Fuck off already.
100% But the developers don’t agree that’s why games are being dumbed down, like sfv and most likely mvci.
That it usually is right and its worth being wrong sometimes because the law of averages?
This is the most senseless thread I’ve ever read.
Special move macros? That will help with casuals in the game? Simplifying moves have 2 potential outcomes. The shortcut is pointless and casuals still leave. The other is that it is too good and will break the game. Don’t believe me? Go play Super Street Fighter IV 3D Edition.
Good responses, guys. Real “SRK we da best” of you. Someone tries to relay what they think is wrong and y’all go measuring your dicks. No really, good job. You dun showed the OP but good.
^ Given this is SRK, that post is going to be immediately misunderstood by folks who insist they don’t turn into blubbering manchildren the second they see something that penetrates their little echo chamber, so let’s elaborate a bit. (And note, this is going to be a one-way convo: save your questions for after, then huck them into the trash, because I’m not replying to you.)
You can have or enjoy fighters with a high physical execution requirement.
While the garbage myth that said requirement is mandatory in well-made fighters is just that, a fucking myth, the level of execution you’re comfortable with is completely subjective. And hey, look at that: there are tons, and tons, and tons of fighters that already match your tastes.
Go play them instead of telling the OP to play another game. Or maybe do what SRKers say is the SRK thing and actually suck it up and learn these new accessible systems. Live up to that whole anti-scrub mentality you so often preach but rarely practice.
You can acknowledge flaws in the scene and its games and still be a part of that scene.
I see this shit all the time whenever I decide I need some adversity in my life and take a gander at SRK’s toxic, vile forums: the idea that if someone doesn’t like some long-established thing in fighting games, they simply must not know competitive play, tournaments, ranbats, etc. Not that it matters for someone to have gone to Evo when they talk about the things in fighting games they (dis)like, but newsflash: when I went to Evo, and when I went to various Canada Cups, I always spoke to people who had similar ideas to the OP.
(Betchu anything “how many made top 8” is the next thing on your minds, you fucking clowns.)
It’s hilarious to see SRKers attack the Smash scene for admittedly idiotic things like not allowing Hitbox controllers or items and the like, then become just as fickle as that fucking scene while acting superior. And being much less successful to boot, unless y’all want to deny the numbers and hype that just-as-fickle scene has brought to your events.
Even then, I’m pretty sure Smashers still consider pro-item and pro-Hitbox advocates to be part of their scene.
Hating the shit fighting games do doesn’t mean you hate fighting games.
Street Fighter 4 is garbage. Hot, messy, steamy garbage, in all its iterations. Yeah, it produced some hype tourney moments thanks to some amazing players. Yeah, I played it at ranbats and when I went to tournaments, even though I was always more excited for other games. SF5 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 4 ever was even in 5’s current problematic state, and I haven’t played nearly as much as 5 as I have of 4 yet. You can hate shit fighting games do, hell even specific fighters, and still want to play them.
This idiotic idea that you cannot find fault in something you enjoy is the second-most infuriating thing about gamers, of any fandom. You can think 3S parries are super dumb and still have fun with the game and like Daigo’s parrying of Wong’s SA2.
(The most infuriating thing is Gamergate and how it turns out a lot of gamers are “alt right,” ie, misogynist neo nazis, in case you were curious.)
Y’all wear this flimsy, fragile veil of pride about fighters, and when someone voices criticism, concern, or so much as suggests something new, you cry AHVB tears so intensely you don’t even need a battery to build that meter.
Protip: introspection, self-reflection, self-awareness, and just the slightest bit of an open mind when posts like the OP’s comes along will go along way to growing your scene and making these forums a better place.
Or keep being one of the internet’s worst places until the end of time. Your call.
Later.
I agree, SFV is better than SF4
That was the point of that post right?
It’s a shame all this truth will be ignored due to the nature of its delivery…telling a child to grow up doesn’t get results if you call them a dumbass in the process. This is exactly why I wanted this thread closed. No one can handle their “feels” when the things they believe in are challenged and it just becomes a name calling gaggle of fuckery.
This is why I stopped replying once the argument on singleplayer modes ended. At least that was a legitimate issue since there’s the question of whether casuals who never do versus or hit events actually benefit the scene in the long run (beyond first month sales).
However, whenever actually making the fighting more accessible is brought up, people start acting like assholes. Granted, the genre’s issue with accessibility is beyond just motions and inputs. That said, people just aren’t willing to see beyond the old ways.
TL:DR I could have used you in the Fantasy Strike thread.
I’m not really sure how much more accessible you can get than SFV… apart from a few specific elongated combo’s… nothing is complicated or hard to actually perform.
The hard part is just the opponent you play…
There has to be some sort of skill and practise involved, you reference it to an FPS where you press a button and the gun shoots, but that’s not quite the same. That’s the same as saying, you press the LP button and your character punches.
If you wanted to snipe a pilot out of an aeroplane in battlefield 1, there isn’t a button for that.
Fighting games as they are currently ARE more “accessible” than they have ever been.
Your ass could be playing a joke game like dive kick and still get destroyed because you are and will forever be trash, then what? It’s like one button to play even that game, what do you want to do then op? Maybe they can make fighting game where whoever gives the company the most money wins the match before it starts? Oh shit nevermind they already made that game.
Catering to people that want to dumb down games is really what is killing the scene. When you got guys winning tourneys and talking about how bad the game is and that they don’t even like playing or practicing it is when we have a problem.
i have 2 reasons why fighting games fell off.
- Any genre of gaming has its moments of popularity and unpopularity.
for example. during the ps1 era, 3D platformers and adventure games were popular.
during the ps2 era, it was jrpgs and anime games.
during nintendo days it was 2D side scrolling platformers.
during the snes early 90s…fighters.
nowadays, at least since the ps3 era…its been zombie games and fps.
point is, the popular games always changes genre after a certain number of years till it burns itself out.
2)What alot peeps dont wanna accept but it is true.
modern fighters are too complex.
yea, i said it.
back in the early 90s…most fighters were around SF2 simple. easy to pick up and play and enjoy yourself.
nowadays every fighter has a million systems, mechanics, and extremely complex combos.
notice how early 90s fighting games didnt have training mode.
its because you really even didnt need one.
true that most fighters were once arcade games, and training mode didnt exist for an arcade game. but that was a good thing. because it was designed for the masses to enjoy. you learned as you played. which is what the non-committed masses want.
with the death of arcades and the “put your quarter in and enjoy” philosophy of arcade fighters…there came the super complex, spend 1,000,000 hours in training mode getting the muscle memory to execute 1 frame link combos…and that ended the non-committed to fighting game masses interests in delving into a game for enjoyment.
thats the reality.
the more complicated you make a fighter…the more niche the audience for it becomes.
the masses are not willing to devote 10,000 hours specifically to practicing a set number of combos, and hammering it into their muscle memory. they just arent dudes.
for example.
i love guilty gear.
i also love melty blood.
but i dropped those games because i just dont want to spend a million hours in training mode trying to hammer into my muscle memory all those ridiculously complex and tight timed combos.
i’m not willing to spend countless hours trying to learn dustloops and roman cancels etc etc.
ugh.
that…
isnt…
fun!
i do not find training mode fun.
and i think i can confidently state, that i speak for the masses when i say that the masses don’t enjoy training mode in a fighting game either.
we just do not.
i remember spending an entire month in training mode trying to hammer down the muscle memory for Juri’s ex counter into hk into ultra 2 in SF4.
dont even get me started on trying to hammer down Juri’s cr.mk into fireball fadc that into ultra 2 which is a 1 frame link.
its so boring.
so exhausting.
just so tedious to have to spend X & O amount of time in training mode just to be able to compete with others.
i dont mind learning. i just mind learning when its not fun. ie, not while you are playing. aka fucking training mode.
i know i’m gonna get alot of hate, prob alot of disagrees…but hey, its true.
you are asking alot from the masses when you ask them to spend 10,000 hours in a game’s training mode…just to "git gud."
its why we dont ever have any fucking heads online for fighting games.
so ok. you like training mode.
good for you.
you like figuring stuff out, exploring stuff, and discovering new things in training mode.
great.
you…are a lab monster.
fantastic.
enjoy your niche game with a niche crowd numbering a few hundred at best spread around the world where you cant get any games in with them except for the few random tourneys being held once in a blue moon.
cuz thats all the ggs your gonna get with a modern fighter.
the reality is that fighters strayed from the true path.
it will never be like the early 90s.
never.
fighters will never be popular again till they go back to basics, simplify shit for mass appeal, and where the game/you doesnt need a training mode or spending 10,000 hours hammering down super complex Simon Says combos.
i’d rather play SF2 in the early 90s which had a million heads because everyone felt they could pick up and play and enjoy and learn the game as they played. a game without a training mode because you didnt need one because the muscle memory wasnt demanding…
than play something like SF4 where its asking you, telling you that if you wanna be good…you’re gonna haveta spend a ton of time in training mode trying to hammer bullshit Simon Says 1 frame combos into your hands/muscle memory.
i’d rather play a simple fighter with no complexity and has a million heads playing it,
than play a super complex fighter, which is niche because it repels all the casuals due to how demanding of your time in training mode it is.
just sayin.
Your everyday casual gets destroyed in those “simplified” games from the early 90’s. Simple or layered, it DOES NOT MATTER, its a mind set of dedication over one that just wants to have fun. If they can’t accept getting their shit pushed in as a part of having that fun then they should cease playing against more skilled players.
Whats funny about this thread is that a kid with cerebral palsy showed me his mkx videos. Apparently hr plays one handed.
Funnier than that is how people acr like we are the assholes for anything said here. Let me perfectly clear about this because i know some of our dumber members dont understand: shoryuken.com does bot and has not made any fighting gamez. As such, telling us that motions and combos need to be easier is ae of time because there is nothing can do to mechanically change them. On the other hand, we can provide an avenue for learning how to navigate the games once they are made.
How exactly can this community be an asshole about anything?
“This should be easier to do.”
“Maybe, but thats not the game you’re playing”
That negative mentality is going to affect your ability to play more than anything the developers have done.
“Well there’s more ways to play these games.”
Not here there isnt. There’s playing against other people. Sure we do all the other random shit, but final round hasnt been going strong for 16 years on the back of who is better at beating arcade mode.
You know what you can do though? Hit up developers directly and stop acting like this is the place to complain about it. There is nothing this forum can do except help you get better.
I should play SSFIV 3D Edition again. Casuals can do their specials while keeping competitive play intact. Competitive play intact. LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL 3D Charge characters. Once again, you can only do so much. You can only make a game so accessible before one of two things happen. You make it so easy to do things the game becomes broken or you make the shortcuts so pointless why even do them?
I like how everytime someone gives a good reply somehow he gets ‘‘If you don’t like then leave’’ out of it lol
Since we’re here. Somebody give me a 4 button simple mode configuration that lets you do lightining loops, morrigan fly/unfly fireballs and doom infinite in umvc3.
Also plink dash.
seriously. fuck super easy controls. it’s not the answer to why fighters were so popular in the 90’s. if you think easy specials is the answer go play Rising Thunder, figure out all the combos in 5 minutes in training mode, play and prepared to be bored with the obvious strategies and lack of reward and discovery.
some people become way too idealistic like Sirlin and Seth, and fail to see how narrow their ideas of a fighting game have become. fighting games are not meant to be huge Esports bullshit games. they’re somewhat niche and that’s fine with me because the more they try to make everyone like them, the more boring they become. they were popular in the 90’s because there was nothing else like them at the time. now there are many more genres to compete with and we are no longer in an arcade setting.
Complex commands and muscle memory are a big part of why it’s easy for me to compare fighting games to physical sports. There are a ton of people that know what NFL athletes do but can’t actually do them because of a lack in talent or flat out genetics. At least in fighting games, you CAN become as good as you aspire to be since it’s more skill then physical abilities. If fighting games are taking a decline it’s because more people want things given to them and now have other avenues to go to once they fail here. The only thing that developers have to do now is make sure the games don’t look intimidating in the beginning and trick bad people into thinking that can play, and let time weed them out (after they good their money). It’s not that fighting games are hard, it’s that the definition of “average skill level” increases over time and if that level is over your head, you gotta grind it out…which means losses…which sometimes leads to crying/quitting. The stuff that the opening posts complain are no different then the kids who cried about basketball at gym in middle school.