nah man, rewatch it. look at how many times daigo lands c.mk xx fireball. like half his damage came from connecting that from footsies and he sat on his lead. he used random dp to get justin off him. i mean, when you play abel, you gotta have good footsies to even stand a chance, so of course justin will land most his damage from footsies, how else is he gonna get damage in? but i think daigo definitely had the upper hand the entire time justin played abel. like most abel damage came from shenanigan command throw or outpoking. but that was very minimal. daigo never gave him much of a shot to do that stuff. justin was waiting for ultra through fireball, and daigo got hit by it. but i would say justin could barely hit daigo.
heh i saw it live yo, tried watching the stream on youtube. Ugh fuck that :xeye:
What im saying is abel is a way worse character than ryu(at that extreme level of skill, its almost impossible to beat daigo with a character who has a losing matchup). When watching the match live you could feel that justin was holding his own in the footsies, he just doesnt do near as much damage as ryu does off a random poke. either way it was some of the best(nah it was the best) four iv ever seen. cant blame wong for switching characters tho, you advocated learning counter characters before im pretty sure. Oh and were should i look for top 8 videos without bad lag?
Wes- argh, the people turning down bets with me were duuuuumb. i lost some grip lol.
oh and lol at daigo getting mobbed for autographs and shit after the tourny. i was hoping he would slip out without signing so i could sell my shirt on ebay :P.(allen, i got it signed for you in case you wanted to buy it lol)
there’s no vids out with no lag.
but hells yeah i advocate counter-picking, lol. hahaha, i still do. i don’t play matchups i don’t like, remember? lol
and i ain’t buying a t-shirt signed by a videogamer, LOL…::takes you to side when no one is looking:: hey man, how much?
Until they get the videos up on IGN, I don’t there’ll be anything good unless somebody was in the crowd with a camera. All the videos I’ve seen are copies of the stream, and it was super laggy when it was live streaming. (Not that I’m complaining. I love that I was able to experience much of Evo as it happened.)
A good player will take the easiest way to win every time. If a moron keeps jumping at you, should you just stop shoryuing him? No. And how can you say that character matchups don’t matter? Justin already knew he couldn’t beat Daigo with Rufus from the Gamestop exhibition. Character matchups matter. That’s the whole point of picking up a secondary. In casuals, playing a bad matchup can be good experience in case you get stuck in that matchup when it matters. In a tournament, you pick whatever character will help you win, period. The only time you shouldn’t counterpick is when you don’t know the character you’re counterpicking with well enough to maintain that advantage. For example, Ed Ma counterpicking Zangief versus Wong’s Rufus proves that you can’t win SF4 with just a character matchup spreadsheet.
It doesn’t even matter if the matchup of Rufus vs Ryu is unfair or not. To Wong, he thought it was, so he did what any competitor would do - he picked a different character that had the tools he needed to win. And he was a better player for doing that, instead of trying something he already knew wasn’t going to work. You can criticize his character choice (or even if there was going to be any advantage to switching), you can try to criticize him for not using a character he was prepared with (but not on any sane level. His Boxer was tight.), but I don’t see how you can criticize someone for trying to do what’s necessary to win. It’s in the tournament rules for a reason.
Counterpicking is good for a tournament. It makes it so that no one character can dominate unless they have no bad matchups (lol Sagat and Ryu). It keeps matches closer by giving the loser a better chance to bounce back. It gives you the freedom to pick a character that has a bad matchup or two without having to worry about getting peaced out due to bad luck. And it rewards you for learning more than one character. At the end of the day, player skill is king, but knowing how to pick your fights is part of that skill.
I dunno mr. K, i just can’t agree with that. I hate to bring up “Glorius Nippon,” again and again but the those guys don’t really counter-pick, at least not in SF4. sure they all play different characters everyday at the arcade, but during the tournaments, they are all going for just one character, and it can work for them. Tetsu just recently won a TRF tournament using fuerte, and the week after that, TDK won it playing fuerte. these guys always went for that character, even though he definitely wasn’t the best.
I’m not saying counter-picking is total bullshit, it’s just that diago and japan has proved that you can do just as well sticking with one guy. You just have to work harder, as this finals match definitely proved.
And I don’t understand why people in general(this isn’t directed to anyone specifically in this thread) are trying to argue justin is a better player than diago in SF4. It’s not rocket science, Justin lost to diago, therefore diago is a better player. Yes Justins a great player. But he hasn’t beaten diago in tourney-level sf4. Saying, “oh if justin picked this or that and did this earlier or whatever,” just throwing hypotheticals, doesn’t accomplish anything.
Why don’t I just argue that if Al Gore was president our economy would be dandy and spetember 11th would have never happened. It just as silly. Justin is a top player, he had his reasons for doing what he did and didn’t do and it didn’t work for him. He got as close as humanely possible, but he lost.
and he played two characters, to diago’s one Ryu. Sure, It was hard for diago, but he beat justin at the end. So Mr. K, Seeing that Diago didn’t have to counter-pick at all, and he still won, well I hope you understand why i can’t agree with you 100%.
don’t confuse me saying that justin’s footsie is better as saying he is better 
but yo, i like justin > daigo next time. you gotta be there :D, you could feel the hype. Its tangible!
just be glad it isnt ST, lol how that game is so godlike i dunno. the whole tourny was just counter pick, lol valle even counter picked jay. everytime i heard watson talk it was telling someone, “oh just pick so and so and its fray”. lol fuck st, choi even lost me money cuz he got thrown by jab jab throw like 4 times in a row by boxer. i just dont get it.
lol, yeah ST is counter-pick city(and don’t you EVER talk ill about ST, my friend, NEVER!! I’ll let virtua fighter slide but i will defend the gloriousness that is ST), but hey, SF4 looks like it doesn’t need it as much.
you know i kinda would rather see Arturo vs daigo. I dunno something about Jwong rubs me the wrong way. I don’t mind his antics or whatever, trash talking rules, thats the american way.
Welp, maybe it that Marn’s always around him? I swear, i never met the guy but every time i see footage of him talking or anything, I wanna fucking put his lights out in real life, to hell with in a fighting game. His face just screams “PLEASE DEFLATE MY FAT OILY DOUCHY FACE WITH YOUR FIST, mr. Ramen!!!”
I’d put money on Marn in that fight Ramen, sorry.
edit; By the way, I am ON for SB4, les go.
In a real life fist fight between me and marn you would put money on Marn, huh? alright dude, thanks for the free money 
lol i would pay both sides just to see the hillarity. marn was cool when i met him, just kinda eh i dunno, silly/immature? stonded marn on the other hand was just 1000 lol’s back to back.
marn=andy milonakis to me.
anyway, I want to go to seasons beatings but i have no idea how ima get there. And IF i can go to school full-time hopefully i wont have a test or something.
cannot unsee. hahahahaah
…yeah pretty much this, i’ll start traveling… but i’ve got no car or license. 
http://www.youtube.com/user/iplaywinner
They’re starting to put up a few matches from the semis that were captured on a camera from the crowd. No idea if they’ll put up top8. Hopefully the IGN Insider stuff will go up soon. I wants!
Hey guys, my name is Patrik. I’m new to shoryuken forums, didn’t hear about it until Evo, but I have been playing street fighter for a long time, since ST. I currently play Street Fighter 4. I play a lot online but I want to play some better people because I just straight up pwn people online. I’m looking for a challenge, maybe one of you guys can give it to me? I’m looking for GOOD players, I don’t want to play random noobs, I can get those online, if anyone can give me a good fight, I’m down to play. I’m not expecting much but hopefully someone can beat me.
:lovin: didn’t have to bet against team america to get it, either!
as far as evo, good to see STL rolling in force and doing reasonably well
but where are the SUPER BROS at!??
wow, that’s one hell of a way to introduce yourself.
this kid thinks he’s good when he just found the forums. hahaha.
note to self: prepare shields for butthurt after he faces… well, anyone!
there’s a few good players in stl, i’m sure you’ll find someone to ummm, give you a challenge.
I’m not saying I’m the best or anything, but i’m pretty sure I’m better than you are…kid. I’m pretty sure I’m older than you are.
All I’m saying is I’m looking for a challenge, I haven’t found one yet. Damn kid, listen to what I’m tryin to say.
You’re being condescending to someone you’ve never met or played.
Incredible!
You’re in the right place for a challenge. Everyone in STL is hungry.
Acting like you’re going to sleep on the whole area makes you sound like a fucking joke.