so who won the FFA eventually? Last I saw in the replay all three remaining players were sorta even.
With the one bunker contain, mass reaper tvz strat, i’m done with sc2 until they patch this bs. I really don’t feel like working 5x as hard as the other player just to be even, or even slightly behind.
Enguhl (one of my friends he doesn’t post on SRK)
Here’s the replay for tonight’s FFA game. It ended up coming down to me and Enguhl, who won after I mined out my expansion.
The randomness of this match was crazy, definitely need to do it again.
It would be dope if we could pull off a bigger game. But yeah, gg’s all.
I want to try playing BW, but I heard it doesn’t run on Windows 7. Is that true?
Man I was planning on expanding to noun’s starting base after he got taken out rather quickly but the creep didnt go away! Then later i figured he had a bunch of tumors lying around in his base… so fail me.
I had an extra CC flying around doing nothing for a while cuz of that =/
Thanks for the advice guys… Here’s another replay:
Jungle Basin - HansSolo vs. Catchafire - Replays - SC2Replayed.com
Here, he went mass reapers and there was simply nothing I could do. What unit counters reapers for zerg? The problem I hate against Terran is that they have so many options. Again, I am by no means a decent player, but I shouldn’t have to work THIS hard to beat my friend who can’t even win his bonze league games…
Here’s another, where I am Terran and he’s Terran… ( I win this one ) Desert Oasis - HansSolo vs. Catchafire - Replays - SC2Replayed.com
Im not a Zerg player(or a great player at all) but heres my 2 cents. First when your drone first got in his base you saw that he got both gases fairly early. That should have tipped you toward either a reaper harass or a heavy marauder push. At this point I think you had two choices. Tech as fast as possible to mutas or go for a baneling bust on his wall. Personally I would try for a baneling bust since youll at least kill his two depots which will supply block him most likely, plus they have to spend resources to rebuild it if your lings arnt up in his base tearing shit up. Going mutas would leave him unchecked for a while as well as since reapers and marauders are better at killing buildings you would have to play more defensive.
Your choice to go Roaches I think was a bad choice. If they went marauders they would have kited you all day. If they went reapers they would out manuever you, unless you had enough numbers to cover all your flanks. If they were going mass marine then it would have been a good choice i guess but you didnt know anything about his build which brings me to the 2nd point.
After your initial drone got into his base, T walled off the entrance so that drone was good as dead. You might as well have kept scouting with it instead of trying to hide him into a corner and hoping he doesnt get found. You could have at least saw the 2nd barracks go down which would slow down a cloak banshee rush if he was planning on it. After that drone is dead though Zerg have no safe way of getting into a walled off terran base, so your trying to counter something in the dark. I personally would have saced an overlord into his base to see what he was up to. Yeah its certainly not very attractive choice like a scan or an observer but hey you gotta work with what you have.
thats all i can think of right now.
watch as Irennicus will come and tell me im all wrong >_>
You should’ve expanded a bit earlier like around the 5 min mark since he wasn’t going to push, wouldve gave you an economic advantage. If you wanted to be safe you could make 1-2 spine crawlers.
You also did not scout enough. After your initial scouting you just sat there and started building not knowing what he had. Your Overlord on the top left corner was just chilling there, if you brought it in his base you wouldve saw his mass reapers.
Xel’Naga towers are great, use them. Before he sent his army of Reapers to your base you also had your guys standing near the right Xel’Naga but you didnt use it. If you did you couldve spotted his Reapers early and then pull back to defend your base. Its good to have some Zerglings on them towers.
After your Lair tech, you shouldve made a Spire. I believe those Mutas wouldve been game changing since he was devoted to those Reapers. You also couldve teched a bit earlier seeing that you were crawling with so much gas early on. Hold back on the Roaches and make some more lings and 1-2 spine crawlers.
As for counters against Reapers, Speedlings and Spine Crawlers are your best option early game. Roaches are both good and bad. Theyre really good at bringing down Reapers but their mobility isnt too great. The Reapers would just outrun them.
Thx. No comments on my TvT play? I wonder if allowing speedlings to cliff jump would help to balance the game early against terrans.
No way, man. That’d be way too OP.
Yeah okay…
is burrow use now? I see no top zerg players using it…?
Absolutely not. Like it’s been said, way op.
I’ll have to get into the next FFA, shit looked fun.
Will zerg get cliff harass unit or a cloaked attack unit? Speedlings cliffing would be awesome. They have the wings for it…
Hey I have an idea, lets just give all the races exactly the same thing the other races have just with a different skin!
Sorry only gonna watch the ZvT because I haven’t been laddering enough recently but my two cents…
A) Seriously, stop doing the extractor trick. Build an overlord at 9 supply, don’t do the extractor trick. I know it looks cool and flashy but is only AS fast as 9 overlord if you manage it PERFECTLY. i.e. getting that drone on the gas right at 75 minerals so you can immediately turn it into extractor and start building drone and cancel within 1/10 of a second in a narrow time frame. There’s no reason to make sure you’re doing the extractor trick right when simply building an overlord at 9 supply will do the same thing with considerably less effort.
B) Pay more attention to your buildings and your resources. Since you built your extractor at 14 if you had done it asap and gotten drones mining it asap while putting down pool asap at 14 supply you can research ling speed as soon as the pool is constructed. It’s also a good idea to take your drones off of gas if you spend the 100/100 that early and put them back on minerals. Building another overlord at 15 supply, getting a queen when you can, and a few lings to run around the map. You should continue to pump drones until 22-23 supply and then expand. Once you’ve thrown down the hatchery you can then put your drones back on gas. By this point your lings should’ve scouted enough information to tell you what you should be comfortably aiming for. You didn’t see reapers until they were butt fucking you.
C) If you had gotten the early expansion you could’ve teched to lair, gotten overlord speed, and seen everything going on in his base. That’s not an unreasonable thing to have by 6 minutes into the game and it would’ve straight up shown you everything you needed to know. At that point your expansion + main fully mining if you keep making workers could’ve been used for 2 things. A) Keep making speedlings, and B) get those mutalisks out. Speedling/muta would’ve straight up owned his entire composition, roaches were a weird choice because while they’re great against reapers they’re horrible vs marauders and other armored units which is what I tend to expect from T players these days.
Um…some other small things. Don’t just get gas to get gas if you don’e have decent mineral saturation as Z. We need gas but if you really think about it we’re going to spend shit tons of minerals guaranteed on pumping lings & drones creating for a heavier min drain than most other races get. Often times P players will stop getting zealots for stalkers/sentries, terrans will get more marauders/mech/etc. I noticed you got two gas while you only had something like 13 guys on minerals and the only gas you were going to be spending was on roach. If you think about it mining 13/6 for a unit that costs 75/25 is a bad idea. Try to match the ratios of harvesting for what you intend to be spending on.
If he had gone 1/1/1 build to banshee harass your game would’ve been over in no time flat and he gave you no real reason to suspect anything at all. The most you saw in his base was some marines the whole time. That could’ve easily been a lot worse…lair tech is great for overlord speed and it really is an invaluable tool against the terran wall. In a map like that your overlords start way too far away to be reliable for scouting at their starting speed and not to mention savvy terran players will try to snipe them.
Also…the build your opponent was trying for would’ve been even worse had he realized to start with reapers, rather than marines. The really ugly time with reapers is when 5-8 of them show up in your base 6 minutes into the game. With creep expansion, speedlings, and speed roaches, plus overlord spreading, you should see what’s coming and be able to respond appropriately. Just look at your mini map more often and take more effort into putting your overlords into good positions as far as vision is concerned.
No offense but since you just found out that you’ve been basically playing zerg ALL WRONG this whole time, you’re pretty much the last person who should say ZvT is imbalanced or that zerg needs this and zerg needs that. I mean yeah from my experience zerg definitely needs something but currently in your position, you have nothing to complain about except for your lack of understanding how the game is played. Right now you’re the equivalent of a chess player who doesn’t know what each piece does and yet you’re saying that white vs black is imbalanced.
Dude, I really did respond to your point about cloaked attack units already. We don’t need it seeing as how EVERY single ground unit we have can burrow. It’s way more flexible than only having two units that get to attack while cloaked. Think about what comes along with cloaking units… Dark Templars? Glass cannons. Ghosts? Glass cannons. Banshees? Glass cannons. Observers? I think they have less health than a worker. Hell even that demonstrats that (unless you count the mothership) the Protoss really only has one cloaked attacking unit.
And as far as cliff jumping is concerned again you’ve got units that are just glass cannons doing it. Reapers die fast when they finally manage to get shot/stabbed, and Colossi certainly don’t have much in the way of life considering how much they cost. I guess Stalkers would be the exception to this but by the time they have blink researched and reliable ways to use this offensively (i.e. have an observer giving them vision) you could’ve teched to all kinds of nasty things that would own them anyways. Hydras do NOT care about blink Stalkers, they can do that micro all day long and just die a little slower if they really want.
The only thing about cliff jumping that you might get me to agree on is that it can be a little too abusable on certain maps. (Blistering Sands, Lost Temple, Kulas Ravine)
Fightning Terran is the easiest for me. Muta up early and harras. They do well against banches as well
I love burrow