Heads up,
the Nemesis section in assist information has Frank info mixed in there.
Thanks. Fixed in my files for the next update.
I COULD USE SOME HELP!!!
Well, Renvar, I don’t run Dorm with stone smite, or skrull in general, but make sure you’re tridashing after the air series before the flame carpet, and not just dashing. Otherwise, you’re not gonna be close enough, and it’ll alter the timing. I have to do a similar thing to relaunch with Lariat, so, yeah, it is pretty important.
Yes, it is a superjump-dash H. If that’s not the problem, I have no idea.
Alright, so the last time I made a big post about where my team is at, I had finally decided to give in an pick Vergil because he seemed to fit so well for my team. I’m pleased to say that appearances did not deceive, and Vergil fits fantastically with Dormammu and Morrigan. Dark Harmonizer lets me Spiral Swords all day, and yet I still have plenty of meter for Dormammu if Vergil dies. Rapid Slash is also a fantastic assist for Dormammu, far better than I thought it was going to be.
Feeling a sense of satisfaction that I had found the best team for Dormammu/Morrigan, I decided to make a Ghost Rider team and finally enjoy a full-time alt team. Amazingly, putting together what I consider to be the optimal Ghost Rider team took far less time than figuring out the best Dormammu team. Likely because Ghost Rider’s needs are far more apparent than Dormammu’s, so I was able to do a simple process of elimination to break it down to two possible team combinations, and I like one of them a lot more than the other.
I have been playing the Ghost Rider team for a few weeks and love it…too much. As in, when I play someone, I’d rather use the Ghost Rider team than my main team. The win ratio is roughly the same against my regular opponents, but the Ghost Rider team is just way more fun. Thus I asked myself: “Why is the Ghost Rider team more fun?” The answer was apparent: the team is all about Ghost Rider, and if Ghost Rider does well, I keep using him throughout the match and get to win with him. With my Dormammu team, Dormammu is the second character, and if Vergil is alive, there’s no good reason to pop Dormammu in over Vergil. I even tried making it a point to put Dormammu in play, but it’s hard to justify DHCing instead of doing sword loops since it’s notably suboptimal.
So, I am back to the drawing board, but this time not because the team does not work well, but because I want a team where I can rock Dormammu for most or all of the match. It seems I have two options:
- Play a meter-building character and DHC Dormammu in ASAP.
- Pair Dormammu with a “get off me” assist so he can reasonably start the round against the likes of Wolverine.
For the first team type, I’ll likely experiment with Trish, though there’s very little synergy between Trish and Morrigan it seems. For the second team type, I’m not sure what to do, but I’ll keep thinking on it.
As always, suggestions are welcome. I don’t expect people to resolve my dilemmas, but it helps me to type this all out so I know where I am.
For the first, that trish thing sounds like an excellent idea. I can’t help ya.
For the second thing. Well, I suggest Dormammu/Haggar/Any beam assist. Dormammu with lariat is good for everything, extension, get-off-me, zoning, and you have chaotic flame to keep it safe in circumstances where he’d be getting the crap beaten out of him. Haggar gets extension and fun lockdown off Dark Hole, and gets so much damage before a TAC that after a TAC, Dormammu does stupid damage, and is almost guaranteed a kill on everyone for the use of one meter max. And there is reason to use Dorm point over Haggar, because they work well for very different matchups. As for the third, Ranmasama uses Mags, I run Taskmaster (a third possible point character), and I’ve seen Sentinel, Doom, and Hawkeye work well, so would Arthur, Shuma, Strider even. Weirder suggestions would be Doctah Strange (bolts) and RR (spitfire), you’ve be surprised how well they work for both Haggar and Dorm, though spitfire doesn’t allow for lightning-quick fullscreen teleport crossups.
Oh, Morrigan is not optional. If this were just about making the optimal Dormammu team, it would be easy. I am totally in love with Dark Harmonizer for him, though. So, for the second option, the third character has to go well well with Dormammu/Morrigan.
Has anyone ever put together a list of which assists are best as “get off me” assists? I know Shoryuken has no invincibility, but I’ve never hit Ryu out of it either.
Seems like your options are pretty much limited to Doom or Sent or some kind of assist character you’re comfortable with that can help dorm/morri in the 3rd slot.
Oh. Didn’t realize. Then Morrigan stays. Well, I don’t have any list, but just thinking about it, X-23 with crescent scythe, Jill with somersault kick, and Skrull’s grudge. X-23 benefits from Dark Hole and XF if she needs it, Skrull doesn’t really need dark hole, but it helps. All three of them have the option of crossover countering in for a full combo, if a bit scaled in skrull’s case. My qualm with that is combos for Dormammu don’t get the lovely extension Haggar grants, though Skrull’s assist may grant a relaunch in the corner. Haven’t checked.
Maybe Joe? His uppercut can crossover in, he’s good with Dark Hole for his standing overhead, and he can zone well. He would just look so weird in second or third position, well, I guess RoyalFlush does it…
If you’re going for non-get-off-me assists…there’s more options, but then the common glue characters show up, like what Cheechwizard said, and then it gets a tad boring.
any tips on dormamu match ups with nova and zero
I think Dorm/Akuma/Morrigan might work.
I’d like to think so. Akuma/Dark Harmonizer is almost as scary as Dormammu/Dark Harmonizer, so I still have that XF2 Viciousness going on. I tested the tatsu assist against a lot of other “get off me” assists, and it loses to Ryu’s Shoryuken assist and Hulk’s s.H (lol), but it seems to beat most other stuff (including Rising Fang).
I just wish Capcom didn’t nerf the Tatsu’s hitstun. It was supposed to be a nerf to Wolverine, but ended up having no effect on him, but now Dormammu can’t extend off of it. -_-
I can see why you rated Lariat higher than Tatsu in the “defensive assist” department.
I’ve always considered Dorm/Magneto to be one of Haggar’s top shells. Plus, I agree on how flexible you can be with Haggar/Dorm/projectile assist.
I think Double Lariat is a better assist offensively for Dormammu, too. I’m going to be using the Tatsu assist for a while, so we’ll see if my opinion on it changes.
Oh, I made this list and posted it in the Akuma forums; special thanks to Mr. Puppy for organizing the list by result:
Full report of “get off me” assist battles with Akuma’s tatsu. Testing was done by setting my A1 button to Turbo x10, and holding it while I pressed the record button. I would then place Dormammu next to whatever point character was on the screen, and pressed A1 + Playback simultaneously. “Loses” means the assist fighting Akuma’s tatsu lost. Each assist was tested 3 times unless it was clear that there was a winner.
Wins
AA Gamma Charge - Wins
Shoryuken - Wins
Shadow Blade - Wins
Chun-Li’s anti-air kick - Wins
Stars and Stripes - Wins
Charging Star - Wins
Crescent Scythe - Wins
Viewtiful Uppercut - Wins
Double Lariat - Wins (but the opposing point character still gets hit close up)
Trades or Random
Thunder Knuckle - Wins or Trades
Ryuenjin - Wins or Trades (random)
Gamma Charge (front) - 100% random; sometimes they trade, one wins, or they ignore one another
Somersault Kick (She-Hulk) - Trades
Heavenly Slash - 100% random
Shopping Cart - 100% random
Loses
Force Field - Force Field is triggered, but Tatsu ignores the projectile
Sentinel Force H - Loses (bombs never arrive)
Combination Punch - Loses
Rising Sun - Loses
Tatsumaki Senpukyaku - Loses
Chain of Rebuttal - Loses
Heartless Spire - Loses
Rising Fang - Loses
Pendulum - Loses
Molecular Shield - Loses
Mighty Smash - Loses
Tornado Claw - Loses
Lightning Attack - Loses
Spider Sting - Loses
TK Overdrive - Loses
EM Distuptor - Loses
Cartwheel Kick - Loses
Clothesline - Loses
Launcher Slam - Loses
Somersault Kick (Jill) - Loses
Vajra - Loses
Jam Session - Loses
Gustaff Fire - Loses
Bonne Strike - Loses
Bandit Boulder - Loses
Rolling Buckler - Loses
Cat Spike - Loses
Lightning Legs - Loses
Armor Piercer - Loses
Mighty Strike - Loses
So, for a team of Dormammu/Morrigan, where I need a character who:
- Can use meter.
- Can let Dormammu start the round safely.
The following characters seem like possible picks (I won’t take moves with less priority than Tatsu seriously, since Wolverine/Akuma is what I need to beat at the start of the round):
Ryu
Akuma
Morrigan (I wish I could use her twice)
X-23 (Dirt Nap abuse could be helpful)
C. Viper
Arthur
Frank West (makes good use of meter if you can get him to level 3)
Of these, Frank West and X-23 are unlikely to work out since they can be zoned hard.
C. Viper is waaay above my skill level.
Arthur’s Heavenly Slash is far too limited to justify using him for the assist.
I can’t use Morrigan twice. 
So that leaves Ryu and Akuma, strangely enough.
Akuma with 5 bars is probably scarier than Ryu, and his Tatsu is more useful in general situations, so it seems like Akuma is the necessary choice.
I just figured out that Dark Matter’s hitbox gets smaller as it travels.
Dark Matter against Strider about 1/3 of the screen away always hits. Beyond that it always misses. O_o
Also. Performed properly, c.H, Dark Matter is a true blockstring. I just tested it against a Strider mashing f.H in a corner.
I have a list of all characters who can evade c.H, Dark Matter, Dark Hole M. There are 5 total:
Firebrand
Morrigan
Phoenix
Rocket Raccoon
Amaterasu
These two characters have some inconsistency to them:
Frank West (whiffs at max c.H range)
Wolverine (randomly whiffs at max c.H range due to his bobbing crouching hitbox)
Anyone have any snap back combos for Dorm? I only know of one.
Alright, so one of the things I’ve always wanted in teammates for Dormammu is a safe cover against characters who have answers to Stalking Flare. If I do Stalking Flare and Ryu does Shinkuu Hadoken, Shadow Servant beats it clean and Stalking Flare still gets about 5 of its hits in. With Firebrand, I had Luminous Body. With Vergil, I had Devil Trigger.
What does Akuma have? Well, it turns out he has something better than any of those characters.
I sat down tonight and tested the Stalking Flare vs. Shinkuu Hadoken situation, followed by a DHC to Akuma. I assumed that DHCing to Messatsu-Gohado Ungyo would win or trade, so I tried that first. Surprisingly, Akuma lost that exchange, and I felt some despair.
Then I tried Messatsu-Gohado Agyo. Ready for weirdness? It trades with Shinkuu Hadoken. That’s right, the fireballs trade with the beam, but the beam loses to the beam. I don’t understand it myself, but that’s how it goes.
Then I tried Messatsu-Goshoryu just for fun, and that’s what really floored me. It’s old news that Messatsu-Goshoryu negates beams. What I didn’t know is that it doesn’t just negate beams that hit Akuma, but it actually destroys the beam itself. So, normally, if this exchange happens:
Stalking Flare, opponent Shinkuu Hadokens, I XFC for safety;
Dormammu will be safe, but Shinkuu Hadoken burns all but 4-5 hits of the Stalking Flare out, so it’s not a big win for me. It does maybe 50K damage.
However, when I DHC from Stalking Flare to Messatsu-Goshoryu, because the beam is negated, all 20 hits of Stalking Flare connect! It never interacts with the beam at all.
That’s not what the big deal is, though.
Stalking Flare keeps Ryu in hitstun long enough for Akuma to recover and perform a full combo on Ryu, and by full combo, I mean:
c.LMHS, sj.MMH, rdp.L~L, j.H, j.MMH, qcb.L, c.MHS, sj.MMH, qcb.L, qcf.AA, and then whatever depending on your screen position.
It all hits.
I don’t think it’s an exaggeration to say that this is Dormammu’s best DHC response to a beam from Stalking Flare. Even if your opponent decides to XFC to safety, then Akuma gets the blockstun from Stalking Flare for several mix-ups with c.L and his standing overhead.
So, me being me, you know what I have to do: I have to test it against everything. All tests were DHC attempts by Dormammu after the opponent’s cinematic screen appeared. If I say shoryu “wins”, I generally meant that Akuma gets a full combo out of the situation, but I wasn’t consistent on the word usage. If the beam wins, it often leads to a full combo because Stalking Flare picks the opponent up for an air juggle, which gives Akuma just enough time to wavedash, superjump, and rdp.L~L into a ground bounce.
Ice Storm - no DHC possible post-screen, pre-screen Akuma wins with beam or shoryu.
Elemental Rage - Akuma wins with beam or shoryu.
Okami Shuffle - Akuma loses with beam or shoryu; fireballs trade, and trade in his favor.
Hyper Sentinel Force - Akuma beam and shoryu lose, fireballs win big time.
Proton Cannon - Akuma beam loses (but you get a TvC style fireball war), fireballs trade, shoryu wins
Magnetic Shockwave - Beam and fireballs trade, shoryu wins if you delay it, and Akuma still gets a full combo
Spell of Vishanti - I’m sure Akuma beats this with the shoryu, but it’s not reasonable to beat on reaction; you could bait it, though
For the Princess - not even the Shun Goku Satsu beats this stuff - so good!
Grenade Launcher - negates the beam, but not the flare (weird); negates the flare, but not the fireballs (second grenade hits Akuma), grenades rock the shoryu
Round Harvest - beam wins and leads to happy things, fireballs win, shoryu wins but might not lead to a combo
Maximum Voltage - Akuma always wins
Genmu Zero - beam and fireballs lose, shoryu loses unless you DHC right as the beam will hit; Zero still recovers faster I think
Desperado - shoryu wins, beam gets Akuma hit but saves flare, fireballs win
Phoenix Rage - shoryu and beam win, fireballs lose but save flare
Gamma Tsunami - beam wins, fireballs lose, shoryu wins with timing
Gamma Crush - beam and fireballs lose (duh), shoryu wins because you go under Hulk and recover in time for a full combo from Stalking Flare
Nova’s beam - beam and fireballs lose, shoryu wins
Human Rocket - beam and fireballs lose (duh), shoryu wins in a clash if you time it right, but it’s iffy since Nova can direct his hyper
Rock n’ Roll - beam wins, fireball and shoryu lose
Hyper Psionic Blaster - beam wins, fireball…Akuma gets hit and recovers, beam no longer hurts him, giving him a full combo; Stalking Flare gets destroyed, shoryu wins
Hyper Mystic Ray - beam wins, fireball trades, shoryu wins
Hyper Mystic Smash - beam wins, fireball loses, shoryu does very little
Gimlet - beam, fireball, and shoryu win
I didn’t test anything that already loses substantially to Stalking Flare, and I didn’t test anything not projectile-based, since things like Bionic Arm and Hyper Charging Star will clearly lose to the shoryu’s invincibility.
Basically, it looks like Akuma might be the best DHC Dormammu has to save his butt from a bad Stalking Flare, which also makes him the best bait DHC, meaning he lets Dormammu use Stalking Flare against nearly every opponent that he previously had to be careful about its usage against. Naturally, with my team structure, this is like Christmas.
Don’t forget Chaotic Flame
Update:
I did forget to test Chaotic Flame, but results were as expected when I did. Fireball trades, beam loses, shoryu wins.
I also had another thought:
Stalking Flare is ineffective against teleporters because they get an easy punish during Dormammu’s long recovery time. What if I beamed them on reaction? Then I looked at Akuma’s hyper inputs, and realized he has no QCB or RDP hyper, which means I don’t even have to use my brain!
Anything time a beam worked, I think the fireball also worked. Shoryu never works because it’s too slow.
Test results:
Vergil Trick Down - Punishable
Dante Air Trick - Not Punishable (fuck you Dante)
Strider Teleport - Not Punishable (too high for Akuma’s hyper to hit)
Phoenix’s Teleport - Punishable
Deadpool’s Teleport - Not Punishable
Dr. Strange’s Teleport - Punishable if Dr. Strange has no meter, since he can cancel into his anti-beam hyper otherwise
Rocket Raccoon - Punishable
Dormammu - Punishable (beam only)
Not bad!
[media=youtube]GjwAdtcz2qU[/media]
Did anyone else watching absolute battle see Ranmasamas movement with Dorm? You can see it pretty clearly at 7:30 but he was doing it throughout the whole tournament. He seemed to be plink dashing with him in flight really fast. I’ve tried it and cant figure out how to do it nearly as fast as he does. He was plink dashing in upforward and upback directions as well as forward and back. It allowed him to get to superjump height really quick without superjumping.