I’m pretty sure FreshOJ will tell you Training Mode, Training Mode, Training Mode (and he’s right) :lovin:
Whenever I see a combo being done, I know it’s at least possible so I do it piece by piece it. If it’s a jumpin linking to a close normal followed by other things, I first start with getting the jumpin properly. Then when that’s successful, I try and see how quick the input needs to be for the linked attack. I do that for the rest of the hits.
Now what you ask is character dependant, but if it’s just normals you’re trying to link, then I think that yes … you have to have landed before you can do your next attack (I can’t think of any normal that could be done after another hit while still in the air). And for most of the links I’ve seen, you really need to be close enough so that your character isn’t pushed so far back that you can’t continue with the linked normals. Otherwise, you’re giving the other player enough time to recover and block or reversal.
If you’re talking about normal into special moves, I’m not that familiar with those other than Ken’s. He can j.HP and interrupt it with a tatsu while still in the air (so in some cases, you don’t have to be on the ground at all before the next one connects). You can start the special/super motion in the air after connecting (as you might already know) so that the move can be done right when you land, but that’s pretty much all I know about this subject.
I’ll leave it to the pros to correct me and add more information about what you’re asking.
NOTE: Some SF2 lexicon that I mentioned above
link:a normal move that follows up a normal move cancel/interrupt:a special/super move that follows up a normal move (you interrupt the animation of the normal) … sometimes also mentioned as a 2in1
^^thanks for trying minty, bison and ryu can do two strongs off of one jump but thats not what I’m asking… let me rephrase The problem, if I hit with my jumpin too far from the ground my second hit won’t connect as a combo, I believe this is because the 11 frames of hit stun end by the time I hit the ground allowing the opponent to block. I’m just looking for confirmation that this IS possibly my problem.
Bottom line, a combo is a series of moves done so that you hit your opponent and then the next hit occurs before they come out of hit stun.
Just keep in mind that 11 frames is the same stun caused by a grounded light attack, which means that you don’t get a lot of time. You have to practice timing your jump attacks. (That’s when I’d say training mode, minty.) The plus side of that is that your opponent only gets pushed back as much as a light attack would push them back on the ground, which is why jumping attacks are very viable for starting combos.
Edit: To address something else minty brought up…following a jump attack by landing on the ground and doing a special move is not worth it unless it’s a super. If you want your combos to count, go with the tried-and-true formula of jumping attack, normal move XX special/super move…but don’t jump foolishly…obviously.
If a Fei Long player goes against someone who chooses Honda, should the Fei Long player place the controller on the floor, walk into the kitchen, and cook something to eat?
Doubt this was a serious question, but I’ll play along. The answer depends on if they can Oicho or not :bgrin:
When someone “counters”** with a Honda against my Fei (usually after 4-5 matches), they’re most often trying to get me on tilt (the way they play Honda, it feels like it). I usually test how good they are by attacking in the first round to test their defenses. If they can Oicho (and more importantly store their Oicho), you’re pretty much doomed because Fei can’t do any kind of damage unless he’s up close to the opponent.
Now, if the Honda is a turtle, forget about it. Go ahead, make a sandwich, watch the Honda handslap and headbutt his punching bag while you’re putting whatever condiments you’ve mustered () to find … then, leave that lobby once it’s over and find a different person to play against (if you’re going to stick with Fei). Chip damage does Fei no good, even with supers (I’m not going to rekka pressure that long to amuse this Honda player … I can do that in Training Mode). Honda is the most aggravating of characters to play against when you’re Fei.
While this could be Fei’s toughest battle, I use my Honda games as a test of patience, more so than battles against shotos. All I can add to help with this matchup is:
standing.HP will knock some sense into Honda’s handslap, headbutt, especially if you’re spitting distance from Honda
Spammed standing.LK will beat the headbutt from a far distance (borrrring)
Honda is expecting to see your flame kick, and is just waiting for you to do it before he does his headbutt …
If you can’t complete your rekkas x3 consistently (if you can actually connect), cry…
And for more Fei strategy, go to the Fei Long Thread, lots of good insight on how to use Fei most effectively.
Also (coming from another Fei player), let’s not get into a Fei vs Honda debate in this thread, we all know where it ends up
(:blah: :blah: :blah:).
**I consider it a compliment that they have to pick Honda to beat Fei
on a related note, can someone explain counter picks in the game? Is it about one character having a clear disadvantage against another (if both players were of equal skill), or it’s a 7-3 matchup? What’s the criteria?
Can anyone run me through some fireball trap meta-game with Ryu? I’m really interested in how to play vs each character when you have them pinned and I really think I could stand to learn more about how to effectively fireball trap (or not fireball trap) each character.
Say in a situation where you just knocked your opponent down in the corner:
I usually space myself so that I’m a bit out of their throw / sweep / poke range (Enough that I’d have reaction time if they tried to creep forward to attack me), kinda close to them, but far enough away that I can punish a forward jump attempt with a jab shoryuken.
I start with meaty jab fireball, and then immediately upon impact I throw a fierce fireball. Then I kinda don’t know what to do. I usually play a little game where I mix it up, sometimes throwing another fierce fireball, sometimes throwing a fake fireball to bait a jump (that I punish with a jab shoryuken), and sometimes inching forward and going for a throw. Each one has a different counter-move: The fake fireball you can walk up and punish, the throw you can stay in your corner and punish, and the actual fireball you can jump out of. If they guess right they get out of the corner.
Is there someway to lengthen this little game so I can keep them in the corner longer and punish them harder for guessing wrong when trying to get out? The worst feeling is when I throw a fake fireball and they just sit there in the corner, and then I feel stupid and have no clue where to take the trap next. I know eventually they will just reversal their way out of it, but I’d like to at least try to keep the pressure up. I’d like to leverage as much advantage as I can out of a golden situation like that.
Counter-picking is as simple as it sounds…it’s all about picking a character that easily beats the other character.
Now, how easy or difficult counter-picking is…is really up to you. You have to know matchups, which means you have to know the abilities of the two characters you’re dealing with inside and out.
Personally, I can’t say that I’m a good counter-picker…especially in tournaments. I can specifically remember my last game of a SFA3 tournament (I want to say that was 1997 at SHGL) as seeing a guy pick Balrog again after he had decimated my Blanka (yeah…I picked Blanka) and picking (of all characters) X-ISM Ryu. (I can specifically remember my good friend, Kuroppi, looking dead at me and screaming, “NNNOOOO!!!” I just shook my head in shame 'cause my mind was mush.) I would’ve had a far better chance with A-Ism Ryu and, if I had actually been good at using V-Ism…there’s no doubt I would’ve overwhelmed him. But…I choked.
So, to avoid this happening to you, you could look at tier lists and avoid the so-called bad matchups…and you could easily counter-pick everyone that you play…but I don’t think that ultimately helps you learn how to fight. Your best option is to simply pick characters and learn how to play them well. While I did horrible in that SFA3 tournament, I did get a 3rd place showing in a local Marvel Super Heroes tournament using only Captain America and Psylocke…and beat some Spider-Man and Wolverine players along the way.
Tiers do matter, but ultimately…it’s all about your skill level. I just finished watching about 11 videos of David Sirlin whippin’ up on some Ken and Honda players…with Fei Long. Personally, I think my Ken (and a few other characters I play) could beat those guys, but Dave’s doin’ it. (I sure would like to see some of the highly regarded players from here fighting Sirlin’s Fei Long, though.)
One suggestion: Don’t always throw a fierce fireball after a meaty jab fireball.
Granted, you’re doing what I like to do because, if the meaty jab fireball connects, the fierce one will combo for 2 hits…but the thing is…you can hit-confirm that. So, if the meaty jab fireball doesn’t hit your opponent and they block it…you have several different possibilities…possibilities I’m sure that when I list them will make you slap yourself.
After a meaty jab Hadouken:
Do nothing.
Fake Hadouken.
Walk up and do crouching forward XX (insert any version of the Hadouken here). (If they’re in the corner and you spaced it right, they’ll still be in block stun…which means this will also combo if you do it right.)
Duck, stand up, and jab. (The OG version of the fake Hadouken. People do still fall for it.)
Throw a jab or strong Hadouken. (They won’t combo, but they won’t give your opponent too much space to do anything that could actually hit you. In fact, you’ll probably be able to hit them back.)
Back up and then do 1-5.
When it comes to mind games, you just have to try stuff.
I’ve updated up to post #53 now, but I added a new link in the section about priority that I thought was worth mentioning. It was a post in a different thread, so continue the talk over there if it’s relevant so we don’t have two discussions going on where it could be better consolidated in the major thread about it (we’re already linking to it, so the reader should follow it if they’re really interested on the subject).
The link can be found in the “EVEN MORE” priority area (in the first post of this thread), but here’s a direct link to R|C’s post (good thread as well with hitbox videos): R|C’s Hitbox Video Thread
Does T. Hawk require a change in strategy? Like Gief? It seems every character I know how to work falls at Steven Seagal’s feet, especially if they can command throw
Like Ken, does Ryu/Sagat have any more invincibility frames for any one of their Dragon Punch versions over the other two, like for instance does Ryu’s strong DP have more invincibility than his jab or fierce DPes? Ditto for Sagat.
That’s another option if they’re really sleepy. If you can get that close for the overhead, I’d just opt for throwing them. Still, overhead link into sweep is a nice combo that resets the situation. :r:+:hp: would be a good variant of that, too. You could use it as a dash to get in quicker and throw or you can actually hit with it and, if you hit deep enough for 2 hits, tack on cr.:mk: XX :hp: Hadouken for 4 hits and the dizzy (in most cases). Sub out the Hadouken for the Shinkuu Hadouken SC if you’re feeling really good.
So the dizzy topic reminded me to ask this since this is going to happen to many beginners when facing some of you SRK guys
Now I’ve searched and read about how to get out of dizzies. Buttons don’t have anything to do with it (from what I’ve read) and it’s all about the joystick input. What the engine is expecting is inputs from up, left, neutral, down, right … return to neutral and repeat. Now the fastest way about this is by hitting the contact points of upleft, neutral, downright, neutral and repeat.
Now I can do this with the star dizzy, but still not as fast as I’ve seen online. I’ve tried it slowly (note, I’m using the stick on the 360/PS3 controller to do this), and if I do it slowly, I can achieve this … but I’m trying to get out of it way quicker (seems like doing it slower gets me out of it than doing it faster). What is this neutral position exactly? Am I supposed to just let go for a split second? Or do I just keep moving the stick diagonally to the upleft/downright over and over? (I’ve tried it on a joystick but not getting any spectacular results out of this)
I’m sure the answer will be similar, but how can I get out of a grab/bite quicker? I know it’s left, neutral,right,neutral and repeat … but I’m not getting out of this within 2 hits like I see online. I can maybe get out in about 4 hits/bites (so they never get all of the hits in the grab), but many of my matches are pretty close so I’d like to have as much health when it comes down to the wire.
Concerning the throw, I had read that the multi hit throws were a bit different. As in something like this:
user mashes(4+hits)>>>Equal/no mashes(3 hits)<<<Victim mashes(2-hits)
So if you tech, you reduce it to around 1 to 2 hits, but if you don’t tech and they don’t mash, it does a base around 3 to 4, and if you don’t tech, and they mash, they can get as many as like 6 hits. I heard this somewhere before but it could be wrong.
What is the cross over charge trick? I know when I’m holding back and charging with Guile, if a player misjudges a crossover and I keep charging, as I mash punch a sonic boom will come out in one or more previous versions of SF2. Is the cross over charge trick along the same lines?
) to find … then, leave that lobby once it’s over and find a different person to play against (if you’re going to stick with Fei). Chip damage does Fei no good, even with supers (I’m not going to rekka pressure that long to amuse this Honda player … I can do that in Training Mode). Honda is the most aggravating of characters to play against when you’re Fei.