but jf.hk feels like it has more hit stun. Its much easier to do jf.hk - cst.hp, becaue it feels like there is more time. good to know then, if that isn’t the case and was just me.
the hit and blockstun on nj.HP,nj.HK,ji.HP,Ji.HK are exactly the same 18 hitstun, 15 blockstun,
nop block recovery is 2 (trip guard)
attack denial is 2 ,
those moves give you
+14 frame adv on hit if they are done meaty
+11 on block if they are done meaty
the thing is ji.hp has A LOT of downward extension can hit a standing opponent as early as 9 frames before landing, sometimes even more (T.hawk, seth, sagat, gief abel, vega)
also all four moves don’t have the same startup and nj.HK can almost not hit a grounded opponent meaty unless he is standing and tall
these 2 factors make people more comfortable with hitting meaty with one move and not the other,
people are more inclined to hit early with ji.HP because it is a good early jump in,
while ji.HK is mostly used at a range where it barely connects and where ji.HP whiffs which makes people more used to see it hit meaty and generate lot of frame adv.
ji.Hxxx >> front U1 works on the paper but the length of the motion and the extremely tight buffering leeway make it very difficult to pull IMHO.
Any top PSN Vega’s I can play? need the match-up exp…
gamertag is ShadowAce5O
where you located?
I decided to drop my previous main for Vega because I think he’s fun
He has.
Air Grab
Third Strike like Taunt (throw away mask/claw for damage/defense boost)
a Claw which is really cheap
My question is how do I play Vega?
I cant rush down with him or keep back well.
and I’m weak vs fireballs.
If there is one character who should never be weak against fireballs it is Vega. he has numerous tools to deal with them and both his ultras go through/under them.
The way you play Vega is pick him and go into the training room…eventually you’ll get better. There is a combo/tactic thread and also a match-up guide discussion, I suggest looking there.
If you can’t find a way to rush down with Vega then optimize his other tools, pokes and walk-speed. I personally like to rush down occasionally but other players point out this is highly dangerous, high risk, medium reward., and they’re right. Vega doesn’t need to rush down he just needs to frustrate, and then spot openings when the opponent gets irritated and comes after him.
You’d better learn how to block properly though, we have no get out of jail free shoryuken-type move, tag this along with no reliable AA and you have a character that very few brave to main, Street Fighter becomes much more tactical(to some less enjoyable) when playing as Claw.
Honestly though, if you’re saying that you want to main him because of a taunt and because a claw makes him “cheap” you have no idea what you’re in for. Vega is hands down the hardest character to master in the SF4 series, good luck.
Read this Guide, pretty much everything you need to know about Vega is there:
if you have a specific question after reading that, post it here =]
@VS Fireballs:
Vega has many many tools against fireballs, depends on the range you have different tools.
Up-close/in their face:
EX ST
U1 towards them (U1 is completely fireball invincible on the way up and the during the fly-off-the-wall animation.)
U2
KKK flip
Block, most fireballs arent safe on block upclose so you can net a free c.mp xx EX Dive
Mid-range/somewhat close:
FA, Vega’s FA has great range with the claw and if u time it right u can usually tag the opponent’s hand, assuming theyre still in the fireball animation.
FADC into HK or throw, depending on how close you are, or just FADC to close in and get some Ultra meter.
EX Roll, this is mostly useful when u predict a fireball rather than on reaction.
Jump in HP/HK, Vega’s Jump is fast and in this range a predictable fireball should be punished by your most damaging combo.
U2
s.MK to stuff the startup of their special.
Far/fullscreen away:
PPP/KKK flips, you gain nothing with this but you can escape blockstun/chip
EX SHC (to the wall behind you)
Walldive (also to the wall behind you)
U1
Walljump
it also depends on the character, i.e most of these dont work VS Guile coz the fucker has pretty much no recovery on his booms, while almost all of them will work amazingly on Ken coz his fireball is ass.
Experiment and use as you see fit.
Ok so I just have to abuse what I have and react/punish as Vega?
Besides my Claw range and throwing away my mask in some match ups when I have a sizable lead for damage boost, what can I abuse?
I already know his bread and butter poke combos and EX walldive combos (jab jab strong crouch) (and forward strong crouch)
people just block my pokes and then im too far away to do anything.
what do i do
What is your avatar from.
Also thanks for the info.
I thought I had to react and trade like Dhalsim with crouch fierce.
this makes things way easier
Honestly only time I ever intentionally do the Mask toss is when a Viper misses/whiffs an U1, Mask toss> U1 does massive damage (need claw on though).
after blocked Pokes you can do:
CH
Karathrow
s.MK
Roll (FADC into throw or pressure optional)
Walldive away
walk up into more pokes or whatever. Vega has the fastest walkspeed in the game, Use it.
as for the avatar, its Seikon no Qwaser =p
Okay thanks
also I like his air grab and A2A game.
time to hit training mode hard
Well, KKK flip to dodge a fireball is not a good idea IMO. Unless its a really fast fireball, lixe EX from Sagat or Ryu, you are going to get hit after the flip, because you will fall right into it. If you are on a pixel of life, full screen, and they are spamming fireballs, PPP flip > U1 works wonders, because when they see the PPP flip they have a false sense of safety and then they try to throw more fireballs to chip you, knowning that the recovery on that move sucks.
The PPP flip can be a really good bait, they never expect it, and when they see it, it takes a little time to your opponent react. I never saw any top Vega players doing that, but I like to do it once in a while. Maybe that is one of the reasons that I am not a top Vega player? heh
for top Vega players PPP flip is (or at least should be) an absolute taboo. there are gimmicks with it and some uses but its usually better to just forget that it exists. same applies to regular SHC if you ask me.
i never said that the flip is a good idea, especially upclose. it is however an option. you can usually use it from far away to frustrate your opponent (flip nonstop, some LK STs in there to gain meter), its pretty funny when you get a life lead against a Ryu or keep doing this till they leave an opening for EX dive to the face =p
upclose you can dodge a good amount of EX moves (seth’s, Rose’s, Gouken’s etc) and some HP ones too then punish, has to be early though (almost same time as the fireball startup)
Yes, I forgot about Pai’s beginner’s guide. A must-read for new Claws.
nothing, you have to abuse your opponents mistakes.
really? viper, guy and makoto are pretty hard for me to master.
…maybe Viper is up there with Vega, but it’s his lack of saftey options that make him more difficult imo. The 1-F jabs, defense lowered with no mask, no reliable AA, 2 very “situational” (i’m being nice here) ultras, no I-F special move (“what about flips?” lol) and some crappy HB make Vega a SOB to master. Def the hardest according to me. I don’t think anyone will argue he’s not top 5 in terms of difficulty to master though, so even if he’s not #1 according to everyone universally, he’s up there.
he is the hardest character to master because so much of your game play revolves around fundamentals. The spacing game is so hard in this game when your tool set is so limited.
LOL@ hardest to master, he’s not even top 10 in difficulty, the fuck? maybe in Vanilla coz he sucked donkey dick in that game but in Super/AE? Fuck no.
having few limited options is EASIER to master compared to a character with many many tools (i.e Akuma, Seth) as you have a smaller set of tools that you need to focus on and know how to use to their maximum, with Vega with you a few combos and karathrow pressure… that sums up 90% of Vega’s gameplay…
Having shitty options means you have to play in a more cautious manner, it can be harder compared to characters with better options but it doesnt make them more difficult to master, just means you need to know when to throw them out.
Viper, Gen, Makoto, Akuma, Ibuki, Juri, E.Ryu, Seth, Hawk… hell even fuckin Sakura is harder to master than Vega.
be it lots of tools, shitty health, ass options, or terrible matchups (or all of them, LOLgen)… Vega is a character that you can get into intermediate level with easily compared to most of the cast. you cant say he’s the hardest character when most his MUs are 5-5 and has no 8-2s while some characters have shitload of 7-3s…
he’s not exactly “easy” but he’s not hard either. relying on fundamentals is something you should be doing with pretty much all characters anyway, understanding how to use your tools -even the shitty ones- Levels up your game real fast. Having stupid good tools helps too but it doesnt mean you should ignore the basics.
and seriously people need to stop bitching about the no AA thing already, Vega has a shitload of AAs that you can work with, just coz he doesnt have a go-to invincible SRK doesnt mean that you should get jumped in on for free. Unless its off a knockdown you should never be jumped on as Vega.
his HP is 1000, thats the average of most of the cast, how is that crappy?
point is, Vega is a mid-tier character with a slightly above-average learning curve. he’s top 5 or even top 10 in difficulty.
^
IDK, Vega is all fundementals, and that is the hardest part of the game. Only character I would say is harder to master, well 2, is Zangief, Gen.
Gen because of stance switch, and essentially learning 2 characters with a few 1 frame links, and being a spacing dependent character like Vega, but with more stuff. And playing a proper Zangief with proper spacing and mind games takes time.
Vega isn’t hard combo wise, but is harder to use than Viper imo metagame wise.
Blanka is just as hard from what ive heard to. Sagat, well playin a proper Sagat is difficult as well.
IDK, you tell me. I said some of HB were crappy, never mentioned his health.
HB=Hit Box
He’s harder to master because it’s harder to stick with him than anyone else. I’ll come out and say maybe my wording was sloppy.
Viper, Juri, Makoto and all those characters you named might have more special moves, combos or whatever, but imo they are easier to stick with at the end of the day, because it’s just too incredibly easy to get frustrated playing as Vega and just switch to a different character, more so than anyone else. The frustration and patience factor has a bearing on a how difficult a character is to master.
Massive amounts of tools, combos and special moves doesn’t come into play with me as much, that’s memorization.
If you don’t have the fundamentals of SF down, you will fail as Vega, with other characters you can get away with not zoning properly, not reading jump-ins properly etc. If you can’t play tactically, more so than any other character in the game imo, you will fail as Vega.
But like I said, even if he’s not universally #1 in terms of difficulty, he’s def up in there.