Unfortunately I’m on a Mac or I’d be all over GGPO. I tried installing it with Wine but I couldn’t quite get it to run.
Oddly enough though, I know a few 3s players who don’t like parrying as much as a mechanic, but they really like the way the game plays, looks, etc. shrug I’m willing to accept that there are probably things I don’t know about the game yet, but I still stand by my words. 100% off one combo/mistake is crazy, even if it does take skill and meter management.
Again, you really seem to be responding to what you THINK I typed rather than what I ACTUALLY typed. I never said I didn’t think someone winning with an HD combo is never outplaying me. I’d disagree that ANY time you lose you got outplayed. Luck can play as a factor in these games too, but by an large, barring luck, I’d say it’s pretty obvious that if you lose you got outplayed.
Far as blocking being the counter to HDs, well, take another look at that video Mr.X posted and you’ll see that isn’t generally the case. I never “wished for a combo breaker or hand holding mechanic,” I was merely using those as examples of ways that other games have used to balance out potentially unchecked mechanics. What I AM saying is that, THERE"S NOTHING THAT BEATS AN HD COMBO OTHER THAN THE PLAYER DROPPING IT. The game is fine, I just think that a 100% combo off one hit-confirm is excessive. What would Third Strike be like if you could do something like that in that game?
I’ve been playing fighting games a long time. Since World Warrior actually. Hyper Fighting is one of my favorite games and it’s even less forgiving than ST is. SF2 in general is a lot less forgiving than this game as well and it’s a game I’m good at, comfortable with, and can hang with just about anyone at. So a game being “forgiving” isn’t really the point. SF4 is more forgiving than either of those but it’s a shit game imo. I realize I’m still learning this game, but I’ve been playing FGs long enough to have a good idea of what’s a sound mechanic and what may not be. IN MY OPINION: HD/Max combos aren’t a good mechanic because they reward fishing for hit confirms with a potentially 100% combo. If the overall damage output was in the 500-700 range, sure, I could see that. But 100+% is absurd, even in a game with three characters.It just seems like SNK tried to inject a bit of “Marvel hype” into a game that doesn’t really need it.
You’ll be happy to know that I changed the thread title. I’d like to say I did it totally for myself, but I’m a pleaser, so… Oh joeyjeremiah, I can’t stay mad at you…
The problem with the “video evidence” has already been pointed out by others. It is an extremely specific setup that requires the opponent have 0 stock so that they can’t GCCD/GCR. Shen required 4 bars to attempt it and it and it wasn’t even guaranteed (the opponent can jump before the command grab, if he wants it guaranteed it costs 5 stocks for EX grab). This kind of setup does not generally happen. Takuma fucked up big time by mismanaging his meter so badly that he didn’t even have the option to escape that setup. Shen managed his meter beautifully and destroyed him for it. These are very rare setups, nowhere near “generally the case.”
People who cite that video as evidence of imbalance show they don’t know enough about the game or cannot accept being punished for their failures. If anything the video should help you understand the importance of meter management and show why 4/5 meter ToDs aren’t common in higher level play (because having meter for GCCDs/GCRs is important for many things, not just that specific setup).
Props for changing the thread title. Less absolutes over subjective opinion is a good thing.
Edit: I just want to point out something about this video. I don’t know for sure because I haven’t seen the whole match, but I suspect the reason Takuma had no meter/drive and Shen had 4 bars is because Takuma probably finished off a character with an HD. When he did that he burned all his meter and along with it all his meter-dependant defensive options, while at the same time giving his opponent a ton of meter to work with. If this is how it played out, let it be an example of how HD is a bittersweet mechanic that while powerful still has real consequences.
…Uh, just to tell you, you were right all the way up to jumping out of the command grab. He comboed into it off the guardbreak.
But yeah, it was not one mistake in that video that caused Takuma to lose. It was mistakes starting with not having the extra meter which probably came from mistakes earlier in the match.
By the way, how the hell have we not found that full match yet?
I’m one of the ones to disagree with HD/NM combos hurting XIII. Like I think a few have said, it’s built around the system. I’ve been on the receiving end of several HD combos that took the match from me, and it hurt, but it clearly showed he or she was the better player. And when I’ve applied my own HD combo successfully, It’s just a great feeling because it looked cool and I could’ve easily dropped it but didn’t. I can appreciate that there are enough options to not always win with a HD combo at least. Going back to the GF of XIII at EVO, MadKOF’s playstyle with his team (Duo especially) can be really inspiring for not always relying on one.
That’s funny, because sometimes I feel the same way as the OP, so I started playing 98 in addition to 13. And it has Blue Mary and a non-retarded Ralf… and Leona draws blood with her knife-hands. I already love 98.
After watching some of the other matches Mad KoF played, I can see how Bala would have gotten to the last round without any meter of the match in question. Mad KoF was blowing people the fuck up with his Duo Lon. He OCV’ed Zero Black. o_O I can see how an opponent would have expended a lot of meter just trying to KO his Duo Lon.
yes it would have been a more Pure fighting game,But there have been worse things put in fighting games. it does get weird when you got to go learn your /kof/marvel combos for when you hit Kof xfactor in HD mode, they dont make any pure fightng games any more always be some wierd mode, you want pure oldschool fatal fury styles ,Got play the oldies, is what it is…fAdc out nuggas
If you want to get technical, the special moves and the ability to pick more than one character was a gimmick all to itself. And the special moves came from SF1.
As much as people seem to like ignoring things, every FG in existence has a gimmick to sell itself, including the first one, whatever that is, which was the gimmick to fight in the first place.
I see what you’re saying. It’s a different time though now. It seems like everything has to have some sort of flash or pizazz to it to sell it. And as much as I want to give people shit about not buying games because they don’t have flashy pictures on the back of the box, I do the same thing sometimes.I think KoFXIII is a lot closer to an old school kind of fighting game than a lot of the newer games these days. It’s still got a strong footsies game, the execution is pretty on point, and for the most part it doesn’t reward sloppy play.
And actually, if I remember right, Art Of Fighting was the first fighting game to have Supers in it (the “Haoh-ken Death Blow”), and ST came out after. But imo HyperFighting>>ST.
As someone who believes that KOF 98 and 98UM (personally prefer UM) represent the all-time peak of fighting games alongside the SF2 games (ST is best but HDR and HF are nothing to scoff at) I’m inclined to agree in principle…
…but I’ll disagree in practice. The mechanic works perfectly well for XIII. It adds a little bit of ‘clutch’ to the way the game is balanced overall. But I’ll still take 98UM any day of the week…
honestly i dont dis like the game, i just thought once ex moves and super/ultras/neo max and teching throws was the end of the madness i like all those…The ISM,groove,hd modes always just seemed like gimicks that should be left out of fighting games…im just getting old born in 1980
“the only difference between this game and marvel 3, is that the combos are harder and you dont get a free mixup when a character dies” - a friend of mine
I can’t believe people are questioning the legitimacy of BBZ’s guard break play in that match…first of all, it is very situation. Secondly, he got the damage boost for the command grab and all hits after that, from the EX DM that guard breaked. And lastly, BBZ knew exactly what he was doing, what move he needed to end with in order to guard break and exactly what to do after the guard break to maximize his damage. It requires a great amount of awareness…a play like this pretty much deserves the match.
