awesome.
You are my hero. You may want to make start up, active and recovery frame collumns for when they become available. Or maybe just a frame advantage hit/block collumn. Not sure when we will get the data though.
You guys think Christie needs a lot of meter to work?
Because besides EX Stinger for defense and mixups I don’t really see any reason to use meter (except for the occasional tag cancel of course). But she deals decent meterless damage and can always raw tag/launcher for free so I don’t really see her as meter dependent.
Not at all. She only really needs meter for big punish / damage situations, but aside from that she’s perfectly fine.
Any combo ending in hcb+lp is a free safe tag for no meter. Every time. : )
Yeah and the hilarious thing is everything she does can end with xx LP Stinger: BnBs, post-launch, AA, A2A, even random trades lol. Basically, if you land anything at all you always have the option to keep her in or switch for free. That’s pretty significant.
Just so that we’re clear, there is no safe meterless pressure from her hand stand follow ups. This is a significant realization that Christie players should get down early IMO. Stop bad habits now.
Heli - whiffs on crouchers.
Batucada - unsafe, puts you back in handstand
Perch flop - unsafe, still in handstand
Front stinger - unsafe
Ex, same deal. Batucada pushes back but still a free jump in (even worse).
Her headstand is for combos. Hit confirm into it and occasionally a gimmicky overhead… Maybe a switch. Correct me if I’m wrong.
Her wheel kicks feel like this.
Lp -3+. Dpable
Mk/hk/ex. -2
Ryu couldn’t punish with jab or dp but Christie couldn’t keep pressure with any button. Ryu could always mash jabs between strings.
Her headstand feint works well depending what you did going into it.
C.hp - no good.
S.mp - no good
Negativa to armada - good
Negativa to meia-lua - no good
One two elbows - no good
Gancho chibata - no good
F.hk - No good
Rastella to circle kick - no good. This string is not bad as it is fairly safe on block. Last hit can be hit through by invincible moves. (ex dp)
Rastella chibata - no good. This is an overhead, so it can be used for pressure. On hit you seem either +1, or even. Ryu can dp, but cannot jab. I think Christie’s low jab is 4 maybe 5 frames.
Rastella to low kick 2- no good cant handstand. unsafe on block. By at least 5 frames. (c.mk punish)
Rastella to Heran bago - cannot go into headstand. No good. But is a nice mix up, leads to wall bounce… Much like a kazuya string. On block I cannot dp and I can’t mash jab after. Seems pretty safe. Can be mashed through the string. The last hit can be ex dp’d. Your goal with this string is to make them afraid of the low attacks so they block low. Last hit overhead.
Hmmm. So I started thinking. These are the strings.
%=[C.lp, s.mk, c.hk]
From here can do two things.
- %, c.mk, c.hk
- %, s.hk xx hcb+k.
They both remind me of kazuya string mix up. Unsafe in some ways but are a 50/50 for both users. Both look fairly similar and have highs and lows. 1) low, low, high. 2)low, break, low.
These are deceptive in so many ways. If you do 1) and they block it all, you’re safe. Start a new string unless they mash through the string with meter. Dps will trade with final hit and they get wall bounce.
2)if you don’t wanna take the risk you could always cadc (just when my iPhone learned fadc… It wants to auto correct to it, haha), and be like -1 or -2.
I dunno. Discuss amongst yourselves.
If you chain into that sweep you are unsafe, really unsafe. If you want to dedicate to that go ahead.
Her 2 overheads are safe. Hand stand and toward and qbc+p, both are good mixup tools if you are playing with low pokes.
You are looking at the uses for baracuda and helicopter kicks wrong i feel. Helicopter kicks is a decent AA against characters with awkward jump arcs that screw c.fierce.(I.E. Rufus, Bison) Baracuda kicks I feel is her exchange on block tool, However I wouldn’t use it unless I absolutely had to.
Also saying it’s good depending on what you get into it, you say it like you are right in people’s faces doing it. You should be poking and using it at ranges. Her pokes are solid, really solid.
S.forward->forward chain, far good poke string safe and confirmable if it hits.
Cr.forward, good poke, self explainatory.
St.short, Rediculiously good poke, AA’s dive kick pressure from rufus, safe on block really far, hard to whiff punish etc.
cr.short, same thing
Outside of slide for going under fireballs sometimes, these are the only buttons you really should be poking with.
Up close, things like short are still amazingly great.
st.short, same as her farshort.
st.strong, really good button leaves you at +1 if not, even.
Cr.Fierce, really good counterpoke if it counter pokes anything that is free ex cartwheel kicks from anyrange it hit.
s.forward, 2 hit normal, un throwable, speciall cancellable.
St.jab-> forward+strong [TC,] leaves you with a regular strong, which is already a good normal.
Also forward + HK is safe so throwing it out, it crouches under high pokes and there is no point in feinting out of it.
All and all her over head in handstand is safe. I don’t know why you are deeming it like nothing in handstand is safe. when this one thing is the mixup becomes either you feint out or you dedicate to something which the only thing I would dedicate to in the first place is toward overhead out of heandstand.
Some random lab notes: (Sorry if some of this was already mentioned)
-cs.mk seems to be airborne for some frames so you can’t get thrown if you use it at the right time. Nice frame trap poke but unsafe on block unless you tag cancel it. cs.mk is still unsafe even if you CADC, cancel into any special or stance feint (unless I’m doing it wrong). The only thing I found to make cs.mk safer on block (but still punishable) is to chain into sweep. It puts Christie right out of most crouching forwards and the most you’ll take as punish is a sweep or a projectile which isn’t a big deal unless it’s a Super.
-For some reason I’m getting more counter hits using s.hp instead of cs.mk. And unlike cs.forward, s.hp (2 hits) xx CADC backward is 99% safe. The only punish I was able to do with Ryu was Super. s.hp is -3 on hit but s.hp xx CADC forward leaves Christie at +0.
-s.hp xx Launcher xx Switch is kinda interesting on block. It’s technically unsafe and leaves your running partner at -4. But the thing is Christie is pushed back enough so that your partner can cancel his run short with an early poke/counter/teleport so you can always be safe and potentially get them to whiff a reversal or a poke.
-Wheel Kicks have low crush properties. So they can be used to blow up cr.forwards. Though their start up is slow so you need to condition them to hesitate first. I haven’t had much success vs crouch techs though. Even EX Wheel Kicks is too slow and they can usually block in time after they whiff crouch tech.
Unique normals & Target Combos:
Island Mirage (f.mk)
Goes into hand stand. Looks like an overhead but isn’t. Haven’t found a good use for it aside from counter poking. Seems a little useless to me considering you can cancel Negativa to Armada into handstand stuff anyway. And c.lp, s.mk is safer too.
Gancho Chibata (fs.mk, mk)
The second hit is chain cancellable and special cancellable. 100% safe on block. Puts Christie out of sweep range unless done from closer.
Good way to tag cancel in footsies since Christie is pushed back far away. Partner can stop his run short to remain safe.
Satellite Moon Hot Plate Special (f.hk, hk)
See my post on the previous page
One Two Elbows (s.lp, f.mp)
Haven’t found a good use for it. You can’t go from this into a chain or raw launcher. But you can still special cancel it.
Negativa to Armada (cr.lp, s.mk)
Christie’s best target combo and hit confirm. Safe on block.
c.lp, s.mk xx CADC forward leaves Christie at -3 on hit and on block.
c.lp, s.mk xx LP Stinger is a true blockstring. So hit confirm with j.mk, c.lp, s.mk. On hit, cancel into LP/MP Wheel Kicks/Handstand stuff or go for a follow up target combo. On block, cancel into LP Stinger to remain safe or go for a follow up target combo.
After c.lp, s.mk xx LP Stinger on block, Christie is at perfect range for a j.mk cross-up or a c.lk/s.lk (whiffs unless they crouch or throw something out). Or you can throw a c.lp and buffer a chain to fish for CH vs cr.forward. At this range she can also reach with s.hp, fs.mkx2, fs.hk and f.hk but those all lose to crouching forward.
If you immediately follow up the blocked LP Stinger with another LP Stinger, Christie quickly moves out of Ryu’s cr.forward range and hits before he can block. Raw Launcher can also be tempting to use at this range but it’s still very unsafe. Even if Ryu can’t reach with sweep, he can still walk forward and punish with a full combo. So if you do use raw launcher for frame traps and such, make sure you have meter to tag cancel. Christie’s launcher has nice pushback on block so partner can stop his run short.
Negativa to Armada can be followed up with d.HK (hits low).
Armada to Rasteila (c.lp, s.mk, d.hk)
Safe on block. Puts you at sweep range. Last hit is low.
Can be followed up with LK, MK or HK. Follow ups can be delayed by a few frames to leave a bigger gap. If chained only the MK follow up is a true blockstring.
Rasteila Chibata (c.lp, s.mk, d.hk, lk)
Last attack hits twice and is overheadx2. Unsafe if overhead is blocked but special cancelable on the first or second hit.
Good tag cancel but running partner is not quite safe on block unless you stop short and use a counter/teleport. On hit, partner can combo with a 4f normal.
Nice mixup with Twister Sweep. Especially EX version which can be tag canceled for damage resets or setups.
The opponent can mash c.lp/c.mk in the gap right before the overheads. If you expect them to press buttons during the gap you can try to punish their cr.forward with s.lk/fs.mk/s.hp/launcher. You can also wait a few ticks for them to whiff and counter poke with f.mk xx whatever (note: too far away for helicopter/batucada to hit but you can f.mk xx d.K xx Switch, f.mk xx LP Stinger or LP/MP Wheel Kicks).
Alternatively, you can slightly delay the hk or mk, hk follow ups after d.hk. This will effectively beat any 3-4 frame normals they try squeeze in between the gap and since hk is special cancellable and mk,hk gives you a wall bounce, it means you get a full combo if they try to poke.
Rasteila to Low Kick 2 (c.lp, s.mk, d.hk, mk)
Last two attacks hit low so it’s a mixup with lk overhead but unsafe on block and not special cancellable.
Can be followed up with MK or HK.
MK follow up doesn’t do anything and is -4 on block.
HK follow up wall bounces on hit or trade, hits overhead and is safe on block but not cancellable. Funfact: if Ryu mashes shoryuken in the gap, you still trade and get a wall bounce (doesn’t work vs all reversals though: Cammy’s Cannon Spike beats hk follow up clean).
Rasteila to Circle Kick (c.lp, s.mk, d.hk, hk)
Last hk doesn’t combo but is special cancellable. Completely safe on block. Some reversals can mash between though but not pokes.
Rasteila to Circle Kick xx CADC forward leaves Christie at around -3 on hit and on block.
EX Wheel Kicks is not -2 because Cammy can Cannon Spike. So EX Wheel Kicks is -4 on block.
I tried this in training mode and Ryu could DP.
[media=youtube]JOKN8n5emGc[/media] combo video for christie,guy found some interesting stuff for tag combos
Well I said using it for pressure is useless. As for the front stinger, that is not the results I had. I’ll be glad to try it again but it was not safe on block when I tried it earlier.
You said tag exchange and anti air for the rest of the handstand follow up’s. That’s my point. You shouldn’t be going into handstand willy nilly in hopes of opening someone up. Demo… If the front stinger is safe as you say I’ll definitely retract it.
As for c.lp, smk xx handstand feint not being safe I couldn’t punish it with reversal dp. Again I’ll try it.
Anyways. Played a lot of ranked with Christie. I found her targets unsafe except for her elbow tc, mkx2, and c.lp, s.mk. I found it easy to her her f.hk, hk. Seems to go with what you guys were saying.
Any reversals other than ex stinger with a damn? What are the tag combos you’re using?
I’m afraid not. None of her reversals are strike invincible except for EX Stinger and Super/Cross-Art. So we’re gonna have to learn how to block well and alpha counter at the right times. Her AC isn’t amazing but it’s pretty fast and can punish jump ins and cross-ups. Sadly, you can’t combo after cross-cancel xx Switch but at least it sends them full screen and allows you to raw tag/store a counter hit.
EX Hand Stand is apparently projectile invincible so it could be good vs meaty projectile pressure. Haven’t tested it much though.
Post Launch:
-s.hp xx LP/HP Stinger
-f.hk, hk (launcher specific)
-s.hp/c.hp xx Wheel Kicks or Perch Flop Kick for quickstand setups
Switch cancels:
-Negativa Armada xx MP Wheel Kicks xx Switch
-Negativa Armada xx Helicopter/Batucada xx Switch
-Rasteila Chibata xx EX Twister Sweep xx Switch
Post Switch:
-f.hk, hk (for juggle tags)
-s.hp xx Launcher or s.hp xx LP Wheel Kicks, c.lp, s.mk xx Stinger (for short stand tags)
-nj.hk, fs.mk, mk, s.hp xx Launcher or nj.hk, fs.mk, mk xx LP Wheel Kicks, c.lp, s.mk xx Stinger (for long stand tags)
What would people think of a Christie/Nina team? Looking for the best DLC character to gel with her. Does she have a reversal?
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Vulcan Hades, If thats all she can do after a launcher then I consider her not really a second character. I think she probably would do best as a point character. Furthermore, she might be best used on a team in which a launcher isn’t used to tag her in (Ken, Steve, Kazuya, etc).
Im curious about her helicopter/tag setups with Juri. Juri really does a lot of damage when a partner doesn’t use a launcher and tags out.
Another question, after a HIT with helicopter, what are we positive? Can we unstance and be safe? Do I have to switch to stay safe?
Christie is at least -7 after a Helicopter on hit. Doesn’t matter how fast you get out of hand stand, you still get blown up by a full combo if you don’t switch cancel.
EDIT: Hmm, actually… You’re only super punishable if you get out of handstand. But you can go into another almost immediate handstand move. For example: Helicopter > Helicopter has like a tiny gap. Some reversals can mash through but not 3f pokes. Helicopter > Batucada blows up 3f jab/short mashing.
My team im currently using is Christie/Lars with Christie on point and yeah like Kail said I don’t consider her an anchor. When it comes to tag cancel combos it’s really Lars doing the damage whether its getting taged in or out. It’s kool though because Im still gonna play them. I really like the both of them.
@ Vulcan Hades yeah man that sucks…I was testing it out in the lab too and yeah even super’s punish that shit. I guess should avoid helicopter huh ?
interesting little gimmick I found in training mode today. Land a HCB P Overhead in the corner dash 3 times and you will appear on the opposite side of the opponent as he wakes up. Not sure if this is already known. Sorry if it is!
Womp, nevermind its character specific. I only discovered it on Blanka. Tested it on other characters, did not work.
I’m surprised Christie isn’t more popular. She’s good and fun to use. Plus she’s super hot lol.
Easier to mash c.lk with Cody I guess. :rolleyes:
Yea she’s is dope I love the mind games u can play with her. Lately I have been using wheel kicks as a nice trap. I like doing j.hk c.HP light wheel kicks. Its nice because if they block the j.hk and the c.HP I can hold wheel kick to bait out a jab. It beats out everytime!!! I’m pretty sure mashed dps would beat that set up but it hasn’t happen yet. Also I dunno if this has been mentioned but j.lk is GDLIKE!!! Air to air its pretty amazing. Anyways I’m loving my Christie. We need more tech for her. SourDeeeee
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So I went into training mode and put the CPU on hardest and let Christie go nuts. Found out that you can cancel stinger into handstand. I’m not really sure how useful this can be but cancelling a special move into another special move doesn’t sound to bad mix-up wise. Also I didn’t check to see if cancelling the start up of stinger still builds meter. I do know that it moves her backwards, however.
BTW, that’s usually how I learn what a character can or can’t do, by watching CPU fight. I also found out that the third hit of Satellite Moon Hot Plate Special (f+RH > RH) is an overhead. A little gimmicky but it’s something worth noting.
Edit: Also, I wish there was a trial that used j.MP as an air to air, because I would’ve never known it ground bounces if it weren’t for the CPU.