Only point I want to mention in regards Jun’s and Ken’s L3 Supers.
Jun’s is one of the worst damage-wise doing 18760.
Ken’s is one of the strongest damage-wise doing 27902.
Jun’s is “better” in that it’s easier to combo into, but doing that scales that L3 down ridiculously. Ken’s is better to do on reaction when you’re sure they’re stuck in their move.
I like Jun and she has some nice tools, but I think Ken just has more.
IMO so far Tier Speculation: 1st Quarter of 2009
S- Chun, Karas, Casshern, Ace
A- Polymer, Batsu, Viewtful Joe
I truly believe however that Yatterman will eventually be an S class character soon or at least in top 3 gunning for best character spot. Yatterman rushdown is entirely too solid, His supers have good chipping, come out super quick, otgs, even has crossup potential, and he can pressure well too. Damn good assist, and just overall good partner on any team.
Ippatsuman also has mad potential.
I think after we mess around for a few more months. Ippatsuman, Chun, Casshern, Yatterman, and Karas will be the most used in the roster.
I feel Jun should be more recognized in this game because she can be very annoying with her nice combos and setups.
Team Gatchaman ftw
In the arcades I’ve played at here in Japan, it looks a little different. Scrubs play Ryu/Karas/Chun Li because they’re simple, but for some reason everyone who is doing really well has Doronjo on their team. It’s like Doronjo/Tekkaman for the most part and they just spam combination supers like crazy for setups with the boulder. If Tekkaman’s laser hits you into the corner, she can keep juggling you until the boulder hits, otherwise she gets a free (completely blind) mixup on you.
Also my Roll/Casshern setup was rape, if you up cancel two aerial Cs, the second one will still hit after a pushblock, which really pisses off Karas players. Roll is also way too fast to punish effectively with Ryu, and she can drop out of a chun li :dp::2p: super if she’s crouching for like half damage and no launcher. Even when you IAD:snkc: straight at a ryu who’s prepared to Shinkuu you, it’ll usually trade just because of how fast her IAD is, and sometimes you’ll even hit them clean. Also her assist is really good. It makes approaching a nightmare, especially because you can just stand near the puddle if it whiffs to frustrate people.
I don’t know how good Casshern really is, his combos do AWESOME damage with the Dog cancelling trick, but it’s kind of hard to approach with him. Playing keepaway with a Roll assist and the dog is possible, but not easy.
Anyways, that’s my 2 cents on the tier lists.
j1n’s list seems to be a lot more accurate.
With regards to the OP’s tier listing, I really don’t see how Morrigan’s even that high up- her dashes are retarded, and her super combos are just bad. Mega Man (who happens to be placed way lower than her) can pin her down with Machine Gun Arm, and she won’t have a good answer to that.
Roll should definitely be higher up. Her OTGs are un-crashable, and those happen to be her bread and butter in terms of gameplay. Plus, she can actually set up a lot of traps where she’d regain life and you can’t do squat about it. Mid-Tier character (because Ryu and Karas do give her a lot of trouble.)
Jun should be lower down the list. Her attacks are pretty slow, and she borders on being predictable at times.
This isnt true, actually, as Baroque bonus damage is POINT based, not percentage based.
My list looks like this:
A Tier: Rock, Joe
B Tier: Everyone but giants
C Tier: Lightan
D Tier: PTX
Karas isnt that scary. He has no mixup at all, just block low and advance guard all day. There are many spots in his block strings where he can be punished by any number of attacks from many different characters. Advance guard Shinkuu with Ryu or Machinegun with Rock, then DHC for even more damage if you want. Advance guard jump C with Alex can rock karas world if you do it after his standing B and he does down B next. Karas has a hard time dealing with Tekkaman jump C and air down C xx mashy move. And his unblockable setups seem to be escapable with reversal dragon punches sometimes, and other times with a simple tag out. He is good, but he isnt as good as Rock and Joe imo.
Anyone putting Saki in the lower part of their teirs just has not seen the unreal shit she can do with 4 levels if you happen to block ONE low A and she has the right partner.
This is the truth. Saki is undoubtedly the scariest character in the game with meter.
I also don’t get the hate on Morrigan’s dash. You’re not going to get crazy Magneto tri-jumps, but you’ll get instant overheads all day. Throw a decent assist in front of her and she can go crazy.
two thumbs up
this is one of those games where i dont think the gap between characters are that huge.
uh lets see:
Top:
Chun
Ryu
Karas
Highmid
Polymar
V.Joe
Doronjo (you know shes good)
Alex (yeah he has troubles to get in, but one combo = near death…same for polymar)
Casshern
Ippatsuman
Rock (I dont get why people think he is so good, he is ok but not top IMO)
Mid:
Batsu
Tekkaman
Morrigan
Ken
Jun
and the rest except…
mid low
Yatterman-1
Daimao
Lightan
Bottom:
PTX
Saki with meter = Cable
Her UB setups are nasty too. Two meters can pretty much kill you.
We definitely won’t be able to make a good list until more tourneys occur.
Have you not seen up canceling with Morrigan’s dash? I feel like everyone who hates on morrigan hasn’t actually seen her advanced stuff. It’s not like regular dashing and doing an overhead, which is super obvious, it’s like and instant supe rlow to the ground j.B that you can do over and over again. Also if you have a tiny bit of red life you can shoot a slow projectile and baroque it, then rush with it behind you, very good for approach. If morrigan did GOOD damage, I’d put her in the top tier. Not to mention her assist is better than ryu’s since the fireball is bigger and moves slower. Yeah her supers suck but once again, what do supers matter?
Roll’s OTG super is unsafe. She has no range at all, simply push blocking her away with a character that can zone destroys all her options. Healing is overrated IMO because it gives back such little life and wastes meter you could use to keep yourself alive or do more damage.
And yes, saki with meter is terrifying.
Ippatsuman has no real mix up since his 2A is a mid. He’s got decent pokes as far as the hit box goes but he doesn’t actually do much damage without supers. I mean he’s a good character but he seems pretty mid tier to me.
LOL at Roll’s heal giving her ‘little life’.
Who cares if OTG super is punishable? DHC or do it in a standing combo. Sleeping on roll isn’t smart.
Roll’s super does what? Maybe 1/6th of her life? That’s nothing when 1-2 combos will kill you, especially at higher levels in this game, I expect to see some absolutely retarded combos, not to mention infinites. Much better to save that meter to get out of combos when you get hit IMO, especially since megacrash also gives you damage opportunities in the corner and access to baroque, as well as putting momentum back in your favor. And as far as the sweep super in combos, that’s all fine and dandy, I’d rather someone do that for mediocre damage and then have it so when I hit them, they can’t crash and they die. I’ll happily take a hit for that.
Yeah and pushblocking roll is not as sweet as it sounds. Like I said on the last page, I was raping up on a Karas player who thought he could pushblock ftw because it gives her a chance to hit a second aerial without even dashing in again most of the time, after which she’s still in range for a high/low mixup at retardedly fast speeds into supers of her choice. Not to mention her IADs are so fast that it’s hard to pushblock them unless you’re standing there just waiting for it, which is asking to get owned in the first place.
xSAMx - You are making the game sound more simple than it is. Theory that “this always beats this” is fine, but you should know it doesnt really work that way.
I know, I just don’t see roll being THAT strong. Maybe I placed her too low, but she’s definitely not top or even high. In my experience, zoning just destroys her. Yes if she can get in, she’s not too terrible since she has ok mix ups, but even then, her damage is nothing to shit your pants about. Since push block is there, it’s going to be something you REALLY have to look out for when playing roll. Her only real advantage is having a dumb hit box. You can counter pick soki with her since he can’t even combo her, and she works well vs Polymar since none of polymar’s mix ups work on her and if she just crouches, he can’t even hit her with a jump in unless perfectly spaced with an IAD. That’s pretty much a non-factor at high levels though, as good players should be able to adjust to her hit box accordingly. Plus she can get infinited on either side of the screen by karas, who you’ll be seeing a lot of, so she might not make it so far in the tournament scene.
One thing I will give her is that her assist is really really good, especially since that puddle sits there for so long. If that hits low, there might even be unblockables with it.
Zoning doesn’t do as great as you would think. She can get in really quickly with any tiny opening, and it’s harder to get damage on her than most people because (A) she’s small and (B) so few of her moves are actually punishable. Her offense is super safe, and does reasonable to good damage depending on the situation. I wouldn’t put her top, but I’d put her high.
One thing I can say is saki is a huge pain in the ass, but when I play in the arcades that doesn’t matter.
Roll is a great. In my opinion, she’s awesome for long battles. One sweep and she can recover 1/6th of her (or her partner’s) life or stall the match with a combo that takes about 10 seconds. I’d say she’s Top Tier.