1 Button throws cause just as many but totally different problems. Really the bigger issue with the LP+LK throw is that a blocked or whiffed light attack is MUCH lower risk than a blocked or whiffed heavy attack or even a whiffed throw itself. (A throw is 24F total while most lights are 12-16F total)
1 Button throws cause other issues. When there is a 1 button throw you usually don’t have a throw whiff animation because the normal attack will override the throw every time resulting in an automatic throw OS normal attack like in Marvel 3. Imagine if Sakura had throw OS closeHP.
I’d like to think this time around that online play is a core part of the engine design and as such is improved upon. Lots of lessons have been learned from Capcom’s foray into SFIV, SFxT and also HDR and the 3S revisit (both of which utilised GGPO’s rollback functionality).
I feel that despite its occasional issues, SFIV plays quite well online with all things considered on the onus both players have sound connections, and that is a system that does not invoke any form of rollback. A clean development canvass with a serious acknowledgement that the bulk of people’s time with the game will be online based has the potential to be an improvement over what we have currently. Or at least, one can only hope.
I’m cautiously optimistic about this game and I’m pretty eager to see some extended gameplay so we can better scope out the art direction, the animation and get a sense of the movement and character interactions (normal and special impacts, etc). It’s still very early though - recall that SFIV underwent some subtle but major changes in both the gameplay and visuals from the initial play-test footage that came out back in the day. Out of the gate I’m loving the extra detail this new game clearly offers and so far I like their take on how Ryu and Chun Li look.
I’m curious to see what number they cap the cast at. Ultra is truly massive and unless they plan to replicate the characters currently on offer or present a cast of a similar size, I expect a few people might be disappointed if preferred characters don’t make the cut. Hell, perhaps that is inevitable.
Interesting arrangement they have for what appears to be a timed exclusive. I’m wondering what effect this has on SF’s (predominately Japan) arcade tradition and also if Sony’s involvement has any expertise spill-over into the development process. There is a lot of potential for this release to be really special provided Capcom handle things well.
my problem with throws in IV doesn’t even have anything to do with any of that that you mention. my problem with it is that in this game its too good.
meaning its spammable as hell. Especially with the fact it will activate if the opponent does a normal move and the throw’s hitbox catches the normal’s hurtbox and overrides it and punishes it.
like for example you’ll see crazy shit like someone using lets say Juri doing a footsie sweep and her sweeping foot will be right where M. Bison’s front foot will be and if the M.Bison player hits throw it catches Juri in a throw.
So a basic throw literally can transform itself into a command grab. Or something akin to a command grab just due to the throw activating even though there is an insane amount of distance between the 2 players.
for example.
for example.
So…shit like that cant happen in a 1 button throw scheme since a normal will come out instead of a throw if 2 characters are standing that far apart and someone attempts a throw.
I don’t know exactly why, but I’ve noticed in SF4 people attempt throws way way waaaaaaaay too often.
if you watch matches between players in a game where 1 button throws are implemented, whether its KOF, or SF2, or CvSNK2…you’ll notice there are vastly fewer throw attempts made.
mmmm. maybe 2 or 3 attempts per round. Max. and that 2-3 attempts counting both players and not just throw attempts from one side.
For whatever the reason/s may be, in IV, that number is like 10+ per round.
admit it. everyone admit it. people attempt throws like crazy in SF4.
Probably because it works so damn well. Too well. add on kara throws and it becomes a throwfestival.
there’s 2 button throws in SF alpha but you cant grab people out of their normal footsie moves so at least in that game throws aren’t that great.
in Alpha you still have to be 1 button throw nose to nose close to achieve a throw.
This is why it doesn’t make players psychologically gravitate to hitting the throw button as often as they do in SF4.
my point is is that when you make the throw so good, that good like in IV, it diminishes the footsie spacing game.
if you try to spam throw from a “not nose to nose distance” in alpha like you can in IV you’ll whiff that throw 100% of the time plus eat a normal or something far worse on its recovery.
to summarize, diminishing the basic throw improves the footsie spacing metagame.
and yeah, I know…a 1 button throw isn’t really necessary since Alpha proves you can have a 2 button throw with a 1 button scheme to its workings…but I don’t think its really necessary to have 2 buttons to do what 1 button can do. forward plus hp or hk works fine. how people complain about “tired of throw not coming out and instead a normal in a 1 button throw scheme” makes me wonder how bad their execution can be to fail achieving a throw when all you have to do is push forward and hit a meaty while being close enough to your opponent. its not that hard to execute. but…people did complain. and so we got 2 button throws in Alpha. then things got out of hand in IV with it activating on normal footsie hurtboxes plus kara mechanics.
And another thing.
for the love of God and all that’s good and holy…remove the point system from ranked. remove those numbers entirely.
it causes people to obsess over their numbers, and leads to unsportsmanlike conduct. specifically lag switching and rage quitting all in the name of useless worthless points.
players can gain lettered rank but keep the actual numbers invisible to people. no bp or pp.
do that and they’ll be a lot less cheaters online. or crazy folks acting crazy. cuz bp/pp gets people crazy. really really crazy. like real crazy for them points. (-_-)’
1000% agree on this.
if they were going to do that ink style…again(-_-) they shouldn’t have half assed it like in IV and gone full fledged into a Okami/Sumi brush painted art styled look.
woulda looked gorgeous like Okami. But as usual with modern day Capcom…disappointment.
I don’t know about you guys, but I’d REALLY prefer a ground based footsies game, not a crazy air combo game, with ground bounces, air resets and stuff like that… What your opinions about it?
I am so Hype, I can barely believe this is real. I will likely own 4-6 versions of this game (I think I am up to 6 copies of sf4 at this point) . I am so ready for the next version of my favorite high stakes fisticuffs chess match. 4 is what made me get into the last console generation and now if you will excuse me I need to head over to tech talk and look into what a PS4 stick will entail… SO HYPE!
The complaint you have about grabbing peoples limbs in SF4 is not based on reality. There is a special “throw” hurtbox that in 99% of cases is the same size and position as a characters pushbox (a couple of small instances it is slightly larger than the pushbox or slightly smaller but it never actually changes size and almost always follows the characters pushbox position). It’s not possible to grab feet/legs/ect.
See the solid blue box from M. Bison? That is his throw Hitbox. See the blue outlined box on Juri and M. Bison’s waists? The solid blue hitbox has to touch the blue outlined box for a throw to connect. You wont get a throw just from touching the green outlined box which is the hurtbox used for strikes/projectiles.
The reason people attempt throws in SF4 so much is that there isn’t very many other ways to open up a blocking opponent in SF4 since the majority of characters don’t have any sort of high low game or a left right mixup outside of a knockdown or a dive kick or command throw. The other reason is that throws result in a hard knockdown situation allowing players to setup Oki that can allow to to try and circumvent the high number of defensive tools in SF4 such as DPs without standing, fast and invincible backdashes, DP FADC, focus attack, 4button teching, and potentially mix the opponent up to land more damage since many characters have difficulty landing big damage during footsies and often require the opponent to leave themselves very open for punish due to a mistake OR land a jump in / mixup.
Someone who claimed to have inside info made a post over at Jeuxvideo, stating that the roster will consist of 16 characters (4 brand new). 3 of the new characters are called:
After rewatching the teaser, I think they are hinting at Guile in the future. He appears multiple times, and is very prominent on the screen. They could also be hinting at Ken too if that sketch was actually for SF5.
I’m skeptical this info is reliable, but if they do have their roster figured out already, could that mean they’re much closer to release than most people were assuming? Like maybe November 2015?
I like the new look of Ryu and Chun Li’s character models, they’re night and day compared to that of SF4 and they and the background stage look more detailed and vibrant and the lighting is much better too.
I like the direction Capcom is going in, whatever vision they have in mind for this installment of the franchise the power of the PS4 will allow them to do that…judging from the short teaser vid it’s a great start…IMO.
1)I’m not familiar with Bison…so i’ll ask if that is Bison’s maximum distance regarding throwing? or can he expand it with kara or some other way.
2)http://i.imgur.com/sbgR0qU.jpg you’re not taking into consideration that we’re looking at 1 frame in the pic. You know Juri’s punishable boxes expand(get wider) when she’s in certain crouching animations opposed to when she’s standing which is much narrower and you have to consider all their boxes and how they expand/contract throughout start up/active/and recovery frames for both those two moves.
3)
nah. there is way way less high/low games in SF2 and people don’t throw in that game as much as they do in IV. KoF I can give you the high low game notions but not SF2, CVS2, and many other 1 button throw fighters have an even less highlow game than IV.
btw Eternal I’m not arguing with you, I personally love the shit outta you due to your constant contributions due to the fact your are SRK’s walking talking encyclopedia of knowledge …I’m just saying throws in IV were too good, which you know to be true, and needs to have all its properties trimmed back in 5 to improve the footsie game and get people to stop psychologically gravitating towards trying to throw every chance they get.
like I said, watch 20 random matches of SF2, CVS2, KOF2, any 1 button throw fighter etc etc…count how many throw attempts are made.
then count how many throw attempts in 20 random SF4 matches.
No way those numbers will be close.
and its not IV’s “lack” of high low either that’s causing people to attempt all those throws either. I, imo, think its the tremendous distance you can grab people…how you don’t haveta be nose to nose close to do it.
…I’m just saying throws in IV were too good, which you know to be true, and needs to have all its properties trimmed back in 5 to improve the footsie game and get people to stop psychologically gravitating towards trying to throw every chance they get.