Shoutouts to all the Lambdas and Riannons in SBO.
I feel like the thread I made some time ago shouldve been stickied or something.
I asked the question on how these games promote defense, because I saw so many comments,posts, and threads like this.
Plenty of players whom I felt knew what they were talking about tore the argument apart.
The gist that I got was this: How could SSFIV possibly favor defense when the top players were still dominating the tournament scene with aggressive/rush down type characters
Fei, C. Viper, Rufus, Akuma, Cammy
Just because a defensive style became more viable and closed the gap between the two styles doesn’t mean the game predominately favors defense.
A lot of people were complaining because there was a disparity between learning beyond basic defense and basic offense. Crouch techs were easy to learn and do while things like frame traps and offensive OSs were harder to figure out and apply, but in no way less effective.
The issue is that the underlying system underneath the IV series does, by design, favor defense. And to make rushdown work, we’ve been given this weird wake up, OS game revolving around hard knockdowns and “vortex.”
Excellent post couldn’t have said things better
4 out of 5 of those are mixup characters not really rush down.
sf4 went from zoning and footies with the threat of ultras (defensive) to a slightly more offensive Option select fighter 4.
I’d take vanilla sf4 over what we got now anyday
okay so we have SF4 which supposedly favor defense, but may I ask what other game does this that’s been release this generation?
only SF4 family of games are “too” defensive. Watch videos of King of Fighters 13 or Blazblue. King of Fighters might appeal more to hardcore street fighter players and it has much more rush down. Maybe if like you like rush down you just need to play a different game that makes it advantageous to play like that. Street Fighter is not the only game out so you do not have to put up with it’s short comings.
Its always one extreme or another
Isn’t KoF 13 all about rushdown though?
in SSFIV, the same character that were dominate the scene in Vanilla with their offensive…still dominate the scene. Boxer, Rufus, Akuma, Cammy,etc were the ones that won a shit ton of tournaments. Guile/Sim/etc didn’t really can’t the change metagame to the level that they control the scene.
Also it’s not like an offensive character weren’t nerfed to obvilion in Super…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dPhftxdbaQ
Boxer didn’t win a major until the end of Super’s lifetime. And I don’t think Cammy did either, but don’t quote me on it
Wasn’t Sagat and RYU the top 2 in Vanilla SF?
Vanilla top tier was Sagat and Ryu.
Completely agree, especially with the statement spacing pressure based gameplay. .
In old games, you felt scared to push buttons when getting rushed down like crazy with spacing pressure, or on the otherhand, you felt pressured to push buttons out of desperation and you had to maintain your composure and tell yourself not to.
Also, it’s not just about rushdown but how active one has to be. Turtling and zoning itself required being active and a step ahead of the opponent. Even the lamest, defensive East Coast players Jwong and Eddie Lee had to be active. You couldn’t just hold downback all day or stand back.
This thread needs vids.
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As a person who plays MvC3 this thread blows my mind.
Rushdown is most certainly not dying, and SF4 games are only as offensive as you make them, really, I think people who complain about SF4-anything being boring or scrubby is just being an asshole. However, here’s something I will give you. CREATIVE rushdown is declining. In the days of Vampire Savior, there wasn’t any very specific ways to attack the opponent, you could attack the opponent multiple ways to keep pressure on them, it didn’t neccessarily have to be a combo, but it could be keeping them in block stun, or out-prioritizing them. BnBs are more favored now, in that when you get close you want to do a very specific combo to maximize damage, then do some sort of reset or safe jump, then you want to get yourself back into position to land said combo again, or you could settle for whatever combo that is favorable for where you might be positioned on the screen. This is very true in MvC3, but in that game getting in position for said combo is easy as piss, one jab leads to 50% health.
I don't play many modern 2D fighters anymore so I can't speak on them, but in newer Capcom fighters in particular they do promote rushdown, but* on rails *rushdown. Rushdown consists of movement-utility -> BnB, then when that's over, getting yourself in position to land that same BnB again. Though it becomes more fathomable when there's many BnBs to choose from, which is why Akuma is so fun to play as. Then when you're talking about a rushdown that involves spacing and mindgames, like in SF2, there's characters that still do that, like Bison (Dictator) and Boxer, which is why I play those kinds of characters. Rushdown is alive, but it's not the same as it was.he is banned until october
Eh. King, Ash, kensou, etc say otherwise.
people confuse agressive gameplay with rushdown
there is still zoning and spacing game on modern games despite of what many people would tell you