I have this particular problem:
Bison:
cr.lp, x3, knee press. Repeat until he mixes with grab.
On wake up, repeat the process.
What does abel have to punish knee press? >_<
I want to know too what are the frame advantages of ex. falling sky Some invulnerability here?.
Try s.mp to beat out scissors. Neutral jump lk/rh is also decent, until they start doing rh to catch it, but at least it relieves some of the pressure.
Sakura matchup feels 5-5. Footsies all day… your AAs are really inconsistent in this matchup, mainly because of the angles of Sakura’s jumping normals. I have more to add, but I want to see if anyone else knows the matchup. And yeah be aware of the resets cause one or two mistakes can turn into a stun.
I think the Sak match up is in Able’s favor. Granted I have never played Sabre or anything but I think Able’s footsies are better than hers in general. AFAIK she cant to anything about standing short and I have had a lot of success AAing her stuff with either standing strong or standing Jab and crouching forward seems to work really well to. I dont think her resets are any more dangerous than yours then add the fact that she has low health.
Honestly, I think her low health is the only reason the match may be in Abel’s favor.
Crouching forward gets stuffed whenever I tried to use it. As well as crouching fierce. I haven’t played with standing jab but you’re right about standing strong. And Sakura does have the normals to play footsies against Abel’s standing short. It’s like playing against Ryu or Ken. Your short will beat their crouching forward, but their strong will beat your short. Sakura has something like that… I forgot which move it is though. Replace Ryu’s crouching forward with Sakura’s standing roundhouse(?) and Ryu’s strong with Sakura’s standing jab(?). I need to check again, but basically, Sakura can play footsies with Abel and I don’t think Abel’s normals outweigh Sakura’s… and if they do, it’s not by much. I guess the difference maker would be Abel’s step kick.
I never really use c. Fierce because you are correct it gets stuffed pretty handily. In the matches I have played with Sak step kick does work really well. I dont think I have ever had it stuffed unless I did it at a brain dead moment. I haven’t never had my shot beaten either at least not with the kind of consistency that I would say move x > standing short. I guess I just dont really see how she would win this match unless the Able player really messes up. The only pressure she can apply is overheard to get you to stand into c. forward into her SRK or tatsu. You can block the overhead on reaction or just eat it once or twice and avoid the mix up all together. I dont think its as good as Fei’s so it wont win her any matches. I have never had a Sak feel they could jump on me or not for very long in the match. Able’s standing Jab does surprisingly well here along with the standing strong. Also unless my opponents just haven’t found the clean counter you can pressure her with a jump jab. As long as you are not right on top of her it stuffs c Fierce and even beat the short SRK. Don’t get me wrong I am not saying jump around like crazy but I use it occasionally to set up a block string or grab. If you get any kind of life lead, which I imagine you should she has a hard time coming back unless she manages to land something that leads to EX Tatsu and after hours of dealing with Akuma stuff she just looks like she is in slow motion to me.
I think there are small windows to jump at Sakura, much like Chun except with Chun they’re even smaller windows. Unless she’s throwing fireballs, which they shouldn’t be doing, you’ll always be around s.lk range. The thing is with c.fp, there are times where it looks like it’s the perfect time to press it as you would be able to with other characters, it just gets stuffed by Sakura. Same goes with c.mk. And Sakura’s block string pressure is as tough to deal with as Abel’s block string pressure. Jumping jab, eh, it’s as effective as in any other matchup IMO.
Iunno, I DO think it is in Abel’s favor… but health + step kick are the only reasons why. It’s still nearing even. If her Super buffs prove to be true, then I guess there would be more on the table to argue about.
I like this discussion. =D
Well as I said before I have never played Sabre or anything but we have a good Sak player who moved to Memphis from Boston which is where most of my match up practice in this fight comes from. My only fear in this match is really if I get caught in the reset since it can ruin your life bar but other than that I never feel pressured with the rest of the match. If Sak is getting all the buffs I have heard of she should become more dangerous but then again Able is getting buffs to so it could even itself out. I agree with you though there are times where you would swear cHP would hit and would on others but not her which is why I gave it up unless she tries some neutral jump mess. Then I use it to smack her and follow up if I got the second hit that send them to float state. I just think she has to work harder for her damage and cant afford mistakes. I dont think its 7-3 or anything but at least 5.5-4.5 or 6-4. Also, and I need to test to see if this is true but our Sak player swears I landed a regular TT on his lp SRK. I dont know if this was a random occurrence but my only guess would be since she is grounded for the first part of the SRK that it would beat it. I need to test it in practice mode to know for sure though. If it beats her clean its just more pressure we can do on her wake up.
I dont fight that many sakuras but ive gotten my fair share of wins/getting raped… imo her resets are just as gimmicky as abel’s, i think hers are weaker in comparison.
It looks like a 6-4 or 5.5/4.5 in abels favor to me.
Agreed with AA cr.hp being not so good in this matchup, id stick with s.mp or cr.mk(i think even this can get stuffed), imo s.mp is better than s.lp since both has same startup but s.mp has longer active frames. Is it possible to just j.hp her on reaction, i wonder.
I have not had much luck with jump FP on reaction but I recently switched to stick and my reactions aren’t amazing by any means so it could be plausible. I did not know they had the same start up. I figured sLP was quicker by a frame. Good to know though since there is no reason to use the jab.
St.jab is quicker, its 4 frames while mp is 5. Personally I prefer neutral j.hp to her jumpins over other means, or roll or even ex.tt. Fuck, abel has so many unconventional ways to aa people, u guys just have to be creative
thats for close s.lp yo, far st.lp/mp both has 5F startup.
I’d give this match to Abel. Sakura dies fast, has poor footsies, and her reversals are garbage. Her pressure game is kind of annoying but nothing really to get worried about… her resets aren’t a big deal until she gets you in the corner. Then it gets really hard to tell wtf is going on
Her reversal game is indeed garbage, and her footsies are below average, but in this matchup if she knocks you down that could be the end of the round.
You can st.LK her cr.MK and st.HK, but you can’t anti-air her at all. If you try F+MK too much, you’ll eat cr.MK xx HP shoouken. If she jumps at you with j.HK, no ground normal will beat that if she jumped at the right spacing, although a perferctly-timed cr.HP will trade. You’ll have to reactively jump BACK and do j.HP. If you jump forward all day she can just do her j.LK and air reset you into her mixups.
She has a 3-frame jab, so you’ll need to normal throw a few times after a blocked F+MK. Also, her st.LP gives so much advantage that she can do that balrog stuff where she’s just stand jabbing you all day and your only answer would be EX TT (jabs give enough time to react to EX roll and will hit EX COD twice). Let’s assume the Sakura player knows this. He’s trying to bait it, so just keep blocking. To escape her mixups, you’re going to need to:
Fortunately, your st.HP will work on a crouching Sakura after a F+MK.
Sabre’s taught me a lot about this match. It’s 5-5 ish, but Abel has slight advantage due to your st.LK owning her important pokes. However, Abel has to be very attentive to find the escapes to her mixups and gets a taste of his own medicine in this match.
That’s pretty much what I was trying to get across, JBA just put it in better words than I did… =D. AA is inconsistent. And her crazy pressure game in this matchup, which I try to jump out whenever I get the chance especially after her EX tatsu/whatever her’s is called. My brother plays a mean Sakura, but he was one of the earlier contributors on the Sakura subforums and he knows how my Abel plays sooo I think I know where you’re coming from. =p
yo thanks JBA for the info.
Man…this is basically just me venting about my ineffectuallity here, but the Elf vs Abel matchup is ridiculous for me. It’s my worst match up by a massive gulf. I’d rather take on any of the higher tier characters any day of the week.
It’s nothing but trying to guess right and punish…but even punishing seems to be a massive gamble. Abel’s c.fierce only seems to connect both hits on a 10% whim, so comboing into ultra is often out of the question. If he’s across the screen feinting the wall hop, your only option is basically to move foward with a random set of inputs and hope that you get close enough to tag a few hits. Elf usually wriggles out of step kick set ups, especially online where lag makes those strict links a little tougher.
My only thoughts are to go for c.mp, c.mk, or c.fp into full CoD for all punishment situations. Maybe it was coincidence, but going for FADC out of CoD for the ultra combo doesn’t work because only the first hit of c. fp will connect after the step kick. Cross up into c.fp will only score the first hit.
Some rarely reliable techniques for me were backdash, TT or Falling Sky, but again, you have to be psychic. Will he block, or jump away? Focus attack setups proved to be the most devestating, but even then, the missing 2nd c.fp hit ruins your juciest punishment options. Better off doing the ultra naked.
Edit-- I checked out some vids and I definitely see people scoring full c.fp’s…but man, I really don’t know how. I played well over 20 matches with this fella and c.fp’s consistently whiffed the second hit, occasionally even in calm, point blank situations.
I’ve run some loooooong sets with skisonic, and you just have to play it slowly. Fuerte is one of the most mobile characters in the game, and his main intention is to frustrate the shit out of you, and cause you to make continuous mistakes. Just stay calm, and remember that you hurt him a fuckton more than he hurts you.
Also remember, your knockdowns are just as frustrating to him as his are to you. When you get that knockdown, CAPITALIZE. This is definitely a bit of training mode, since some ambiguous mixups don’t work well on Fuerte, you’ll get one hit of c.hp at certain distances. Learn those distances and avoid them.
Remember, focus backdash is your best friend against a lot of his mixups. Ex roll will get you out of a lot, and EX-TT eats the ground based moves. Blocking is also a good option. 
Get TT’ing his slide into your muscle memory. Most Fuerte’s will use slide as a throw setup, so teach them to stop that shit quickly.
AVOID moving across the screen with wheel kicks in this matchup. It’s tempting because Fuerte covers ground so quickly, but you just have to be patient.
If you’re having trouble tagging hits after f+mk, start throwing tick-tt setups in there. This will at least get them to start panicking, and you can predict their options from there.
In the corner, wheel kick is your friend. It shuts down Fuerte’s escape mech, which is the air grab, while being relatively safe. Get him in the corner and frustrate him.
Can’t think of anything else off the top of my head.
Depending on the quality of the Fuerte, this won’t last long. Fuerte has this neat setup where he can slide, and then LK guacamole out of your TT, land in your face, and being RSFing. It’s pretty safe against Abel in general, too, because if you roll out or mash jab, Fuerte doesn’t really get hurt all that bad (and might avoid it altogether). Abel basically just has to stand there and wait for it, but it’s hard not to push buttons with a Fuerte in your face.
If you find this is abusable against your particular opponent, though, go for it.
Also of note: because of the way Fuerte reels when hit, you can do some interesting stuff off ticks. For example, I believe low short, low jab will still trigger close stand fierce and close stand strong, so you can go low short, low jab, link stand fierce xx CoD into whatever. A much easier hit-confirm. I’m fairly sure that specific combo works, but you might want to test yourself in training. There was a great 20 minute video of Japanese players doing Abel vs Fuerte in the video thread (not this thread) not too long ago, search back a few pages to find it.
Yep of course, it’s like every other tactic, abuse it until it stops working. Either way, it subtracts one option from Fuerte’s game, which is always a plus.