What’s the best way to set up safe jumping with balrog? I’ve seen the videos, but how to do it is still kinda…lost on me.
Probably a scrubby question but after reading this thread, I noticed that a lot of people are saying to whiff a jab before doing a dash punch. I know that whiffing normals is to give off the illusion of attacking but is that the only reason?
Meh I don’t feel like reading all the posts I missed, I’ll just answer the ones on this page.
It’s entirely just a timing issue. You have to figure out the precise moment where your attack will land if they block, and where you’ll safely land if they do an invincible reversal. To be honest, attempting to safe jump SRK’s online are extremely hard since they have a 3 frame start-up, so trying to do it online is near impossible to pull off consistently. Personally I just fake safe jumps to where I know I’ll land before they can reversal so I can punish. After a few times of doing that I’ll do regular jump ins, so to my opponent it looks like I’m consistently safe jumping on them.
I guess that could be the only reason, it doesn’t add any other practical functions to the dash punch.
EDIT:
If there’s a question you really needed answered just ask it again, I know I missed a lot of posts.
Thanks, i srsly need to play more in person matches.
Hmm everytime I safe jump someone after I get an untechable knockdown, they are usually able to throw me. Did I setup the safe jump wrong or do I just have to look for a tech if they do try to throw instead of doing a reversal?
If you did a safe jump then you should have hit them forcing them to at the very least block if they didn’t reversal, therefore they shouldn’t be able to throw you.
To clarify a safe jump is when you do a jumping attack on someone’s wake up, and you time it so that if they do nothing you’ll hit them, but if they do a reversal (particularly an invincible one) you’ll land before it hits you. This is possible because invincible reversals have a window when they don’t hit (aka the start up) allowing y’all to simply pass each other. For example lets take Balrog’s 8 frame jab head butt. Someone who attempts to safe jump against it has to time their attack during that 8 frame start up window, so if Balrog doesn’t do it they’ll just hit him, but if he does do it y’all will pass each other.
So a safe jump’s animation (if done away from an op) looks like he does a j.fp really close to the ground, where you see the animation start-up, but he lands really quickly? thus if he hits the opponent the animation completes and the op goes into hit stun, or if he can’t hit anything (b/c of the invincible start-up frames) he lands really quickly and can block?
(wow that looks confusing)
[quote=“SalPal, post:84, topic:100908”]
Or you could…actually hit confirm overhead ~ cr.mp xx dash straight xx super instead of throwing it out there to get blocked and punished
u know u r correct…very correct i just have used it n a few matches and it works…yet it is a guessing…thanks tho
You’re making it sound more complicated than it really is. You’re just simply doing a jumping attack on someone’s wake up with a fairly strict timing.
I heard the safe jump on a 3 frames startup srk doesn’t exist in ssf4…
i could make a safe jump on reverseal 5 frames (not consitely), but the best thing happening on a ryu, ken or gouki is a trade.
Are you sure it is possible ? And if it is, do we have to use j.hp (cause i always use j.hk)
To be honest, safe jumping SRK’s is just something I don’t attempt because of the 3 frame start-up. Depending on how much landing frames there are after a jump it could be very well impossible to cleanly safe jump an SRK. So I can’t confirm it right now, however it is advisable to safe jump against characters with slower reversals such as Balrog, C.Viper, etc.
EDIT:
As far as I know the specific move used to safe jump is irrelevant as long as you can get the active frames to overlap with the start up of your opponents reversal.
There are 4 landing frames. 1-2 full vulnerability, 3 you can tech throws, 4 you can block iirc.
You can’t safe jump 3 frame invincible reversals. The way the safe jump works is that you are in the air with your jumping attack hitting them if they click throw (3 frame start up), but land and can block before a reversal becomes active - Sagats TU is 5 frames, allowing you to land and block. The setups are there to ensure you hit this timing consistently.
So according to TheMonkey, you try to hit at the last frame of you jump, then you need 4 frames to be able to block, so it takes 5 frames…to counter a 5 frames srk…so it is just frame, and no way to plink that shit !
That’s why i oftenly miss against spinning bird ex, and always success with the rog headbutt.
Thanks for the additional explication.
And the safe jump punish not only the wake up throw, but all the moves with no invicible frames imao.
It confirms that you cannot jump in on Ryu and co after a knockdown, unless with a empty jump (just jump), cause without mashing any button, you land faster so you can protect from a reversal shoryu, but the problem is they mash throw, you eat it !
SO NEVER JUMP ON A SHOTO 
Yeah, I’m stuck on safe jumps also… I’m always trying to practice them but I just can’t get it down. Yet I land 1 framers all day >_> it’s pretty frustrating. I’ve also heard it’s impossible to safe jump a 3 frame reversal, but someone else told me you CAN. Yeeeah I might just slit my throat from all this confusion. :((
Can anyone confirm if the 4 landing frames only pertain to doing an attack? Or does it apply to empty jumping as well? Either way this means that we can’t safe jump anything below a 5 frame start-up.
If you’ll take my word as confirmation, the extra landing frames apply to doing an attack.
Try doing a ‘safe’ jump against Ryu DPing on wake up with an attack. Then do the same jump with no attack. You’ll see there’ll be times the sam set up will have you hit if you attack, not hit if you empty jump.
Normal landing frames are universal. Unlike pre-jump frames, where some characters become airborne earlier/later than others, landing frames are 4 for every character (the one exception being super jumps from Viper and Ibuki, which have 11 landing frames).
If you do an empty normal jump you can cancel the landing frames immediately into a block, throw/tech, normal, special, super, or ultra. The only thing you can’t do is move until after the 4 frames.
If you do an empty super jump you are completely vulnerable during all 11 landing frames.
If you do a normal move during a normal jump or super jump then you are vulnerable during the first two landing frames (though you can still tech), and can only cancel landing frames 3 and 4 into a block.
If you do a special or a air command normal during a normal jump or super jump then your landing frames are specific to that move. Some recover instantly, some leave you at quite a disadvantage.
Safe jumping moves that have as little as 3 frame startups is quite possible, though the science behind it is different from what is technically understood as a safe jump. Here are three examples of Balrog doing a safe jump vs Ryu’s 3 frame shoryu (and his Super) that were used to illustrate the concept a few months ago in Vanilla. The concept still applies in Super.
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Technically speaking, when someone says safe jumping a 3 frame reversal is impossible they correct in the context of what we define safe jumping as (jump in attack recovery vs landing frames, vs reversal startup). However, what enables characters like Balrog to do a jump in attack and be safe from a 3 frame reversal (that is to say, a 3 frame safe jump) is the fact that with certain normals that have long enough hitboxes you can recover enough so that the first active frame of the 3 frame reversal is not within range of hitting you. So, while Balrog is fully vulnerable during the first active frame of Ryu’s srk, for example, he is out of range of being hit by it, and therefore he is safe, ergo it is a 3 frame safe jump.
Safe jumping 4 frame reversals is also entirely possible.
Okay, that shit right there is GDLK. It’s not so much a Safe Jump in terms of frames as in terms of hitbox/distance… I wouldn’t have even thought of this.
Thanks so much for this xaaz, that’s amazing stuff that I hadn’t seen.
I’ll be downloading these into my game ASAP.
Edit:
Quick questions about the first two videos.
From the fwd. throw, are you doing c.mp immediately after recovering from the throw and then immediately jumping? Or is there an ever so slight delay (am I seeing a slight delay after the c.mp? Or are my eyes tricking me)?
How did you get the timing down for the back throw? It seems like you crouch then jump, but it’s obviously not quite that simple…
Lastly, from these Safe Distance jumps, what’s the biggest damage you can get from a j.hp hitting at that range? J.hp, c.mp xx whatever? Or is there something better?
wow, snip. There are really meaty posts above, continue as you all were before.