I think Ryu’s hardest matchups are chun li, Nash and Karin. I haven’t fought a lot of birdie players i just don’t run into them. For me i really don’t see how Ryu vs Chun is 5-5 by some people, its really frustrating. I think there is a range where chun can actually react to fireball with a cr mp im not totally sure. You can’t jump on Chun thanks to ex sbk and st lk, she out pokes Ryu by far and because you have to bait out an ex sbk on knockdown it really reduces Ryu’s meaty and throw game on wakeup a bit. Ryu does have the best punish to her instant air legs with parry but you can’t always be on the lookout for instant air legs or you’ll get tunnel visioned which will leave you open to other stuff like dash throw, shimmy etc
If its 5-5 then by far i think it’s ryu’s hardest MU for a 5-5
Nash is easily his hardest match, the character is pretty much designed to beat Ryu, his V-skill, his super, his zoning. After that things get a bit hazy, the game throws up so many random situations that big damage/super is always available.
I’d say Chun/Cammy and Karin are the closest to almost bad, but I’d say they are still almost even.
Daigo seems to have problems with Rashid, who does have multiple ways around fireball and slightly better buttons at mid range. Not sure if it’s bad though, again probably even.
Nash is hard, but i feel like online Nashes still rely a lot on gimmicks, which are easy to punish(like v-trigger when pressured on the corner), specials are also very punishable, meanwhile Chun don’t even need to jump to beat Ryu clean in neutral, and Iall is solid.
The difference is though Ryu gets to play his reactionary/zoning/turtle game against Chun Li, she’s the one chasing you down.
Against Nash you have to go full rush down, something that Ryu isn’t really built for. If you try to zone Nash all you do is feed him meter and super bar.
Chun is a lot more manageable if you can punish legs and her cr.mp. Most of the problems in this game for me unfortunately come down to the game being too damn laggy. Whiff punishing is too difficult for the reward it gives.
If they shaved off the extra lag our sweep would be so much more useful for stopping mid ranged whiffs like Karin St.hk , Chun cr.mp etc , buttons in this game are too slow in general though. Like fighting in cement.
Like i said before in a previous post Chun li is a very hard MU for Ryu because she can counter Ryu’s fireball game with Cr mp, kikoken, instant air legs and even V trigger B+FP to negate the fireball. It might not be on lets say nash level but to me its fairly close to it.
Highlandfireball is right and also Ryu’s normals cannot compete with chun’s. Your normals will be your fireballs, whiff punishing chun is risky but you can occasionally do sweep every now and then just have to keep it to a very minimal. Sadly i accepted this and i seen this with Diago too but against Chun’s St FP the best option is to block it, its better than getting hit by it. Instead of challenging it, block it and reassess the situation, You can sneak in a Cr MP if you feel chun li will walk forward and press buttons.
Keep fireballs in block strings to a minimal and vary the distance when chun has meter or she will punish with Ex Legs. As for her instant air legs you can beat it with Cr Mp, St Mp or parry but parry as the number one option is a no good unless you are sure she will do it because otherwise you will get tunnel visioned and be open up to stuff like overhead, dash throw, dash into blockstring and tick throw pressure etc
Fireballs at mid range is not a bad idea, with chun’s floaty jump she isn’t really gonna get a jump in attack on ryu. Fake every now and then if she trys to v skill jump over your fireball or do a cr Mp. With a 8 frames of input lag im not sure if you can whiff punish her Cr Mp. Make sure to know the range of this move because it will make you frustrated a bit when chun li keeps interrupting your fireballs with Cr mp, atleasts it doesn’t do a lot of damage unless she v triggers it on hit. You can punish it since its -8 on block but at longer ranges i dont know if you can punish Chun.
This is the critical part when you do get in or chun li in the corner or on knockdown from a throw, sweep or combo. No meter you can go ham but with meter you have to bait out an EX SBK. If chun has the life lead and hits you with EX SBK its back to square one dealing with her godlike neutral game and thanks to St Lk even with Ryu’s jumping Lk it will get beat out but once you bait out Ex SBK punish it hard and likewise if she messes up an execution error on Instant air legs or a spinning bird kick in a combo, punish with St Mp Cr FP into Fierce Shoryuken.
When she gets V trigger calm down and be defensive. Prepare to V-reversal a lot if Chun is making you take a lot of white life damage during her blockstrings. Make sure to block the overhead move, i would not use V trigger unless it will win the round having access to V reversal is very important for this MU. You can even try EX fireball if chun does a regular Kikoken to get a knockdown or just dash up to her. This Mu is just not really fun, I dunno why they thought it was a good idea to give a character a dominate ground and anti air game.
@Highlandfireball could you expand more on this MU please? It’s a real struggle for a lot of ryu players out there including me. Even though i posted my own thoughts on the MU your Ryu is a lot better than mines so i think it would be good if others got your thoughts on the MU too
I could write something up but honestly I find every match up in SF5 comes down to the same sort of style. In SF4 there were lots of subtle character specific details or spacings, 5 just feels so similar , it’s all about finding the right spaces and being patient in defence.
I actually don’t play the game all that much anymore.
Rush down. Don’t try and play in the middle of the screen, his buttons are too good in comparison to ours. He has no wake up game.
Basic flow chart for me us to stand outside all of his normals and use some staggerd plasma to bait a chain grab ( which you can St.hk crush counter) or a jump in. Then approach him ( remember don’t contest his St.mk etc ) .
Part of dealing with Birdie is realising how much of his shit isn’t safe - head butts, armour absorb, slide, EX bull horn etc - all punishable.
Once you get him on the deck use lots of throws ( again beats wake up option) and meaty pressure. EX tardy will punish his max range sweep.
Basically don’t try to play footsies with him, he will win.
Chun Li does not only do cr mp on reaction to fireball, she can even WALK UP a bit and then cr mp and it’ll still get Ryu because he has the second(tied with ken, beating fang) longest fireball recovery in game.
There’s really not much you can do against Chun Li’s st.HP spam other than to Yolo DP. Jumping on her is more impossible than her jumping on you.
The only reason people say 5-5 is because a lot of Chun Li players are still playing full rushdown, if she stayed in neutral and poked at Ryu all day, there’s really no way for him to get in. Heck, she can whiff a standing fierce and still mash out a standing short after to knock you out of the air.
I think the most ridiculous design about Nash is his vskill, that move was purely added in just to f*** with Ryu, like you’ll never see Nash using it against the rest of the cast. Ken doesn’t NEED fireballs, he has a command dash which has been proven to be really good even if negative. Chun Li’s fireball is slow enough she can walk up with it so Nash can’t absorb it. Guile’s boom are too fast. Fang shoots two poison balls. So at the end of the day, Nash’s vskill is really just there to make Ryu’s life hard. There’s absolutely no other reasoning in the design for his vskill other than maybe his story.