The only problem with MVC3... is you

With two characters it’s decent as an emergency safety net ( someone trying to chip me out or if I have two characters low health with a lot of red life… ) or if you know you can land a kill with it and the other character is hurt, particularly if they have a lot of red life and you don’t want them to regenerate.

The bigger problem is it really seems useless if all three of your characters are alive unless you can -guarantee- at least two kills with it.

Naw, it’s not equal. Chun can open you up and beat runaway more easily with her speed, but Hulk does a lot more damage off random pokes and has armored attacks.

@Joe the Condor: I think you’re sleeping on hulk.

edit:

Not exploring the evolution of the mechanic enough. Originally it was purely a comeback mechanic and only level 1. Later builds took away the comeback potential of X-factor, which led to a potential “issue” where basically its only use was to guarantee the opening combo of a match killed a character.

The last version was the “staged” version, attempting to bridge the gap between the earlier versions, in theory making it “more” than a comeback mechanic.

If there’s no reason to use the button as anything other than a comeback mechanic, that meas the scaling isn’t properly tuned.

a lame joke

which I assume to mean you can’t think of any real counter-arguments to say?

I’m not sleeping on Hulk. It’s just a matter of fact that the faster character like Chun/Wolverine will open you up in a second. I would never bet on Hulk/Dorm/Doom, etc… vs Chun in a level 3 showdown.

No, Bruce. It’s just that you’re all talk. A waste of time, really.

I don’t think it needs to be said just how incredibly vast the skill gap is between needing to stay on point in MVC2 and MVC3. You needed months of dedicated practice to be able to react or confirm off of situations into 70-100% combos in MVC2, in MVC3 you can learn your whole teams 100% combos in less than 1/2 a day.

When we wanted that high stakes game we were under the impression we would need to put some time and effort into the game to get to that level of intensity again.

I don’t think there were any 100% combos easily done in MVC2 for its first year besides Cable AHVB. It’s only the first week and 90% of the cast has a touch of death combo, if not 100% of the cast by week two.

haha oh wow

And you’re a man of action?

Complaining that x-factor is broken because chun-li is faster than hulk???

I don’t think a lot of people were looking for that. There is a huge difference between ingame skills and execution skills.

I play Team Scrub in MvC2 and that team doesn’t require a lot of execution, but it requires a lot of fundamental understanding of the game.

I want ingame depth and fundamentals rather than hard execution. My execution has always been ass and with the execution level of MvC3 being low, I can finally play characters I’ve always wanted to play and be good at.

Doesn’t mean the game needs less skill than 2.

If MvC2 came out in this day and age, under the same scrutiny and coverage MvC3 had, it would be broken just as fast. MvC2 didn’t have YouTube. Hell, the freakin internet wasn’t as widespread as it is now - let alone people going online to learn some MvC2 set-ups. Different times, man, different times. And personally I’m tired of the rosy, romanticizing of MvC2. I spoke about it in an epic rant in the main thread. “Months of dedicated practice,” MvC2 wasn’t Northern Shaolin Fist Kung-Fu.

Another excuse as to why X-Factor is broken, yes…

It always trips me out. The amount of people here who seem to never know a goddamn thing about the first bit of jack shit.

That’s ok though, and I’m certainly not judging, especially with the game lacking any maturity or test of time in the hands of players.

(Though, it’s highly likely now that even with a test of time, the systems employed in mvc3 which everyone from Joe Scrub, to Pro Chub seem to take a legitimate issue towards, may assert its status as a “lesser” game in side by side comparison to some of capcom’s other tournament standards.
It’s not hard to see even now in its infancy, that “props” and “respect” had from winning in Mvc3, are decidedly lesser than props had from winning MvC2, and that’s simply due to the systems in play. No one’s just ever going to go “I’M SO IMPRESSED, You snapped off the fucking hook with that L rocket punch xx hyper xx Xfactor xx hyper to win the match!!!” Or any infinite variations of it, with any of the roster.
Btw, I’m indifferent to that evidence, and the consequence of it. How YOU work with that information is up to you. Don’t worry about me.)

Also, the only part of any “argument” in this thread that isn’t being “paper thin” or “tissue paper” or any of that, was the very appropriate discounting by Caim, to the very inappropriate noobtube example, put forth by the OP.

But it’s a good thing OP did that, since for me, it best exposes the true nature of the article. No matter to anything else going on here.

Op basically is trying to play/exist by rules he’s imagining for himself, as he sees it, and goes on to try validating them, and himself to us, and why it’s in our best interest to adhere to this school of thought as well.
Many others in the thread are telling him he’s right, too.
Now, I’m not crazy, but…
Didn’t we cover this, or learn what this is, in what, 2000? 2001? 2002?
(maybe some didn’t.)

Op is giving opinion and editorializing. Not giving fact, or truth. Just what he thinks.
His evidence are his opinions and observations, and in that, he’s not even postulating a possibility he may be wrong about it. (How self righteous, btw.)
Nope. What he sees is 100% right. Anyone else who thinks otherwise is wrong.

Heh.

Again, people…

Learn how to argue, before you try doing it. It helps a real lot, not only for the reader, but for yourself, too. That’s right, when trying to seem smart, deep, or profound, or like you’re making a difference, actually figure out what it may or may not take to qualify that.

Personally, I prefer facts, numbers, and irrefutable evidence for something to be informing, or helpful, or thought provoking.
Not opinion, or observations. I can form those on my own.

If I wanted editorializing, or someones innermost thoughts and feelings about what they think…or how they choose to envision, or reimagine an already existing product, I’d read awful kotaku, or go trolling the net for for some tortured hipster bloggers.
They’re great for this kinda shit.
No offense, OP, but you’re not going to tell us why we won’t understand your favorite indie artist, too are ya?

By no stretch is this nomination-status-article-writing.

And again, OP no offense, but take it as you might,
It really kills me to see individuals passing off their opinions or personal observations of “What is real” as knowledge. It isn’t. It never is. It just is not. It never will be to anyone but you. And that’s fine, but…
It’s just your “experience”. There is a vast difference between that and knowledge.
Know this when speaking to people, whether or not they have, or can use six brain cells.

No one needs to reply to this, either. Really. Direct your energy and effort to something more productive. Learn a launch combo, fadc into ultra, or parry xx mk xx super. Play online, maybe?

Do something, but don’t try asserting your opinion or ignorance as knowledge.
Leave shit that to creationists.

Knowledge is : "X-Factor damage will fuck you up more than normal damage."
Opinion is : “X-factor is good…” or “X-factor isn’t good.”

Knowledge is : Noobtube is a launched, proximity and splash based weapon with high damage.
Opinion is : Blahblahblah, its good when used like this, but not good like that, but only when I say or think it isn’t only under these circumstances that I set forth.

I’ll have a debate any day, but this? Nah.

Debatable because of how many esoterics MvC2’s unintentionally brilliant game engine had. Otherwise this is a slightly valid point, the facebooks and youtubes of the modern era make the national/international community much stronger, and as a fortunate and sometimes unfortunate byproduct, games are figured out much faster. Plus arguably the top levels of the community are a bit more… leveled up now… A good thing for learning and breaking down a game, but it does have the unfortunate side effect of destroying some of the mystique fighting games had in the past.

Hmm, seems like this thread went downhill pretty fast.

You activating X-F was you somehow become desperate and perhaps hoping to maximize a punish if he made a mistake, thus he did. Lets say X-F didn’t exsist, how many matches have you seen (With Guile’s theme) where someone is dominating then something happens where they get mind fucked and lose… Just give it away because they got cocky, over eager, careless… Same principle, just fatter dmg…

Maybe take a step back from that match and think what about that match made you feel that way… I’ve won so many matches with any type of movie, ultra, etc. and felt that somehow I should have lost. So I go over my match again in my head and think about how do i keep myself from having to use as result of being desperate again.

I’m a pretty big fan of the guy who just spent half his post railing on things that don’t exist anywhere in this thread and can’t complete a coherent sentence. I liked the thread while it lasted though.

Connecting an ultra can take skill, whereas having super speed, and maximum damage for twenty seconds while getting your health back doesn’t. And it doesn’t help that assists get owned hard in the damage department. I don’t understand why people think that criticizing X-Factor is shocking… Honestly, I know Capcom won’t take it off, but they should at least just keep it only one level, and take off the double damage from assists. I am having fun with the game, but I can’t see myself taking it seriously because of X-Factor as it is now.

The things that have bugged me about this game so far when i have been playing online isn’t the damage or the spamming so much, but other things.

Like when its obvious a dude is better than me and tears my first character apart with combos. Why then, the second i get a hit in on them they retreat and start projectiles? If they had kept going they would have taken my character out! Instead i blocked and tagged out. Happened a few times. I lost anyway but it just seemed unnecessary when the guy could have beat me quite convincingly, rather than letting me get back in the match again. It was after one such tagging in air combo that i got in training mode to figure it out, and i have done now…kinda.

Lag…I got a lot of it with some people.

And most of the teams comprising of some or all of the same people. Now this could be a good thing. You can learn strategies against them quicker and, in theory, they should be easier to beat. But it gets a bit old fighting the same dudes all the time! In another thread i used the example of FIFA online and people always choosing the same teams. Its not a massive problem, it just gets a bit boring after awhile.

“X-Factor is a big factor” -Marn

See, here’s my problem with x-factor: [media=youtube]_DDrsz-nYTc[/media].

Mike Ross had 3 characters and basically had KO’ed the other guy in this video. The other guy x-factor’s at the last possible moment and through mashing, kills two of Ross’ characters before Ross has to turn on x-factor himself. Victory was clear for Ross, but with x-factor the other guy was able to completely turn it around and almost win if he had finished his combo.

No one thinks that that is bullshit?

You can argue that this game is all about skill, but as long as x-factor makes such a huge difference, this game ain’t ONEHUNDREDPERCENTSKILLZZZZZ.

I remember when the first time you saw a fighting game was when it was set-up at your arcade. Like, “Holy shit X-Men vs Street Fighter! Whaaaaat!? I gotta tell everybody!”

Now we, essentially, played this game mentally and (for a lucky many physically) for like half a year now. Same with SF4. I don’t think fighting will ever have that ‘pop’ it used to, but the coverage is what fighting gamers want. And that’s a good thing to be so involved with the development. Make no mistake a good chunk of MvC3 was the communities doing. I even missed elements of the E3 build, but I love what I have now!

The gaming industry in general is fairly transparent, that much we gotta square with.

No, that’s how you use Dark Phoenix.

level 3 XF DPh is pretty bullshit… but it’s also beautiful bullshit.