I’ve never had problems with Ibuki. Why is that one move giving you such trouble?
Going against someone that’s good, he’ll do it over and over again. Its safe, it chips, and there’s nothing Hakan can do to punish it.
Drew I have been looking in the Abel matchup when Hakan is unoiled but only in the footsies part.
I realized that cr. jab and cr.MP are a counter pokes for Abel stepkick, with the cr. jab you can buff slide but it is hard to confirm into the press and if you press jab twice the slide can come out without hit the opponent, so press light kick immediatly after the buff to try make slide into oil shower what is a nice choice. In the max distance Hakan still dominate because Forward HK that cannot be reversal in the max range if defended. A nice Abel will try catch one of those with EX COD so dont forget St. HP that is a double hit poke and got a nice startup
You can test and add if you want in your post. Sorry about my english guys I think that some parts are really bad explained.
I really need some tips for dhalsim. I simply cannot get in on him.
ya, I think sim/claw/thawk/dictator are my worst matchups. (which is alot.)
latest frustration was flip happy claw. OS. dive on slide/press kinda works. i need to refine this or find a more definitive form of mixup.
edit: and hakan X_X
how about a few match-up updates first for the hard match-ups, drew?
let me know and i’ll send some of my notes to you.
honda/hawk/viper/dic/claw/sim?
Something to possibly add to the Cammy match-up that might prove useful when Cammy doesn’t have meter. I’m sorry if this is already known about, but it’s kind of hard to search through all the stuff posted here :x
The following setup beats all of her reversals with the exceptions being EX Cannon Spike and sigh normal throw. It can also be jumped and backdashed.
[Cr. RH (knockdown), fwd jump wiff normal, EX Rocket]
Her DP series, save her EX, don’t have grab invincibility 1st-4th frames, so combining this with Hakan’s EX Rocket’s strike invincibility makes this work. It’s neat.
Uses in the metagame- While this stuffs most of her wakeup reversals, her DP is probably the only move Cammy would consider unless trained otherwise as is with the occasional spin-knuckle escape attempt, which this punishes. This setup is throwable though, so one might prefer mixing it up with BDNC MP instead which beats throw, jump, backdash, and avoids all versions of her DP, yet loses to unconventional reversals like Spiral Arrow, yet recovers in time to punish jumps should you have the available meter/ reflexes/ oilkan to do so. So it’s sort of 50/50 depending on whether the opponent is attempting to escape or retaliate while eliminating the threat of her DP (sort of).
This mixup is a little cerebral and probably not terribly useful against everyday Cammy users, but at higher level play, I can imagine forcing players to adapt to using unorthodox escapes which you can punish with the latter option. If anyone sees where I messed up on this, let’s fix that, haha.
Is anyone going to update this guide? It’s not viable anymore…
On another note, S.HP is horrible for AA’ing, better go with F.LP or airgrab. Seriously, ignore everyone who says that S.HP is good. It isn’t.
Just working on Adon stuff, hopefully have it done soon.
As for st.hp, it isn’t that bad, if you’re meaning it trades a lot? Yeah maybe, but on counter hit it nets you like 100 damage or something, plus you can uncrouchable them on the way down
And getting a CH is as common as a Dhalsim player not zoning. Its not worth it and you can do the uncrouchable on F.LP too.
The Seth guide needs some revamping as well, since the tandem engine or whatever its called shuts everything down and Hakan can’t punish it.
And you can’t punish Sonic booms on fullscreen or 70-80% screen, Seth can do boom and backdash.
EDIT: S.MP isn’t the correct timing against Balrog anymore. Or atleast if you do it exactly when you stand up, IE on the first frame it isn’t. Might need to add somethign to that cause I just lost a round for doing a perfect “setup”.
the dry forward dash j.f+rk doesn’t work for all counter options after slide press anymore (u2 beats it)
And the Gen matchup needs more info. I’ve been playing with a Gen for the past couple of days, so far its heavily in Gen’s favor. Hakan’s normals are horseshit overall, so you can’t do much when you go against Gen. However, your best bet will be cr.LK tickthrows and cr.LP. I’m not joking, cr.MP beats S.LP so if you hit him and can’t link anything, don’t press anything.
Edit: The crossup MP is wrong too. Unless you’re supposed to do slide>wait>mp>wait>j.HK? I’ve tried everything, it doesn’t really work. U1 is however very solid since Gen’s low HP makes any guaranteed punishes worthwhile.
…have you guys been reading/updating on info…
check out my guide for safe jump kicks.
“”"
[ Slide-press > f.lk > j.hk ]
boxer
[ Slide-Press > f.dash > j.hk ]
SETH*
-when oiled please delay tiny tiny bit before j.hk
-loses to u1 and u2
-OS dive/slide to catch teleport
[ Dive > f.jump > j.hk ]
Seth*
-loses to u1 and u2
-OS dive/slide to catch teleport
"""
Also for Gen
i think s.mp > j.hk still ok
from what i remembered it beats most of his dp. and loses to Gen’s U1?
But like i mentioned before, hakan has timing issues for setups sometimes, so if you delay pressing your kicks or s.mp it all effect the ‘safe-jump kick’ results.
Adon MU guide done, wow was there some things I wasn’t aware of!
Matchup Analysis Template
Spoiler
*Matchup Figure: *5-5 (this might be up for debate now, I’m a little unsure myself after writing this)
General Strategy
Your goal against Adon is stay patient and look for opportunities to counter adons specials and push adon back, by whiff punishing with sweep, or using a reversal LK oil dive off of blocked jaguar kicks or jaguar tooths to get him closer to the corner while scoring a knockdown. Knockdowns should be made the most of, because dealing with Adons neutral game is difficult. Once Adons in in the corner, his options are much more limited and he can’t harass you with jaguar kicks if you’re pressuring him.
Once Hakan has Ultra stocked, Adons options are severely limited, because any poorly spaced jaguar kicks, get punished by Ultra 1 on block AND on hit! Use this advantage to force Adon into making a mistake or make your own luck by dashing into Adon ready to react to any Jaguar kicks and punish.
Picking Ultras
I was once the believer of using U2 in this matchup, but Ultra 1 is definitely the Ultra of choice for me.
With Ultra one stocked, Adon has to be very careful, because one badly placed special, or one over-aggressive jaguar tooth, could end in his death. The fact that he can’t use one of his biggest weapons, EX jaguar kick, is a big plus, and you should be looking out for this. Remember you can also Ultra 1 Rising Jaguar > FADC, so bait this out and punish, although your reactions will have to be good…i.e - churn dat butter. Don’t over use it, afterwards he’s likely to dash back instead, or jump (which would be unsafe also, but not worth risking Ultra 1 again) so get ready for airgrab/jump mp.
- Far-Range/Fireball Game*
Far range isn’t really where you want to be against Adon, you have to be very careful and vary when you’re oiling up. Jaguar tooth is an easy punish for oiling up, and it’s not a useful position to find yourself in, unless you really need the oil and are willing for the trade. Also, note that LK dive reversal works wonders against Jaguar tooth, catching throw attempts, backdashes, and jumps, while being uncrouchable on block. So it’s possible to take the trade, bait the tooth, and completely turn the momentum. Just watch if he has meter. If adon has meter, and does Jaguar tooth, there’s a high chance he’ll use Rising Jaguar FADC afterwards. You can counter this by using Coward Crouch, which makes Rising Jaguar completely whiff, giving you a big punish.
Also remember that with Ultra stocked you can punish Jaguar tooth with ultra 1 with reversal timing, on block. So if you can frustrate him by staying fullscreen, you’ll get your chance.
Midrange/Footsies Game
This is where Adon shines, and Hakan has a hard time dealing with Adons footsies. The fact that Adon eats focus for breakfast means you have to really limit yourself from using focus too much. WIth St.hk, and rising jaguar, focus can easily get shut down. Reserve focus attack for jump in, and for close range pressure.
Your goal here at midrange is to use normals like st.hp, f.lp and st.mp. St.hp and f.lp are perfectly suited for swatting jaguar kick out of the air, and if you’re gutsy you can go for an Uncrouchable HK dive afterwards. St.mp is a great all round normal to use. When oiled make use of max range f.hk. Max range f.HK gives you a free safe jump against Adon, you’ll need to practice the timing. THis is where you want Adon to be, under pressure. Use f.mp at mid distance to close the gap and set up a possible tick SPD, or use any spare meter to cancel into slide FADC. If Adon is pressuring with Jaguar kicks, watch his tendencies. If he likes to crouch normal, you can SPD, however if he’s backdashing or jumping or just holding downback, this will open your options up. Reversal lk dive works as an uncrouchable against Jaguar kick, so there’s always a good chance of nabbing him. If you’re hit with a crouching normal attempting the dive, you’ll be air reset and can land with an SPD/Ultra as you land. Go for the HP SPD, or if you’re closer to the corner, use the light version and try to get some offense going.
Whiff punishing is important in this matchup, you should always be looking to whiff punish against Adon, if he whiffs Jaguar kick in your face, you can punish with sweep.
Punishing with sweep gives you a free safejump, with a jumping HK. Make the most of the Oki, Adon dies fast, and after working hard for the knockdown, you should be making the most of it.
As you get closer to Adon while Oiled, you can dash in get an offense going. Dash in cr.lk or st.mp can set you up. On block, go for a tick throw after the cr.lk, or chain cr.lks and force him into jumping and punish with airgrab or jumping mp. St.mp set you up nicely for a f.mp > which gives you different options such as slide, or tick spd.
Anti-Air
F.lp and st.hp work well against Adon, but watch out for EX jaguar kick. If he’s jumping at you, just use focus when unoiled to create some pace. Or if oiled, use parry or level 1 focus to create some pressure.
- Punishing*
As before, ALWAYS punish poorly spaced Jaguar kicks with Ultra 1, and ALWAYS punish EX version with Ultra 1. Scout out Jaguar tooths and don’t be afraid to use LK oil dive if he doesn’t have meter, and of course Ultra 1. If you have super, couple with decent reactions, you can whale through any jaguar kick attempts. Super is also useful against Jaguar tooth, because it can catch light, medium and heavy at mid distance. So if you see this move startup at midrange, hit super. Another important thing to be ready for is overhead, which you can also punish with Ultra 1. So always be aware of what you can punish, and scout things out.
Defending Against Pressure and Mixup
Adon has the ability to creat great pressure with Jaguar Kicks. If you find yourself in the corner, suffering jaguar kick abuse, know that you have options, just don’t eat Jaguar kicks that you don’t need to, by pressing buttons. The only button you might want to press is st.hp or f.lp. There’s absolutely no harm in doing LK dive reversals if the Adon jus’t have meter, since you’ll beat almost all of his options aside from crouch jab which will give you an air reset, and if the opponent isn’t ready, he’s getting hit by an SPD Of course you don’t need to go for that, but it’s a valid option. You might want to wait around first time just to see what he does. If you’re oiled you can focus parry after you land into cr.jab slide to counter any more jabs.
When Adon knocks you down, he’s likely going to want to go for ambiguous crossups, apply jaguar kick pressure, or go for the instant overhead. If he goes for instant overhead > EX jaguar kick, you can’t reversal Ultra, what you can do EX slide after the overhead mk, which counter hits the EX jaguar. Ultra 1 can be used, although with some risk, if the opponent goes for any crouch normals after the EX air Jaguar kick. In this situation you may suprise the Adon player by actually blocking the setup.
Parry is obviously useful against crossups, or simply focus backdash out into neutral.
With Ultra stocked, you might be tempted not to defend at all! There’s definitely a case here of just letting yourself get hit by a Jaguar kick, which gives a you a free reversal Ultra 1. If you can force your opponent to almost completely abandon arguably their best special attack, or limit it’s use, then you’ve given yourself a massive advantage. The footsie midrange game gets changed completely, and you can start putting Adon on the back foot. You could even stand at midrange and do a raw HK Oil, almost tempting Adon to hit you. Unless the player completely knows about Hakans Ultra punishes, you can really push the error out.
Safe slide’s aren’t really advisable against Adon since he can rising Jaguar through it, although it wouldn’t hurt to throw it in now and again as a mixup or to get your foe to block low.
Applying Pressure and Mixup
Hakans Oil is the key to his offensive game, but it’s not something that’s really required in this MU from the get go. Things change in the corner, though. What you have to do after working hard to get your knockdowns against Adon, is make the most of it. Of course it’s great ot have the 720 in yor back pocket, but you want to be in a strong position if it comes to that stage. Because you can counter Adon so easily with reversal LK dives, you’re always in with a good chance of scoring a knockdown.
So, after an Oil Dive, you’re going to want to limit Adons options against, at least midscreen. The safejump to use is neutral jump > jump forward HK. This makes Heavy and EX reversals whiff. On hit you can combo into slide, on block, you can start some pressure, just watch out for mashed Rising Jaguars if they block. If you get them to the corner, you can do the same setup, or you can go for oil, and a meaty setup, and pin Adon in the corner. The safejump is more viable because rising jaguar reversal isn’t going to work.
After a slide combo, the safejump to use is cr.lk > Jumping HK which will make reversals whiff and force Adon to block. It’s always been difficult to find one to consistently work, but this should do the trick.
A good way outside of knockdowns, and this is a general thing, to set up an offense as long as you have some meter stocked is to use st.mp. Standing mp on hit or block from max range, allows you to seamlessly go into f.mp, and with meter available you can cancel into slide and put some heavy pressure on, forcing the opponent into a serious guessing situation. You should always look out for st.mp connecting with the opponent, because it’s a good way to get inside.
Option Selects
Standard option selects against Adon, once you’ve forced him to block safejumps, you can start to incorporate OS sweeps and dives into your game.
Additional Resources
[media=youtube]63Z0exZmVIE[/media]
Concluding Tips
Remember that there’s no need to be over aggressive from the start of the match, you can be patient and wait for a chance to counter to get your offense going. Trying to be too aggressive can get your hurt. When Oiled, avoid using focus as much as possible, or at least don’t be predictable with it. Use it for wakeup defense and for tight close range pressure where the opponent can’t see it coming. ALWAYS knows your punishes, and know when you have the chance to reversal Ultra 1 of Adons specials, as soon as you have Ultra stocked you should be aware of it. Don’t be afraid to play games with the opponent when you have your ultra ready, try and coax them into doing something which they think is safe, which really isn’t.
Also please, don’t press buttons when you’re getting pressured with Jaguar kicks. Use reversal LK dives!
Nope, nope and nope again, S.MP does not work. F.LK makes it whiff thou.
These are the moves that Hakan can throw out against Gen so far.
cr.LK
cr.LP
S.LP
And J.MK. F.LK/LP/MP/HP/HK gets countered by Gens’ cr:HK. Jumpins get shutdown by cr.MP. His specials are safe except Gekiro and Oga.
Edit: F.LK works against cr.MP
Update on the Rufus guide: It sucks. Yes, you can slap him out of dives and you can airgrab him, and ex messiah is easily baited. Cr.HP FDNC is a good option. But why the fuck does it not say anything about tornado? Its safe, if a Rufus is spamming it, try to backdash, that’s your only option. Another note, if you see that Rufus really likes to throw out J.HK, don’t try to jump towards and airgrab, maybe if he’s throwing it out late. But if he’s doing it really early I’d suggest not to jump at all.
Edit: Same thing with Fei, nothing about the Rekkas. What?
For GEN
hey i just tried the setup on PC and it works…
[ slide-press > s.mp > f.j.hk ]
-beats all dp or make it whiff
-hits crouch opponents
-loses to AA-super and U1
like said before, the timing of button pressing determines the results.
so if you press the j.hk a little early and a little late makes the results differ.
thats probably why you were getting hit by at least the lk.dp.
i guess Gens hit box is a weird one so the results varies more than the regular characters.
So if you want to make sure you avoid/wins all dp, press the hk a little earlier, with a OS rocket just incase it whiffs crouch characters.
Really? That’s interesting, I couldn’t hit it for the life of me, so I started to use F.LP which worked too. And yeah Gen has a really funky hitbox, I’ll try to write a guide or something on him cause I’ve been playing a really solid Gen player for the past two weeks. Ranked 20th on the PC version since you said you were on the PC.
Anyways, thanks for confirming that my timing is just balls, hah.