Super Street Fighter II Turbo, in the house

Classic Fighting Games Super Street Fighter II Turbo
3235

I have to disagree with your first point (of the two). CPU can and does improve you’re reaction time. Turn ST up to T4 and play the game defensively. Wait for the opp. to attack and counter b/f they can attack again. Practice until you know when to counter with the most effectiveness for each individual special. Since the CPU does have Patterns that are very obvious, “you have to learn how to learn.” I decided that by just counter attacking my reaction time increased dramatically. If you forget the pattern and just focus on individual attacks you’ll have to have incredible speed to survive.
Your second point is absolutely true. The CPU cannot teach you technique; this comes from tons of matches against various human opp.

Eduardo24
The CPU is terrible to compare to human opp. The only thing the CPU can ASSIST you with is reaction time, move execution, combos, counters, safe jumps, general match ups, range, patience, strength, reversals, and cancels. You can only learn some of these if you know how to learn i.e. teach yourself. Ex. I had to learn how to position my thumb on the joystick so I could execute moves with precision timing. As for Tick Setups, general game plan, real match ups, and EXP.; the best place is human opp. and tourneys (especially trnys); you should watch trny vids as well.

Not tryin to flame jchensor:D

3236

The problem with using the CPU for training is that the CPU is not programmed to realize when something doesn’t work. It basically cycles through different strategies, whereas a human player, when something no longer works, will stop doing it against you (unless he is a special brand of stupid). So no, I think Chen’s first point stands too.

3237

Playing the CPU is fun once you get good enough to be able to rush it down.

3238

Seriously, does anyone even know what RTSD means anymore? It’s just thrown out these days.

3239

Try rushing down feilong on highest setting. I bet you can’t. :arazz:

3240

No, I still disagree. It’ll help maybe the frist one or two times you play the CPU. But eventually, you realize the computer only tries about 1 of 4 or 5 things. And your mind trains yourself to expect one of 4 or 5 things. When you play against experts, there is almost a limitless amount of things they can try to you. Against the computer, your reaction is no longer true reaction. It’s "anticipated’ reaction. There’s a great article about different types of reaction, and I’ll link to it when I find it again. But playing against the computer, regardless of speed, will not help you much.

3241

Point taken jchensor.
I guess I should explain myself a little more clearly. When I say reaction time, I mean litteraly the time it takes you to see the start up frames of any move and know what to counter it with. As far as setups the CPU does no good. You’re also right that the CPU is programmed to only try certain moves at certain times. Here’s an example of how to improved reaction time using the CPU.

Use AE training mode and turn the Opp. to CPU. I’ll pick blanka for example. Blanka is only going to try and jump in or use the rolling ball attack most of the time. Set the speed is at it’s highest setting, and don’t memorize the CPU patterns [this is the key idea of using the CPU to train; if you become to familiar with one character switch to another/or pick a diff. SF game like CvS2]. Just try to counter every attack. When Blanka attacks with a rolling ball see if you’re fast enough to counter it with a lp srk. If you can counter several WITHOUT knowing that it’s coming then you’re reaction time has improved (if you KNEW it was coming then it’s not reaction time; just as jchensor’s point suggests).

This approach has helped me (if it hadn’t made a definate impact on my gameplay then I wouldn’t be arguing the point) and it might help others. Some gamers might not benefit, but some can. I just want anyone reading this to understand that the CPU can be of use if you know how to use it.

3242

[media=youtube]YDnSIgNlxrs[/media]

Just me playing on crappy emu, I usually play on my supergun.

3243

Wrong. Your reaction time has not improved, only your ability to anticipate, which isn’t the same thing.

3244

What are you trying to say? :confused:
I typed, "(if you KNEW it was coming then it’s NOT reaction time) i.e. you’re anticipating (basically guessing the attack before it begins) which defeats the way in which you use the CPU to improve. You don’t sit there and try and guess what the opp. will attack with, you wait till the attack comes out in order to make the best decision in the shortest amount of time (only part of the decisions will be right b/c the other part comes from hum. opp.). If you practice at something you should get better at it, whether you’re using the CPU or not.

Are you saying that if I could srk’n 5% of “fierce blanka ball” before using my method; and now I can srk’n 95% of " " , my reaction time hasn’t improved (this is srk’n them randomly)?

3245

Well, now it’s all come full circle because you’re insisting that you can use the CPU to improve your reaction time when it’s already proven that it does not help.

To go into more detail, your example will only work if you do the SRK during Blanka’s fierce ball but before it hits you. In order to do that, you have to keep the stick in neutral until it happens, and then input the SRK motion during the fierce ball to have it hit. This is taxing even to top players.

The typical shortcut (empty SRK) is bad, too, because then you will be victim to opponents who will use that to make you flinch once they realize you’re basically playing chicken with them. The only way for this to work is if you commit yourself to not do anything until you see the fierce ball and then (ONLY then) do the SRK. This is HARD. Not even OG players can do it with ease.

When it comes down to it, reaction time is one of those physical things that you either have or you don’t. You can’t get better at it.

3246

Updated the Wiki with Chun vs. Guile:
http://shoryuken.com/wiki/index.php/Chun-Li_(ST)#Vs._Guile

It’s just a primer, so let me know what you think is missing.

3247

Hey…

http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q125/MasterBigode/0004-2.png

A friend of mine got this from eBay.
Anyone has heard about it before ?

3249

there’s definately a ‘rainbow edition’ of ST out there but I’ve only ever seen one video of it. Maybe that’s what it is. If you find out, be sure to post up!

3250

I saw that “The Ultimate Championship” graphic in the original ROM the other day. I’m guessing it was intended to be the subtitle for SSF2T (replacing SSF2X’s “Grand Master Challenge”). I think I remember reading that one of the console ports of SSF2T used that subtitle.

Desk, do you happen to know where that video is? I’ve seen a few vids of screwed up ST play, but I could tell they were done with emulator cheats (basically RAM hacking), so they weren’t actual hacked ROMs.

Personally, I’d love to do some ST ROM hacking, but I don’t have the technical knowledge necessary to go about it.

3251

http://super-movies.com/mv/sks-reinbo-.htm

the description of the vid reads

'???'
ST rainbow alpha (remade street fighter 2)

So do you think this is a proper board or just emu cheats?

3252

Looks like emulator cheats to me.

Ryu’s sped-up animation is due to a chet called “Action Speed Up”, which basically makes it so one frame of character animation = one frame of game time. The way SF2’s animation is set up, whenever a new frame of animation for a character starts up, a timer value is set for that character. This timer always counts down by one each frame of game time, and when the timer reaches zero, the character goes to their next frame. This cheat freezes that value at 1, so every frame of animation only gets displayed for one frame of game time, leading to insanely broken links and such.

Midair Hadouken can easily be done by the “Air Moves” cheat. Characters have a boolean value that determines whether or not they are allowed to do special moves. It’s normally deactivated when they are in midair, but this cheat freezes it and allows you to do ground specials in midair (but will prevent you from doing air specials). Since the Hadouken’s supposed to be a ground move, the game gets a little confused right as it ends, and will let you jump, even if you’re in midair, hence the “skywalking”. This value also seems to determine how a character reacts when hit. Since it makes Ryu think he’s on the ground, he’ll go into a standard ground hitstun if hit in the air. But then the game realizes he’s off the ground, so it makes him drop straight down. That’s what lets Zangief “juggle” him at the end of round 1.

Cancel j.HK into Hadouken… is j.HK normally cancellable? I can’t remember. But anyway, if it isn’t, there’s an “All Cancel” cheat that lets you cancel any normal into any special at any point in its animation, regardless of whether it hits or not (kinda like Alpha 3 VCs, actually).

Thos echeats are all player-relative, so it’s easy to make P1 do wacky stuff while making P2 play normally, like in that video (did Zangief do anything odd? I didn’t notice anything, anyway). If this were an actual Rainbow Edition-esque ROM hack, you’d think they’d give screwy abilities to all of the characters.

Anyway, remember that Obj Test I mentioned in this thread a while ago? Got it to run in HF thanks to dipswitch data on T. Akiba’s page. Still no clue on how to get to it in ST, though, if it’s even possible. :confused:

3253

ahh, nevermind. It had been a while since I’d seen that vdeo and I always assumed it was a messed up version.

That test menu is awesome. Does it show hit boxes for things other than attacks? getting hit animations, jumping etc?

3254

Not exactly gameplay related, but I found this kinda weird

http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/5114/asfagfqke6.jpg

3255

i heard that gief’s spd doesn’t require exact 360 input. if so what’s the minimum joystick rotation i can do to get the spd out?