to play them like those of us who are awaiting sf5 with bated breath. The whole point of a new game is that’s there’s new different things.
GET OUT OF HERE DAVID SIRLON. What is this nonsense?
What is this casual scrub bullshit? Complaining about inputs? Really?!
I thought this was SRK, not GameFaqs.
He plays ArcSys games… He knows not what he does.
This is worthy of a scrub quote real talk. Niggas are relly complaining about inputs like wtf
@eltrouble
@IFCYipeS
@“sanford kelly”
@JustinW
@MrWizard
Get this nigga
Well we do still have the scrubquotes thread if that’s what you want.