The Pandora Discussion Thread

Naw, in this Sagat video the fireball was barely out of Sagat’s hands when the pandora activated. Human reaction is not that fast. You can hear the button taps…the second one was RIGHT when the fireball came out. No way he was reacting to the actual fireball release.

However, you COULD force yourself to react just to the actual fireball (like the other video where he does it to Ryu)…but it makes reacting that much harder because now you must visually distinguish between a feint and an actual fireball, which is different from, say, SF4 where you could react to the fireball startup animation with Abel’s U1.

This strategy will probably only work reliably at full screen.

I would have just blocked with hugo, then switched and wait to punish with chun-li.

You have no idea how angry this post makes me.

All of your favorite fighting games have comeback mechanics. You probably didn’t think about it before because the common definition around here is too narrow.

edit: oh, uh, not so much Marvel 2, actually, but that’s a special case.

oh, now all good games have comeback mechanics?
lol this place getting more and more stupid each passing day…

No, it’s about as stupid as ever. Do you even know what a comeback mechanic is?

When I say “all good games have comeback mechanics,” that certainly doesn’t mean that all games with comeback mechanics are good, or that there aren’t really poorly executed comeback mechanics, it means that good competitive games are designed so that players who have fallen behind have a way of catching up, nothing else. Basically every game you use as an example when you say “we didn’t need comeback mechanics in X” definitely had them, they’re just implemented in subtle ways that didn’t incite you to bitch constantly.

Which is why, like I said, it is a matter of implementation.

You don’t know what you’re talking about.

Oh, really? Then, please, by all means. What’s a game that doesn’t have a catch-up feature?

gg(burst and ik is not comeback mechanics, cause they do not reward losing player), bb(same), sc, kof, mk(yeah, x-ray can be obtained both by attacking blocking opponent and taking damage)?
or you’re calling super bars a comeback mechanic?

maybe we’re talking about different things, but i’m pretty sure all those games don’t reward losing player.

I don’t know about all those other games but in Blazblue, you slowly, automatically gain meter when you’re low on health. >_>

damn, thought i’ve messed up somewhere.
scratch bb then = .=

This is basically true and the rest of the discussion is like a big silly argument of the definition of ‘comeback mechanic’.

Stuff like short stun bars and parries don’t specifically reward the losing player, so most people won’t buy that they qualify as ‘comeback mechanics’. They’re also not so gimmicky…

That’s exactly the difference I mean when I say the definition most people on SRK is too narrow. A comeback mechanic can (and usually should) also benefit the player in the lead. The classic example would be Jeopardy, where everyone gets more money for each question the further into the game they are, and if it isn’t a complete blowout, the losing player can bet everything at the end of the game to try and take the lead.

In Street Fighter, there’s usually fairly good defensive options for whatever your opponent can do to you once they take the lead, so barring a few exceptions, you can probably get back to neutral, where you don’t have any real disadvantage other than having less health. In HF, the randomness could always swing in your favor, and generally in SF2 if someone made a big mistake it didn’t matter who was winning, you can fuck them. Once the super move was introduced, you can sort of see how that acts like the rounds in Jeopardy. Later into the round, both players are likely to have meter, so the plays that happen then are generally going to be bigger. I feel like the devs of SF4 probably felt that all the ways that you had to think about meter in SF3 led to almost exclusively complicated game states, so they just generally made it simpler and added Ultra to compensate.

KoF even more so. There’s a lot of back and forth, and you only really see big plays going on when someone blows a fat chunk of meter.

GG and BB aren’t so agnostic to leads. Once someone is on you, they’re going to be doing all sorts of nasty stuff that just doesn’t happen in SF. So, you have burst to let you have a chance to create your own opening and take the lead just like you would in 3S or whatever, plus everyone has meter, etc. There’s also the thing in BB where you get free meter when you’re low on health, but that’s not exactly X-factor.

Compare all of those to, say, Chess, where if you fall behind by three pieces, you are probably proper fucked. It makes up for that by giving both players perfect information about the state of the game at all times.

Marvel is sort of unique among fighting games in that falling behind actually makes you worse. So I feel like if anything would actually benefit from some kind of asymmetrical boost to the losing player, that would be it, but I feel like basically everyone in the world thinks that X-factor is, if nothing else, a ham-fisted way of going about it.

Basically this.

In BB you get a burst for losing a round. KoF games vary from extra meter when you lose a round or access to unlimited supers when your life is flashing - not to mention they are powered up and in other games you get access to even more powerful supers - basically, KoF games had a Pandora of sorts.

Down with 10% life with Kyo in '94?

Spam super till it hits.

posted in the rumors thread but…

Not to late to CUT pandora mode.

I hope so.

I figured this might get cut, it still seems completely useless even for casual players (which ofc, is why they have it) I did see the video of…Pandora…instant 2 bar super with Chun that went through a fireball that was thrown for im guessing great DMG, but that’s character dependend.

If its cut however, something else more usefull will come in lol. So idk if I’d like that

Pandora mode is no big deal. If not nearly useless but can be useful in the right scenario. Therefor its not an OP mechanic but a mechanic that if used right can help you win, which is no different then any other part of the game – they all have a place. I would rather have a refined Pandora Mode be left in the game than the gem system continue on. Pandora Mode at least has a STORY connection, I mean where did the gems come from? No story explanation at all.

awww man they gonna have to take out that evil shadows in the character portraits?

If they do take out Pandora the least they could do is leave the character colors in. I can dig that “possessed” look for some characters.