The "Make Fei Long competitive" thread

Hm. Probably shouldn’t bother to mention this but… SNK’s Desperation Moves aren’t exactly a rubberband mechanic, at least not the way you’re thinking.

In KoF '94 or '95 maybe, since it works on the oldest of their rules (Life < 25% OR Super bar charged), but most of them didn’t have invincibility to speak of, and weren’t exactly speedy or comboable.

In KoF '96 they introduced SDMs, but that requires you to have full super AND < 25% life. Most characters have some kind of combo that would be able to do that (if they weren’t using a few of the broken things in the game), so yeah, you’d get the crap beat out of you for that.

But then in '97 and on they changed to a more “standard” super bar. Generally the attacker gets twice as much bar as the defender does in most cases. And '97-style is what was used to create N-Groove in CvS2. Works exactly the same, save that you can charge more super bar after you break stock.

In '99 they switched to a slightly different system where DMs require 1 stock, but SDMs required you be on low life (< 15%) with a stock, and this has more or less stayed close to the standard in modern games. KoF 2k1 changes it to DMs requiring 1 stock, and SDMs requiring 2, but that’s really about it for actual ongoing changes.

However please note that in NO case here is getting an SDM off done “for free”. You need meter in most cases to get them off, and in the ones where you don’t, ANYONE can kill you in one clean combo. Means that staying defensive doesn’t exactly work as well as you make it sound.

“What about KoF 2k2/Unlimited Match,” You say? In the original 2K2, DMs cost 1 stock, SDMs cost 2 stock, and HSDMs required low life and 2 stocks. In UM, SDMs require 3 stocks OR a stock break + 1 stock, and HSDMs require low life and either 3 stocks or a stock break + 1 stock. Either way you need more than one bar/stock of super to activate them. And you aren’t likely to have that charged up by blocking.

As for Samurai Shodown? Its… different. Generally supers charge up as seen in CvS2 K-Groove… except that supers in Samurai Shodown generally don’t do enough damage OR have enough priority to work as actual reversals. Instead, they’re meant to be used for the one thing they ALL have in common : Weapon “breaking”. If you want to do massive damage on defense, then you’re supposed to take a risk and hit Heavy Slash. That’s pretty much ALL Heavy Slashes are for.

deep breath

That aside, I’m still waiting for news that my old main from ST will finally get SOMETHING that will make him more competitive in Super, and with a “Better” Ultra firmly out of the way… I’m hoping at least Cr. Mk is cancellable, so that he at least gains a bit more effective pressure game.

where?what videos can someone link me to them when they work or something i have no idea where they were originally posted

I was gonna post about it but damn…beat me to it lol.

However you feel to describe the SDM’s and the like, I still prefer the Ultra system to SNK games. They do exactly what they were designed to do: make the game flashier and help provide comebacks from damaged levels of stamina. I’d rather have a “rubber band” mechanic than have a secret move that requires ridiculous stipulations to use and is borderline useless.

embargo is lifted. Repost valle vid on Fei Long. plz.

they arent useless but i wouldnt expect you to know that because you dont actually know anything indepth about snk games since if you did you wouldnt say that. just say you dont care and move on

i think he trolled you guys pretty good. i may be wrong, but he posted something simialar in one of the other characters threads

lol everybody is pissed about the lack of changes for Fei Long and the new ultra still frustrates me whenever I think of it but everybody should just look at it this way. With the extreme nerfs for Sagat (1/3-1/4 less damage output, 100 less hp, no more srk trade bs and no more st.lk cancel) Fei just might end up being higher than Sagat in the tiers.

Everybody let’s work hard to beat Sagat in the tier rankings!

thats a pretty good point. shotos in general seem like they will be less tedious to fight without all the silly trades, and a lot less free bullshit that fei already dosent have. however, im a little worried about some of the new characters just stepping right into those annoying spots. t.hawk, dudley, dee jay in particular

Well everyone and there dog got some type of command grabs now I think that might annoy me the most cause there is no tech/blocking it.

Yea I was thinking the same thing. With the nerfs to some of the higher teir list, fei just might become better by staying the same, not to mention the ability to actually utilize his dash, and faster focus attacks. Things might not be as bad as previously thought. BUT it does seem that sagat’s previous position on the teir lists is being replaced some of the new chars. namely dudley. But then again id rather get beat by a guy that has both of his eyes.

Here’s hoping that fei gets some sort of break :pray:

His dash should change his pressure game a bit for sure. I know in the past I was afraid to dash in sometimes a little late cause of that dam pause.

will Dudley be really that good in pressuring Fei though? Most of Fei’s problems come from trying to get in to fireballers or trying to fight solid defensive chargers.

I mean, Fei’s DP isn’t nerfed in anyway and remains a very solid tool - counter attack ultra is crappy though.
As long as Dudley doesn’t have a good armor breaker special, Fei shouldn’t have too much of a disadvantageous fight IMO.

will Dudley be really that good in pressuring Fei though? Most of Fei’s problems come from trying to get in to fireballers or trying to fight solid defensive chargers.

I mean, Fei’s DP isn’t nerfed in anyway and remains a very solid tool - counter attack ultra is crappy though.
As long as Dudley doesn’t have a good armor breaker special, Fei shouldn’t have too much of a disadvantageous fight IMO.

I honestly dont mind if someone like dudley is god tier for the fact he doesnt have a projectile (other then a rose). This is coming from the fact that almost everyone knows a major reason why sagat was god tier was do to beast fireballs, right? I think I would have cake dealing with dudley with fei, then sagat.

I do agree with you on some of your points, but it does seem as though the damage output that sagat had is more or less being transferred to dudely. An example of this can be seen on eventhubs, he is said to have the most damaging non-ex DP in the game (and i can read your mind…“well dont jump in on him”…lets not forget that he can combo into/from it as well). Also the ability to combo into his ultra using no meter, and the other ways that j-wong showed us just made him seem a lot more scary then i previously would have thought. Fei fighting sagat, breaks down to him getting in and the fei user not making any mistakes that will not only cause him to have to work his way back in, but not make him loose 40% of his life. Fei fighting Dudley, may not have to worry about the zoning as much but the mistakes that are made by the fei user (improperly spaced everything) are still able to be punished with a very powerful combo, which is something that fei just doesn’t have an answer to. Of course this is all speculation, and we just wont know until the game comes out.

Fireballs are the only reason Fei Long loses, which is why the Zangief matchup is so easy!

exactly!

There’s crouching hard punch, that stopped a lot of Rogs
Though its nothing like a Cannon drill or something, but its a really good normal

If fei long remains the same, he will probaly be low-high tier or medium- low tier. He already has problems with fire balls, and that fact that his ultra is bad, not to mention ultra 2 is a counter-ultra.

Hope capcom does something to fix this