USF4 Sim Sucks

[Shinji_Mimura]

Things not being discussed in the Dhalsim forum: Arturo Sanchez winning last week’s NLBC and Filipino Champ winning Alpha Clash 13.

Maybe, if Dhalsim is just “so awful”, yet these two manage to win tournaments with him, the problem here isn’t Dhalsim…

[Cheech_Wizard]

^I didnt watch Alpha Clash but I know Arturo didnt really encounter any of sims terrible matchups at NLBC. When he had to play Rico Suave he picked Rose (Abel is even more of an unwinnable matchup for Sim now). I heard PR Rog played Evil Ryu vs Fchamp which is an easier matchup compared to Balrog imo.

So they both won one weekly. Even so, with the skill those two players have, they should be winning majors imo. But they cant because Dhalsim sucks. Fchamp isnt gonna main him anymore and I think LuckyD is dropping him? I think most Sim players are finally moving on. At this point there really is no point playing him.

[Hardc0re]

Super can no longer be activated when a yoga fire is on the screen. I don’t recall seeing this mentioned anywhere. Bummed

Its true, i just tested it.
This is a HUGE nerf to his gameplay. Its the final nail in the coffin…
And they didnt even put it in the changelog. So dissapointed with Capcom

wait… what???

Yup… Because Dhalsim is too strong!

Things not being discussed in the Dhalsim forum: Arturo Sanchez winning last week’s NLBC and Filipino Champ winning Alpha Clash 13.

Maybe, if Dhalsim is just “so awful”, yet these two manage to win tournaments with him, the problem here isn’t Dhalsim…

Do you work at Capcom?

[dELfONiK]

Who are some of y’all using as a secondary?

I’m trying to pick up another character for Sim’s bad matchups and I’m having a hard time deciding. Kind of thinking Zangief since he looks like a good compliment (on paper), but just wanted to see who others use.

[Hardc0re]

Hugo

[DhalRog]

rufus does really well against yun, yang, cammy, abel, makoto imo

[LockM]

“USFIV Sim sucks”

Good!

[SimSimIV]

So here are my thoughts on USF4 sim:

Good buffs:
-b.hp has faster start up = easier to land b.hp xx mp flame combo after iat
-Damage buff on st.hp and b.hk is good

Bad buffs:
-ex blast seems the same. Not much changed with the hitbox buff (If it is even there)
-Ex flame range: It’s better, but can still whiff at max range b.mk
-Ex flame juggle: Does nothing for me what so ever. You can’t ever juggle b.mk after an iat combo. Very inconsistent and character dependent when it comes to window you can juggle in.
-Shangrila: They barely buffed the range at all. It’s almost not noticable. Like 1 small square in the training room
b.mk decreased push back: Ultradavid found that this only works on crouching opponents. This is probably not intended and makes this buff pretty bad.

Nerfs:
-ex flame damage nerf from 140->100 (From the arcade version of USF4). The juggle potential does not justify this nerf, as the juggle barely works.
-Sim can no longer super while he has a fireball on screen. This really sucks for him. Can’t super when u1 is on screen either.

I really dislike Sim in USF4, and I don’t feel the delayed wake up does much for me either (And it really hurts my fireball set ups)

[LuckyD]

Hey guys a couple of thoughts:

1. I think Sim is stronger in this version, BUT STILL HAS BAD MATCHUPS obviously. If you want to do well in tournament, you HAVE to have an alt. I have been playing a TON of Thawk

Why Hawk? One, Hes really strong. Two, hes really easy to learn quickly Three (AND MOST IMPORTANT) Its very very easy for me to convince myself “Hey, I should be playing Thawk/Sim in this match up”. No more of this glaring question in the back of my head, should I just be maining this char? Its working really well for my mental health of the char select screen.

2. Sim is possibly the best fireball char in the game. With sim fp buff and Guile/Sagat nerfs, sim might be the best fireball character.

3. lkxxxExflame is now +2 on block, so while its not a block string still/combo its a really stronger get off me move.

4. I LOVE delay wake up. Against some chars it doesn’t do THAT much (which is why I won’t play sim vs abels/hakans) But some like Akuma, its just a new tool.

5. Wake up red focus could have hidden potential for sim. Just like the utilities of wake up U1, wake up red focus might give sim a decent new wake up option. I’ve been messing with delay wake up with wake up u1 and red focus vs meaty oriented chars like dudley.

Overall I think sim is STRONGER in this game, but in order to win tournaments, we should all have an alt for the really tough ones.

I’m trying to keep an eye on this thread, happy to theory fight with the sim brothers/sisters

[LuckyD]

And quick note, Arturo WON NLBC. If you look at the bracket, he got ALL sim good matchups/playables EXCEPT for rico…in which he played rose.

Sim can be used for something 80% of the matchsup in the game, so learn and alt, and give yourselves a chance if your a tournament player <3

[Komatik]

Although my heart wants to say Sim is ass, my head says differently.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NcBoXR8aFgw

I can’t watch Mochi tear apart everybody who joins in that video, while chatting away about matchups with Kazunoko, and think Sim is low tier. And don’t tell me he’s playing scrubs, because I’m sure they are better than the folks you play online.

When I think about how I play, and then watch Mochi, who rarely uses EX moves and lands a super in nearly every round, I have to blame myself. He has flawless execution and everything is spaced perfectly.

I never knew mk slide into lk slide ->super was a combo, when I first saw Mochi land that I assumed it was off a counter hit, so I practiced it that way, turns out its just a combo.

My point is that Sim has the easiest to land super in the game by FAR, and it does big damage, Mochi’s game plan is always to get super and land it as quickly as possible. As soon as he has it the dives and slides come out, now that I know it’s possible I see him fishing for that mk slide super combo whenever hes stocked. Now that I’ve started playing more like that I’m winning far more. Plenty of you probably already play that way I’m sure but it was just a wakeup call for me to realise how stuck in my ways i’d become blaming Sim.

Until I can perform like that, I won’t be blaming Sim anymore. And I wish that we could all just come together and stockpile our knowledge to make the best of him, as fellow Sim players I wish we could all get up and have a knowledge gangbang instead of a whine, but this site sees zero positive discussion anymore and it makes me sad. I believe this character has so many odd little quirks and tricks that if you know them all, you can make it damn hard for anybody to beat you.

Let’s start ultra matchup threads and get sexy together.

I think Mochi is a bit of a special case because he’s Just That Good.

To elaborate, the way I’ve always put it is that Sim used to be a top tier character and it shows. So many tools and surprising mobility. Yet he’s pretty bad - fragile, low damage, has problems with upclose defense and is just kinda wonky and slow in some ways. If you think Akuma vortexing Makoto as an example: Akuma has a million options that can shut down everything Makoto wants to do… except one thing. Whatever setup with whatever OS backups get chosen, there’s always one option that slips through, and if Makoto finds that one option out of many, she’s out. Sim is, design-wise, Makoto in that vortex applied to the neutral game and in some ways Akuma-esque toolset. You’re never truly out, but because you’re always threading the needle, you eventually just get blown out.

It’s why Sim is good for Mochi. Mochi is Just That Good, and Sim almost always has an option, even if it’s really, really hard. And Mochi is good enough to find that option.

Or to put it bluntly: Sim goodness chart:
Noob = Play Sim, people die because they don’t know what they’re doing.
Huge gulf where Sim is horrible.
Godlike = Sim begins to work again??? O_o

[Komatik]

Hey guys a couple of thoughts:

1. I think Sim is stronger in this version, BUT STILL HAS BAD MATCHUPS obviously. If you want to do well in tournament, you HAVE to have an alt. I have been playing a TON of Thawk

Why Hawk? One, Hes really strong. Two, hes really easy to learn quickly Three (AND MOST IMPORTANT) Its very very easy for me to convince myself “Hey, I should be playing Thawk/Sim in this match up”. No more of this glaring question in the back of my head, should I just be maining this char? Its working really well for my mental health of the char select screen.

2. Sim is possibly the best fireball char in the game. With sim fp buff and Guile/Sagat nerfs, sim might be the best fireball character.

Last I asked you, you were against getting an alt for bad matchups. Good to see you come around and hope that you’ll resume winning a crapton.

2. This is probably just true. Art’s NLBC win vs. Nick Hero after he realized he should throw fireballs is a pretty nice demonstration on how fizzling fireballs can actually be a good thing. A shoto could never throw that many fireballs because he’d have to wait for the fireball to go offscreen. And the heinous spam Art did builds shittons of meter for supers and ex upblast.

[Hardc0re]

I’m back to playin Dhalsim as well because some matchups are unwinnable with Hugo.
But not being able to punish someone jumping a yoga fire using a Super will take some time getting used to.

But I think Dhalsim and Hugo makes a pretty good duo. I’m happy that I finally found another character to play with, because I’m a Dhalsim-only player since vanilla.

[GearType]

Holy cow that dude is good with Dhalsim. All while chatting it up.

[Cheech_Wizard]

‘-Back+LK reduced recovery frame from 8 to 7, increased frame advantage from 2 to 3’

Thats all we get in this new Ultra patch. Thats it. GGs.

[Marmalade_Jones]

Look at the bright side Cheech. He should be able to combo into lp.flame from a counterhit and into other 3 frame normals from a regular hit ( I think).

Ch B.lk- st.lpxxex.flame - limb.

I’m hitting the lab tomorrow.

[Cheech_Wizard]

^If you find any unlisted changes post em in here.

[Hardc0re]

You can probably link b.LKs into themselves right? Since it’s a 3f move with +3 on hit now. at least we can push back a bit better.
The problem is that is unplinkable 1-frame link unless you use select.

[Agilo]

You can probably link b.LKs into themselves right? Since it’s a 3f move with +3 on hit now. at least we can push back a bit better.
The problem is that is unplinkable 1-frame link unless you use select.

LuckyD told me today that UltraDavid let him know you can plink command normals (i.e., b.lk) with any higher priority button. That means you don’t need to plink with select!
Edit: source: https://twitter.com/ultradavid/status/544604675941494786

[Marmalade_Jones]

I was wrong about lp flame comboing from CH b.lk. If there was one more frame of hitstun, it would work. So far I’ve found no hidden buffs. It looks like im finally going to learn how to plink though.