Ultra changes (location test)

[star]

First Vega footage, thanks for that!

Edit ( ) The Dee Jay Player would have eaten a counter hit in AE v2012 too in all cases there. So far no sign of a shortened non-FADC RCF on block.

[Kuroi_Aima]

Reiketsu
"(Claw)'s adjustments barely keep me interested"

RIP

[Vegaman]

The problem of this problem (which makes it a solution) is that i-frames on EX-ST would still not make it an AA(assuming its only 1-4f). If you want to take advantage of the single active frame that is invencible you are going to need a really precise timing and spacing. It would also lose to empty jumps as well.

EX-ST would help Claw to be able to react to bullshit like Air/Jaguar Kicks, wheel kicks and so on.

To add to this, it’s also not FADC-able, nor can it be comboed from after either.

@Emersion‌ I’ve yet to ever see a build or version of Vega that even remotely approaches “OP” or “Broken.” When all 3 of his main issues are addressed then it can realistically be brought up. Until then, I see the stupid tools and options other characters have and just can’t see a valid argument for it at all.

[Scanman]

Doesn’t low forward > low fierce combo? If anything, it’s a better meterless punish than low forward > low strong.

That’s the only use for low fierce that I know of.

[Buddha_s_Weapon]

Friend made this video for me using the new super change & focus system. Looks pretty cool.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwyjq9Vyln8

[Gunner_Thor]

The combo possibilities are going to be interesting, I’m looking forward to messing around in the training room in June.

[Moonchilde]

That looks good and all but it still doesn’t address any of his issues that he’s had in the last 5 iterations of the game.

[WA_Bandit]

So, I hate to reiterate or go on about some stuff any Vega player has seen 1,000 times, but this particular build of Vega (the upcoming Ultra build) has really got me scratching my head.

Mini key for this sad tangent:

• = Good/Indifferent. (In my personal opinion)
  ~ = What? (I’m not understanding, so someone please explain the benefit to these tweaks like I’m 5 years old.)

The Ultra tweaks I’ve read to date so far…

Mask pick up: Mask must be picked up with 2+PP*
Crouching heavy punch: Attack is active longer (2F->4F)*
EX Rolling Crystal Flash: Advantage on hit reduced (4F->2F)~
Bloody High Claw: Hitbox extended on the top of the attack*
Splendid Claw: Starts up faster (8F->7F)*
Super Barcelona Drop: Hits on the way up*
Super Barcelona Drop: Damage has been reduced (100100200->100100100)*
Super Barcelona Drop: Gauge is lost when the super is inputted*

Let’s go over all the positive tweaks, or at least the ones I feel are alright, shall we?

• Mask Pick-Up: I love the 10% for 10% trade, especially if I have the meter and health advantage, and use this when I’m feeling that my footsie game can close the deal with the damage trade. Fine with me.
• Crouch Fierce (Heavy Punch) active 2 more frames: Great! I can now use this as a solid corner pressure tool, among other things.
• U2 faster start up? Cool, that extra frame.
• Super having a hit on the way up. So if you want to combo into Super, it’s possible. Though the damage scaling will be ugly. Not a bad thing, but I won’t be wasting meter for super unless it will finish the job; just my own prerogative.
• Super damage reduction? Whatever, never use it anyway, and since I can combo into it, this won’t make or break my play.
• Gauge gone on input? Makes sense. This uphill battle isn’t anything new.

Now the stuff that I don’t get, or haven’t heard about.

• I haven’t heard about Vega/Claw’s j. Fierce (Heavy Punch) into cr. Roundhouse (Heavy Kick) going right through the opponent being fixed. If this has been updated, I’d love to know.
• EX RCF only +2 on hit? Here’s what kills me. I took so much time in figuring this out to make the best of my meter and practicing the reads to make that 1f (2f p-link) after EX RCF count. One being: The good read on a fireball to punish with st. Roundhouse (Heavy Kick) for a debatable 280 to 240ish damage with the mask on. The second was landing a jump in on the fireball game that’s less punishable. J. Fierce (Heavy Punch), St. Fierce xx EX CF -> St. Roundhouse, for the 363 damage.
  Extending this topic comes the 4f advantage with the 4f startup (1f, 2f link afterward) which-- is a 1f link, let’s be real.
  2 meters spent on EX RCF at 3/4 screen to punish a projectile -> cr. Strong (Medium Punch) xx EX FBA - Izuna for the 319 damage
  :: OR ::
  The jump in punish ( j. Fierce, St. Fierce xx EX RCF -> cr. Strong xx EX FBA - Izuna ) for 421 damage.

Now hang with me, as I’m not putting down the decision, I just don’t understand it. Sure, Red Focus might come in handle for the crumple cancels into Ultra, but at the cost of meter; for a character that’s meter-dependent at that. So That’s just my perspective on it, what do you guys think? A little too rough on Vega, or am I just overreacting? Mind you, I’ve been thinking on this for a couple weeks now. I’d love to hear what other Vega players think about his Ultra build. As far as I’m concerned, he’s getting a little and getting a lot taken away.

[Moonchilde]

EX RCF is still +4 on hit I think. They at one point did remove that link and changed it to +2, but that didn’t make it to the final changes or at least wasn’t on the list. IMO, he didn’t really get buffed at all, especially in comparison to much of the cast. Looks like the developers want us to make use of RCF as his main offense tool instead of being a footsie and poke character, which is kind of counter productive to his design.

[WA_Bandit]

Then why not give it 1 hit of armor, rather than make it projectile invincible? As it stands, you can jab him out of any special move he has. The latest data to date says his EX RCF is only going to be +2 on hit, which is poop. Hopefully there’s some touch-up to the build when I test it at NWM this year. I guess I’m just not understanding why they just take away some food and give it back and act like it’s a gift. All they’re doing is giving back some utility, and even then it’s still a pain. His fights, as they stand in what I’m reading, are going to be even steeper. 4f anything is ugly. I’d even settle for a 3f cr. lk for the sake of a trade in a grab tech. I don’t know, my head hurts after thinking on this.

[Moonchilde]

• Crouching Heavy Punch now has 4 active frames instead of 2.
• Pick up the mask command is now down+2 punches.
• Light, Heavy and EX Rolling Crystal Flash FADC is now +5 instead of ± 0 when opponent blocks.
• Medium Rolling Crystal Flash FADC is now +3 instead of ±0 when opponent blocks.
• Bloody High Claw upwards hitbox (during activation) increased.
• Splendid Claw now has 7 frames startup instead of 8 frames.
• Flying Barcelona Special now hits while jumping up towards the wall (but does 0 damage). The damage on the move has been changed to 100+100+100 from 100+100+200. Vega now only loses the Super guage once the move is activated from the wall, instead of when he starts jumping towards the wall.

These are the only changes. The EX +2 change was dropped apparently.

I guess one use of EX RCF would going through a fireball, if they block, dash cancel kara throw. That’s a lot of meter though for a throw But I guess if it wins the match. On the other hand, you could EX SHC through the fireball anyway. If you’re close enough and you hit them though that’s basically a free Ultra now. I guess it’s a good punish for a badly thrown fireball. I’d rather have other tools though.

[Doopliss]

Does anyone have any more insight on the RCF buff? Because making it better on block from an FADC HAS to result in it either being better on block normally, or it being better on hit when FADC’d… Well, unless they make it -3 on hit, which I strongly doubt.

[Niah]

really don’t understand it myself. not sure if on hit would change anything, but on block without fadc might be +3 or his dash is now 15 frames…

if on hit is changed as well, then ex on hit would be +9…that would be so sick

this was the same thing that happened with viper’s mp thunder knuckle

[Moonchilde]

If it’s +9 I mean, we could combo all sorts of shit into it, but it would be sooooo easy to combo EX RCF to cr.mp xx EX FBA. You could also combo both Ultra after hitting with EX RCF. I really doubt that’s the case, something else has to be going on or they added in a new property to every move that makes FADC + or - on block.

[Doopliss]

If he gets 2 more frames of hitstun on RCF, then he can combo it into lv.2 EX FA, which would allow you to combo into Ultra for 2 bars instead of 3. I figure this is possible if the recovery and hitstun of RCF are made longer to compensate for the extra blockstun.

[Gross_Indecency]

I don’t believe they gave any extra frames of hitstun,cause that would be a real buff, we don’t deserve that. It is only the block stun of the last hit. Cause it must be a meaningless buff.

[Doopliss]

I don’t believe they gave any extra frames of hitstun,cause that would be a real buff, we don’t deserve that. It is only the block stun of the last hit. Cause it must be a meaningless buff.

If they just changed the blockstun, it’s now +3 on block. That gives you Vanilla Bison-like pressure with c.MP xx LP RCF.

[Moonchilde]

So +3 on block means we can cr.MP (4 frames start up) then it means counter hit if they press a button?

[Person-Man]

It has to be either that LP Roll is more frame advantage on block or his dash is faster now… or they programmed the move to magically have more frame advantage when you FADC, IDK.

[Person-Man]

TBQH I’m much more excited to play Hugo and Rolento at this point.