yeah…sorta my feelings. People aren’t ‘surprised’ to see Gen or Vega “roll” into a FADC throw…to watch Gief do something to a similar effect however will catch people off guard. I’m sure as well that using UD’s O-S guide that again against certain charcters you can connect it once, then on reset of mix-up, stop the jump-up/back into more mix-up shennanigans. Its just another tool to catch people off guard.
+1 for the orwell reference dark paraiah
Yeah I tested this a few times and got it to work twice out of five attempts. He definitely didn’t expect it, but still hit me out of it the first two times (did it twice in about 30 matches and he stopped me both times), but -8 is still a long time like I thought.
On another guy though I hit it 2/3 times. Guess it just depends on the player, but that was my fear. A gimmick, but I guess it’s decent. I just thought the way it was described that it was a really good thing to FADC, not a trick to pull out once in a while.
Oh well, figured it out though. Kinda neat.
So on the splash, you’re fadc’ing with a forward dash to spd? That seems like the dash will get you punished every time. At least with anyone with any reaction time. How many recovery frames will they have? Is it a really small window? I’ll play with it when I go home tonight.
Well it’s on the crouching fierce. So it’s c.HP FADC -> SPD or whatever.
But ON HIT the c.HP only has 21 frames of hitstun. And Zangief’s dash is 26 frames, and by FADCing it you add 3 frames. So you’re cancelling a 21 hitstun move into a 29 frame dash to do something. Even ON HIT it leaves you at -8, and that -8 comes after a 29 frame dash. So they’ve got a pretty big window to see what you’re doing if they’re paying attention.
I mean, I suppose it works sometimes but as many times as I’ve tried to sneak it in against different people it never quite works enough to warrant the half meter to do it.
Yeah I know the crouching fierce is canceled, I was just confused as to the forward dash since you’re at a net loss of frames. I can’t see that working against a good player, but you can bet at the next local tourney it will be used as a first round funtime trick, assuming I get seeded. More for fun though 
Kinda like how I only use splash KKK, fadc ex banishing against those I know I have no chance of losing to.
i guess same thing applies to lariat fadc
block stun is 20f
ex spd/ex 360k/720 are better options if the opponent doesn’t react to the dash.
C.FP into FADC forward is a gimmick.
Lariat into FADC forward is also a gimmick.
The gimmick works sometimes b/c people don’t expect gief to FADC (especially from C.FP).
You can also hold the focus attack or dash backwards. This can punish common retaliations to Gief’s laggy moves: throw or uppercut.
Lariat cancelling isn’t that bad though, b/c your lariat is just punishable if it’s blocked. It’s certainly no worse that throwing out random EX hand and FADC’ing back.
If you do something like J.LK, C.LK xx KKK lariat… if a Sagat blocks it, he can just uppercut FADC you.
That same uppercut would whiff if you FADC’d the lariat backwards.
Also, in they are cornered, with 3 meters, you can PPP lariat their wake up and FADC back.
If they did anything but invincible reversal-> get hit, then do EX hand.
If they blocked, your dash back still is in range for jab spd. (but you are unsafe by -9 or so, just at SPD range away).
Just more shenanigans to add to the list.
Oh, if you do any one of these shenanigans, it doesn’t really need to be said to go for Atomic Suplex or Ultra.
Regular SPD just doesn’t have the post grab wakeup options to make it worth it.
tried them… never worked once…
some guy tried it on me
didn’t work even with my slow reaction time…
Well, what did he do? Throw? Uppercut? Jab? Ultra?
You have options from a focus attack cancel than can deal with some of those, you know.
Let me explain.
If the player usually responds by mashing jab or throw, a cancel into lvl 1 focus attack will likely counter hit them and cause crumple.
Lariat does 20 frames of block stun, lvl 1 focus attack starts up in 23 frames… they have basically 3 frames to attack you if they have perfect reversal timing.
Uppercut? Back dash that ish.
Chun Li’s ultra? Whoops.
I should have clarified.
I was talking about the gimmicky c.hp or lariat FADC into whatever.
That did not land at all.
I was talking about the same thing.
If you do lariat or C.HP into FADC, you have 3 options:
These different options beat or lose to different opponent reactions. Certain situations, no option is safe.
Also, if you use lariat on an opponents wakeup (advisable against characters like Viper) or in an unconfirmed combo (Example, J.LK, C.LK xx KKK lariat), the lariat is unsafe if blocked. (Many characters can at least ultra you)
Why not FADC it to give yourself more options, and make the opponent think about what they do instead of auto punish?
Obviously, the Lariat/C.FP dash forward is a gimmick and won’t work too much against good players.
Any option isn’t very good against characters with far and fast punishers (supers).
NOTE
As a rule, I don’t really suggest unsafe tactics very often. Jumping usually gets you killed, and random Green Hands and S.HK’s will get you destroyed as well.
That’s because these options don’t really make your opponents think.
You did random hand or EX hand? Throw in the corner.
You jumped against Sagat? F+HK into Pain
You jumped on Ken? MP Shoryu.
Short Jump/Normal Jump and the length of J.HP make certain characters think (Sim, Guile, Boxer)… so jumping is good against them.
So… my point is, doing this can force your opponent into making a decision, as opposed to just reacting with X move.
It was a mirror match, and he woke up lariat FADC foward dash and somehow i just instinctively did a ex spd…
I did a c.hp FADC foward on a blocked akuma, and he just dp’d me on reaction.
I’ve tried lariat FADC and I had a hard time confirming whether I hit or not. 
I’ll get it with more practice I guess.
Good idea on the regular/short jump thing. I randomly do it with knee crossup/fake crossup. Never intentionally did it cuz I still can 360 or short short without knowing which side i’m on.
I did realize I have to vary my jump ins. so they would have a hard time judging distance and think about how to AA.
I was so frustrate a while ago now I’m beginning to see some lights.
A well timed lvl fa 3 on a knockdown gives you a free crumble.
You should always play like your in a tournment get rids of all those BAD HABITS then you can start doing random things once in a while to mindfuck ppl
These kinda tricks would never work gief vs gief… b/c his initial reaction (EX Spd) beats all of your options.
Free in the same sense as inputting 360+P gives you a “free” SPD. :wtf:
Lvl 3 Focus attack take 65 frames to charge up. The only moves that provide knockdown for that long are atomic suplex and ultra, and the only times those will land you close enough to connect a FA on their wakeup are when you get cornered by the move.
Oh yeah, and there’s also the fact that you have announced what you’re going to do for a full second.
their ultra > your lvl 3 FA…then you have a bunch of chars who can simply TP away…
I guess my thing with the c.fp FADC is its merely trick to addto the repetoire…period. IT doesn’t do anything for rankings or making Gief unbeatable or anything like that, its another option…period. Think about the mind-fukery possible with it. Your doing best out of 3 with a Ryu player…if you get a splash…you might go into either a tick setup or BnB. Ryu has seen most if not all of them…if you start the BnB, he will either hold d/b in case your execution is ‘meh’, or he’ll mash d/f FP for a DP on ‘meh’ execution. So you’ve trained him into guarding the BnB, now follow up the next splash attempt with a c.FP and FADC back. They do a DP that just completley whiifs and gets punished by retaliation of choice. Next splash do the samething but FADC foward. After the hard retaliation hey are thinking twice about DPing after the C.FP, and you’ve just created a new mix-up oppurtunity.
shrug
I know for a thread that’s 6 years old. But its interesting, how knowledge changes over time.
Zangief’s Focus Attack is very viable. It’s strength is it has GREAT range.
I would rate it as one of the primary safe tools in the neutral footsie game: All four lights + far MP + Focus Attack.
It’s main purpose is to counter non EX fireballs, and about every character’s single hitting standing heavy pokes (HP or HK). Charge just to Level 2, and back dash out. Takes 20 frames to reach Level 2. Release immediately on absorb, confirm crumple and forward dash, or back dash on hit, if only Level 1. You’ll be -10 frames but spaced far, so in most cases you should be safe. Obviously caution against armour breakers and ultras.
It’s very useful, to counter Seth’s long HP from way down town, release ASAP on contact, and forward dash, to be -10 frames. Timing is a bit stricter than countering other heavy pokes. Try it.