That’s the problem. The people that say I respect him for not using doom are the same people that say vergil is dumb when garrett cant kill vergil with 1 combo and he ends up reverse ocv’ing his team. But that is not exclusive to garrett. I’m not gonna harp on his anti-doom thing. Whether or not he uses doom is not important. Whether or not he kills characters in 1 combo is what is important.
There are plenty of players on this forum who use Spider-Man without doom. But they also know the importance of killing a character in 1 combo and have optimized their teams to do so. Even with Spider-Man/doom, it’s not ezpz. I’m sure a lot of Spider-Man players will agree that even with doom, the struggle is real.
Well, it’s incredibly hard to play against the top tier points with Spidey. There’s just no other way to win other than playing very solid or by winning through matchup unfamiliarity.
Nova, Morrigan, Zero, and a bit of Mags just make it hard, add the occasional Viper. Then with trouble assists in vajra and jam session.
I dunno I honestly dont think spiderman does bad in general point wars. I think he goes fairly even with nova/mag and just wrecks viper. Zero/morrigan are just bad though but jam session helps against morrigan.
The biggest thing i can think is people arent picking optimal teams with the char. At this point GB setups are mandatory since you can effectively eliminate problem chars with 0 risk. Besides the magneto one this avenue hasnt really been explored when a lot of good chars have potential setups. I know a few days ago I found a very simple one with vergil doing falling lights into devil trigger xxx utw but I havent devoted enought time to it yet to work out all the possibilities.
I agree with Mags vs Spidey being quite even but not with Nova and pulse shield. You can say that you can break it with your assist but he will have an assist as well to counter yours. As per Viper, I don’t really have a problem against her with beam assist but all the Viper teams I played against either have jam session or vajra. Zero and Morri are obvious issues. Spidey’s not bad at all I agree, but he’s clearly not as solid as the others (bar Mags/Viper - they still require better than average players to work).
You can just do standing light to DT then react to push blocks. I don’t think there are other real guard breaks other than Mags and Iron Man’s though. If there are, they’re probably from characters that can’t provide solid support for Spidey. Morrigan probably can with some unfly + AV thing but what assist?
Yeah the shield is annoying in the matchup because it can force spiderman into being proactive with his offense if you lose the life lead. Still if you focus on staying grounded and using spiderman anti air’s and ground normals Nova also has trouble starting his offense. In the mid-range unless Nova is already on top of you with air. A’s he has no real threatening presence. You can out space him with normals on the ground (cr. H is your best friend) and diagonal web throws can keep Nova wary of using box dash approaches. Fast beams help a lot also. Disrupter xxx webthrow can catch Nova’s setting up shield from full screen.
Standing light doesn’t hit meaty on incoming so any character with air movement gets out for free. Sucks I don’t have recording equipment but I found some semi-effective setups with vergil and a hilarious guard break with Ammy that costs 3 meter.
IM’s guardbreak is sketchy at best. You can PB the proton canon to mess with the UWT timing making it a 50/50.
Spidey on point w/ 1 proj assist w/ good durability n start up. 1 good anti air assist that allows confirms n guard break/mixups. There’s your formula.
Vergil can set up UWT a few different ways. The falling :l: is similar to Dantes box dash :l: into DT. You can do Vergil’s round harvest then :l: xx dimension slash, which would stop pushblock, then UWT. As a general rule anyone can do :l: into a fast starting super that doesn’t hit on the first frame into UWT.
If they pushblock the round harvest wouldnt that push vergil away and you would be forced to guess on the uwt? Maybe im just envisioning what you are saying wrong
Yeah I noticed universally you can uwt from installs but the problem with these setups is if they come in mashing or get hit by the L they bounce out for free and its not something you can react to. W/ vergil on incoming you can SJ. L xxx dimension slash and if they block you guard break them and if they get hit the super combos and you can xfactor and combo w/ vergil. Problem is if they pushblock they end up blocking segments of the super and cant be guardbroken.
Using round harvest gives you a few options. If you throw it meaty then immediately hit :l: after you replace the value of block stun they are in with that of the :l: allowing for uwt to connect. If they pushblock you can do DS to negate the push back then DHC. Vergil was one of the few characters I noticed could adjust rather easily.
As for taking the hit, the only character I know where this isn’t a issue is Storm. She sets it up with meaty j:m: land into ER. Because you can hold the super for spacing and it has a large DHC window Spidey is almost guaranteed to land it no matter the defensive option.