Uhm, no it doesn’t. For some moves it’s there but not for Asuka’s d+3+4.
My ass they should. Why don’t people realize just how stupid this move is? It’s an amazingly BS string ender 'cause there’s NO ramifications, and the reward on hit are awesome.
Honestly, I feel if they just made Nina’s uf+1 techable, and made Steve Fox sidesteppable, the game would have been fine. Nina can keep the df+1,2 garbage. And I don’t care about Steve’s speed, frame advantage, and wall damage. All I want is for a character who has all of that, to be sidesteappable for balance against it. Julia only has the speed and damage. Not the safeness or wall game of Steve, and she’s sidesteappable like crazy. Doesn’t make sense.
Of course, there are some minor fixes that needed to be addressed. Kuma’s f,f+2 and Rogers df+1,2. Those moves are horribly programmed. Rogers df+1,2 will wiff the 2 at point blank range. And Kuma’s f,f+2 goes through polygons too much like nothing is there. (is “clip” the word I’m looking for?)
But tiers will always exist. People who bitched about Bryan, especially his b+1, need to learn that standing in one spot after blocking it is your fault. B+1 was overrated. Nobody should be a victim of b+1 spam. After a blocked b+1, SS~b~b (sidestep back dash) avoids anything he can try after it. Even the extended throw (f+2+4) You are always going to have character stronger than others. They finally deliver a Tekken where Mishimas don’t ass rape people, and now it’s a problem. Honestly, people got what they originally asked for to a degree. The Mishima fest ended.
In short: All they had to do was make Nina’s uf+1 techable, and make Steve more susceptible to fall to a sidestepper. The game would be fine after that. They did more harm then good with this new patch IMO.
I wouldn’t be surprised if people reject it and go back to the original T5.
Jive Out!
With the nerfing of the big 3, I severely doubt it (assuming the game actually sees a widespread release outside of the Japanese/Korean arcade market). I do NOT want to go back to dealing with Steve, thank you very much.
As for b+1…launchers shouldn’t give +3~4 on block, plain and simple (according to me at least, heh; and that include’s Ganny’s b+2). Yes you can beat b+1 spam, but the risk/reward for the move was just too rediculous. If you block it and Bryan sidesteps with you, THEN does another b+1 (and he’s gonne sidestep to your right 'cause it’s the only direction you’ll step him to begin with), that causes more problems for you. I agree that it wasn’t that big of a “must-have” change, but with Nina and Steve’s launchers getting nerfed, it was only fair that Bryan also lose something in that regard. Hell he’s still got f,b+2, arguably the best launcher in the game.
The reported changes to Kuma/Panda’s ff+2 have nothing to do with hit detection. Instead they made the move safer. If it tracked it’d be downright retarded (it’s already too hard to punish IMO), 'cause the push-out is insane. I’m not too sure making it safer was wise, but hey, you gotta give him something right?
Something to think about: Making an update isn’t just about balancing the game. It’s also to keep it current/relevant. Part of this is changing the game just for the sake of changing it, to keep it interesting and fresh.
I would rather deal with their bullshit, then lose my characters good points. Like Roger’s tail sweep now being -16 on block. Come on. What useful juggle starters does Rog have other than hopkick? SS+4 can be seen coming, and rocket stance > 2 isn’t practical. Db+3 wasn’t exactly fast, and was victim to anything mid or high. And the move didn’t even have to be quick to hit her while Rog attempted db+3. Changing Rog’s CH 1212 properties is kinda gay too. I don’t welcome the safer and spam friendlier f,f+2. It came at the cost of too much IMO. Rog’s df+1,2 is something that should have been correct the first time. That move was horribly programmed. Really doesn’t bother me that tech traps are gone. They aren’t as effective anymore.
And Law? Why did they even touch him. Really?
Jive Out!
But how many characters have really suffered besides the top 3? We won’t know for sure until all the changes are found and the game is played for a good amount of time.
Considering the move’s properties, I don’t think -16 is that bad. It’s unparryable, leads to ~50 damage, and is hard to block on reaction. That’s still pretty fucking good. And as a Marduk player, well, I’m not that sympathetic when something that’s -16 is at least a buff combo starter. And this is REGARDLESS of the 5.1 changes to his d+4; if that move isn’t safer, I’ll need to kill someone.
But that’s assuming they’re trying to interrupt you in the first place. He’s got the tools to make someone hesitant to attack, even with the loss of CH f+1,2,1,2 combos. Overall Roger hasn’t changed that much, just slightly less cheezy. I think you’re just taking losses way too hard, no offense. Better to start thinking in a positive light and waiting for what we have yet to find out.
Well, for starters, they didn’t really change anything. And second, I wouldn’t mind if they nerfed him some more. He’s rediculously strong, especially now that S/N/B are weaker.
sorry but tekken is just too random anyway so wont effect many people to tell the truth 
yah :rolleyes:
My God you’re right. How could I have overlooked this painstakingly obvious fact?
glad i could help
Nobody can beat your top tier Eddy/Christie.
You know, now that I actually thought about it. I guess it really doesn’t matter since I only used the tail sweep in oki as they got up, or out of a psuedo wave dash. And the only reason I used it out of the wave dash, was because random wave dashes to f,f+2 stopped people from poking/ducking, which really helps set it up. So now that T5.1 f,f+2 on block is safer, that sort of allows it be spammed more. Which I guess in the end, helps out the tail sweep mixup. 
My bad.
But I sill stand by my opinion that if they fixed Nina’s uf+1, and made Steve sidesteppable, the game would have been just fine. There will always be tiers you have to deal with. No game is perfectly balanced. Well, Karate Champ was. But that game was the exception, and the **least fun fighting game ever made. <— Don’t hold me to that.
Jive Out!
Jean Claude Van Damm owns joooooo^^^^ in Karate Champ.:looney:
My bust… Stand Guard the first hit, and you’re forced to stand Guard the second, or you eat the hit and stay standing…
What do you mean by this? You say it doesn’t, then say it does in the same breath? 
None of Asuka’s moves ATM does this, but I know Hwoarang and maybe Nina/Anna do it. =/
Uhm, it seems you’re mixed up. Nobody has claimed there are no strings that are unduckable if the first move hits. But Asuka’s d+3+4 does not currently have this property. That’s all I’m saying; you’re reading too much into things.
You guys like my compiled list don’t cha?
Ok, I see where the confusion is. I didn’t say Asuka’s d+3+4 to begin with. =/
As for whoever was defending Bryan, NO he wasn’t raped enough. Who else in the game has a launcher that can hit you at about 2 dashes(or at least, 1 dash from starting positions) away? That leaves him at enough advantage to jab you if you do block it? SS Cancel doesn’t save you from basic Yomi crap off of this move alone. In fact I could say, IMO, this is the other reason that he gets any wins. Slow down/give neg frames/remove launch on normal hit would be all I want at this point. He has more than enough fast moves.
Not really… just because Mishimas don’t dominate doesn’t mean people got what they wanted. The game became even scrubbier now without Mishimas dominating. At least before you could be sure that players who were good with Mishimas had alot of skill to destroy you (because average Mishimas were very beatable). Now even average and bad Steve/Nina players are still difficult to player against with alot of the cast. I think T5 Steve and Nina were much worse than Mishimas in TTT.