^ i tend to try and guess what they will do on oki and try to get a counter cr.mp or counter st.mp if they block then its just a free block string. As far as peekaboo… i have yet to find a use for this move.
I’ll have to test out the flicker for zoning slow big opponents. i think its -6 on hit but thrown from far away may prove useful
after doing a bit of work with it, flicker works a lot like dhalsims zoom attacks. You can be SRK’d right out of it among other things, other things being things that hugo has
another useless fact: Peekaboo MP has fireball invincibility, because anyone is going to be firing hadoukens at such a close range -__-
Yea at this point peekaboo seems lol useless because of the start-up. I only see uses for select tag-in combo’s. Also the fact that his jump-ins are so bad really piss me off.
Peekaboo mp is technically steves best anit-air it is invul from on startup similar to a srk. The problem is how slow it is. Also on you can use it on ppl wakeups if u think they will not go low since it beats out throws and all high attempts.
the problem with peekaboo mp (and with weaves) is that it is not actually invincible to highs and mids, but just upper body invincible. I hate using a weave and getting popped with an overhead - it makes me want to throw up.
that being said - i’ve been finding weaves more and more and more and more useful as i play this game. there are definitely moments for it, and you have to play to your opponents block strings and habbits
its good stuff - situational, but perhaps the FUTURE of steve?!?!? hahahahaha
Was just training a smidge and testing out things I could do about people who stick out long low pokes to keep steve out the whole game. I find that if you stick out cr. :lk: outside of shotos max range cr. :mk: they can’t counter hit it. but if they stick out a foot, you get a hit. Buffer in an ex. sonic fang and now you can have a 383 or so punish for them sticking out a limb for one meter. without meter you still get cr. :lk: xx hellfire for 90 damage since most times you can’t land any other normal after touching from that distance. This is still just theory right now but it could be useful.
your definatly not suppose to play steve upclose. he got nothing but a simple frame trap upclose.
someone probably mentioned this earlier but there is a range where hellfire,overhead and his f+mp is legit.
also this range is perfect to use his peakaboo stance witch you can quickly cancel into his hellfire,weaving/quickspin,duck or AA with cutting elbow (mp)
Also his throw invincble in peakaboo stance.
BUT why is it so incredibly slow to enter peakaboo stance? makes no sense.
I guess i dont play enough but i thought something was wrong with stevea crouch fierce anti air and then i noticed it does 30 instead of 90 unless deep. I didn’t know some moves were like that in this game.
Wait, I’m kinda new to non-smash terminology, Does a deep jump in means that they are literally on your face with the jump in?
Also, I’ve been finding weaving quite usefull for dealing with tekken string mixups. weaving B > shoulder rush >that followup attack which i cant remember the name of leads to a juggle combo which does about 320 meterless. Meter doesnt really make it much better so its a good oppurtunity to build some for yourself
And peekaboo still seems bad. albion combination (peekaboo HP) can lead to some juicy combo’s off the switch in, But only if your teammate has a move that lasts forever while still keeping the opponent standing (perhaps something like a heavy tatsu) because the last hit of albion groundbounces
Edit: Just been testing out albion, The only thing i can get it to link outside of the corner is yoshimitsu’s LP windmill. And the timing is unbelievably strict. It also doesnt do as much as I had hoped, You’re better of just doing a normal combo from cr.MP in this case. Ken’s heavy tatsu works in the corner though
Deep jump in is when you time the air normal on the very last airborne frame, just before you land.
Oh, so a deep jump in is essentially what you try to do during a safejump. Alright got it
So, I don’t mean to sound inflammatory but can someone tell me what they honestly like about Steve, aside from things like character design? I haven’t spent too much time playing Steve so I’d like to think i’m missing something about him but on a cursory glance he seems pretty bad. His overhead is one of the few tekken overheads that doesn’t combo into anything, his dash is worse than Dudley’s imo, his stances seem like garbage (outside of combos) the only things that seem good about him are his fireball, decent frametraps and damage output.
I like Steve’s character design though so I’d like to pick him up as a secondary, should I just be playing him like a frametrap character (like Cody, Guy, Dudley, etc.)?
I love how Steve looks and stylish damaging combos and pressure. But to be honest he is ass as a character. He is a frame trap character that can’t give a reason for people to push a button against him.
His approach play and footsie is pretty shit, all his stuff lose to a decent low, also he literally has no reversal and generally no defence to speak of. He has no good low attack and his overhead is not great neither. He can’t even switch it up and take advantage of the shitty anti air in this game because his jumpins are so ass, so he is forced to a crap one dimensional approach on the ground. His fireball is also as useful as Dan’s fireball, but at least Dan has a SRK. He has to be right up close to be threatening, but even then he can only threatening to throw since his high/low mix-up is poor, and with the way the timer works in this game, I think risk and reward is not in his favour.
He could have been at least decent if he can combo off his overhead and make the start up of his command throw much faster and can be performed without ducking first.
I think he could be great if he could just combo off his overhead, and if his dash command grab hit low. Hell, even if it didn’t hit both heights like King’s low grab, at least something to give them a reason not to just hold down back.
But you never know, hopefully people will find some technology for him, cause right now he seems like a weaker dudley.
at least he hits like a boss.
Ok, right now it looks like steve is ass. True. But guys, we haven’t even scratched the surface of the game yet! Its been like two weeks! The only reason characters like rolento, hugo, zangief, rufus, etc. are considered “top tier” is because they are the easiest to use right now! C. Viper wasn’t top tier in vanilla until the game was about to be replaced by super. Give Steve some time, we will find something about him that makes him a legitimate threat.
So what I have been thinking of a lot is the property in the game that if you charge up one of your moves to the ex state, you get a free counter hit. Now we all know that steve’s overhead ground bounces on counter hit and is easily “comboable” to huge damage. We also know that the quick spin > H attack creates a crumple stun on counter hit and can lead to easy 50%. So as someone mentioned earlier, I believe this character is going to be mainly** using this charge technique to get in the counter hit state and reek havoc**. Also flicker canceling normals on block is something that is extremely powerful and actually gives him a pretty strong pressure game in my opinion.
Now for the complaint that his stances are garbage. . . .LOL that is all I have to say. Grapplers are literally shut down by both stances outside of combos. Hugo is so big that literally all I do is get the life lead and keep him out with flickers. . . . .he can’t do anything to you because if he jumps, at worst you will trade and he will go flying across the screen. And if he starts to charge that clothesline move, it is a high attack so weaving should beat it clean! If he charges it all the way to Ex, I have to test this out, but I do believe the last clap can be weaved leaving him extremely punishable. Just like how hwoarang’s Heavy Kick attack can be made unsafe when dodged at the last hit.
Zangief gets shut down by the peekaboo stance because if you pressure him, but keep backdashing and staying safe (since all of your normals and fox hunt are safe against him when he doesn’t have super) you will get a knockdown. And on his wakeup just go into peekaboo and if he tries to ex grab you, it will whiff and you can get big damage with any combo you like! And if he wakes up jabbing you can just do the L attack in peekaboo stance to eat the hit and hit confirm to a launcher!
Steve has tools, we just need to stop sulking and start using them to their fullest extent.
Gief is more than just SPD. He out poke Steve for free with his godlike s.mp and s.lk. I don’t see how Steve is even close to problem for him, that match up is at least 7-3 in Gief’s favour.
Well i originall chose steve for his lightning fast super, I then stuck with him because he doesn’t have any particularly tight links which is a godsend for someone like me. infact his 1 meter BnB hasnt got any proper links in it, just cancels
Getting back to it. Counter hits are great for steve. If we can try and make sure we have a counter hit charged whenever possible. He’s pretty close to his tekken counterpart in that he kinda loves that counterhit to get things going
Also to add, as much as I believe in Steve’s damage output, his mixup game is terrible. I just realized that knowledgeable opponents can ***quick recover ***from 3mp overhead’s crouching counter-hit ground bounce. That’s right opponent’s can ruin the counterhit that you just EX-charged for absolutely free. Granted that does provide another mixup opportunity for you to walk up throw or hit them out of the throw tech, but that does not seem to provide much reward for spending a time/bar for an EX charge. Ideally you have the mixup of overhead/low(fish for counterhit)/throw, but it would be an ideal mixup if there was a smaller gap between the rewards for each. The damage you get from each option is 80/best combo available/130. If I were defending a stored counterhit Steve, I would rather eat the overhead or throw if it means avoiding a 40% damage combo. Of course this changes according to your health, but I hope my point came across in this wall of text.
I will give Steve this though. I was looking over the online frame data and Steve has the best frame advantage (as far as I know) on block for any grounded normal in the game. His far st. LP and far st. MP are both +6. For comparison Rolento’s close st. LP is +5 on block. Now I am not saying Steve has Rolento-like pressure (those jabs are 4 frames compared to Steve’s 6), but I’m sure someone more skilled than me will find a good use for that advantage.
I think Steve is almost a classic example of an Anchor character. Use someone else on point and look for a free exchange to bring Steve in. I use Ryu and any landed cr.MK can be hit confirmed into a free launch. From that point on you can use Steve’s insane carrying ability to carry the opponent to the wall, or close enough to it. If you finish with jab Flicker, you even have enough time to raw tag your point character back in without spending meter. If you don’t have much meter, that’s a good decision to make. If you have enough for a Super though, it’s best to keep Steve in and fish for the opportunity to use it or an EX meter combo to deal enough damage to end the round.
If you use him on point, or are left in a situation where you have to rely on him to rescue your team, you’re pretty much done. He does not have the tools to deal with any sort of strong zoning or aerial game. The sad thing is that I’m not sure that the damage he deals and the wall carrying ability he has is even worth having on your team, given that the forward roll exists and that other characters can deal as much or more damage and not have as many weaknesses as Steve.