yeah, when you’re mid screen it feels like guile throw/frame trap pressure ends after one attempt. if someone blocks a frame trap fierce, that’s the end of it. like you said, it’s not like ryu, where you can fish for 5-6 crouch strongs after a single jump in.
Gamerbee, Mago and Tokido were in melbourne to visit Australia and the players here…I learned quickly that we are well below the level of the Americans and Japs mainly due to our relatively small player base and at times lack of knowledge of various elements of the game. These three guys when seeing them play in person made us look like amatuers with their amazing skill level. I even Had 3 sets with Mago’s Fei-long and although I was competitive for the most part, it is clear that he is far too sharp.
For example, When I FADC a flashkick and backdashed, Mago was so quick to to imput the rekka combo that I got Caught while backdashing. That is how sharp the Japs and the high level players are.
But other than that, he is a great person and very polite and so was tokido and Gamerbee… Tokido showed me and the others today why he is regarded as the worlds best akuma player, reinforced at how easily he dissected Justin Wong recently
Overall, the point I’m making is that the Australian scene is not as strong as the rest of the world and we definitely need to catch up to them.
This is what I heard from my friend who went to Australia and played SF4 there this year.
He told me the Australian players were generally more setups-based and execute their moves safer and for a reason. E.g no SRK without meter if it’s not a confirmed hit. They seldom do risky stuff and so when they get hit by this kind of risky SRK, they don’t really know how to handle/adapt to the opponent quickly. I don’t know how true is that but he told me that they were good players which is just slightly behind the Americans.
I’ve seen their vids and I don’t think Australians are bad at all.
I think Australians are really good players.
There are handful of really good players. Humanbomb (ryu), HeavyWeapons (Sagat), Sol (Abel, Dictator and Cammy) and Toxy (Akuma) are four of our best along with Naruga. I’m good mates with them and their knowledge of the game is quite good and yet we still need to learn the other aspects. Gamerbee slapped Bomb silly in the top 8 finals, it was a bloodbath, but it shows that Adon may have been grossly underestimated even though I thought he was tough matchup. In SFZ2, Adon was a nightmare for me.
The Americans I admit are still a level above us, that is just a fact. If only we had a chance to play with some of the American players, then that will be extremely valuable.
By my own admission, even Alex Valle is better than Humanbomb and Bomb is considered the #1 player in Australia. I have beaten Humanbomb a handful of times but only when I play a solid match and keep Ryu out. Whenever I make i small error, I get killed by him
Lets see if I can make this thread come back to life.
Guile has great normals. Every since super came out, the use of df+hk has been a good normal that I have been trying to incorporate due to his unique hitbox and juggle potential.
What do you guys think about standig close hk. It is guiles most damaging normal and I would like to know and list the ways you guys are using if or if you just dont use it ever. For what I know,
-It does really good damage and it has AA properties but it is really hard to pull off as AA.
-It does not combo into anything that I know
-It can be used right after sb FADC (waste of meter tho)
-It combos off a j.lk and I think it is safe on block(need more testing or maybe the enemy doesnt know wtf to do after i do it)
-Sometimes, I use it after a cross up, (cant tell if it is good or not against OS-tech, might be that the lag is helping me stuff thier techs)
-Great way to end up a match if the opponent is stuned
I’m addicted to the s.hk (close) and can vouch for its use as AA. A common set up I use is bulldogging Ryu (and his ilk) into an ambiguous cross-up during footsies - works a treat. Works wonders against all the high-jumping floaty characters (it’s awesome vs. Chun) and Honda’s butt-splash. I’ve yet to give it full testing in the lab, but against Guy’s elbow, it should be a winner. It’s also worth remembering for people who try vertical/neutral jumps on wake-up against you - the hit box is like a fucking umbrella of pain.
Other than that, the rest of your points cover everything else (except the damage on sb FADC s.hk makes it pretty compelling (and it hits crouching (which might explain the crouch-tech beatery))).
Also, s.mk (close) is worth looking at for another situational AA normal.
I like to use this move on Abels who don’t like to EX TT after their roll. Can follow up with s.hp on counterhit dealing lots of dmg and the active frames are there.
I’ve managed to land df.hk twice with the opponent which is not in the corner a some time back. I can’t remember how I did it but it’s possible.
I think (switching gears) the main benefit of close s.mk is that I normally land it due to an auto-adjustment of far s.mk. A great example is if a shoto jumps at you and you try to s.mk his j.hk, but instead he tries to tatsu, your far s.mk will turn into a close s.mk and still work perfectly. That’s probably my main reason for not using s.mp so much… if I wait too long it will turn into close s.mp, which is absolute garbage for just about anything, but expecially garbage for an AA.
Edit: Oh, something I’ve been fooling around with lately is “what characters a UDK frame trap is actually good against.” I was playing against a cody who had probably the best teching ability I’ve seen in a VERY long time. So, I figured he had a big hitbox and was plainly using a normal crouch tech, so time to mess around with UDK. Turns out it works pperfect at tagging him out of his crouch tech. My main setups were to follow a boom > c.lk > UDK > c.mp xx EX boom (no other boom would reach to combo), and knockdown > j.lk > (c.lk) > UDK. It seemed to work a good 80% of the time versus his crouch tech… although it did whiff the other 20% of the time.
They really dropped the ball on that move. The thing already avoided lows fine in Vanilla and Super… it didn’t need to be buffed to avoid lows better! It needed either airborne properties, a lower hitbox, or both. This whole “whiff over crouch techs” thing is absolute trash, but I still think it has great potential against characters who rely on crouch techs, but still have big hitboxes. Anyone been fiddling with it lately?
In regards to above:
If you whiff forward mk in front of your opponent, what do they usually try to punish you with?
Ya, doing UDK > c.lp > c.mp xx flashkick is highly impractical when using UDK like this. I think many characters c.lk’s cause their primary hitbox to move back a bit, meaning that when UDK lands to counter a crouch tech, they will be pushed away further than you’d expect. C.mp alone seems to be very close to whiffing against many characters.
Whiffed f.mk’s normally confuse a lot of people. It’s rare you’ll see it truly punished since they expected some kind of stimuli other than “everyone whiffs” when they did their low attack. I think I might try messing with that more too, come to think of it. Something like j.lk > c.lk > f.mk… um… guile pressure (?). I think it’s +1 on hit right? So that would be +3 on counter-hit, meaning that a close s.lp would connect if your close enough but… practical? Doubtful. And it still whiffs over lows.
You’re too close and you’re risking getting thrown, imo. Try j.lk, cr.lk, cr.lk, fwd mk. At least you’ll be spaced out far enough to where you either whiff or hit with the tip of Guile’s boot. Perhaps you can land a CH b+hp and score another b+hp for 270 dmg.
I use f.mk very often and it cannot combo into s.hp on counterhit. Whiffing f.mk then s.hp straightaway normally catches people trying to punish the whiffed f.mk. Most people try to punish it with c.hk/c.mk.
Whiffing f.mk or even if opponent blocks it can usually surprise them by following up with a jump-in. Not recommended for those with SRKs though.
You’re right. CH fwd mk > st.hp doesn’t combo at all. I did whiff fwd mk enough to notice that Ryu’s try to punish with cr.mp/cr.mk. They usually end up getting CH’ed by Guile’s st.hp. So I get st.hpx2 pretty easily from there. Seems like a pretty good frametrap. Warahk mentioned earlier that CH close st.hp > U2 combos. Is it possible to get fwd mk close enough to where you can confirm a CH close st.hp > U2?
I think it’s impossible to combo U2 from cs.hp counterhit now cos U2 is a lot slower now.
I get better results using f.mk at its tip making it hit at the last few frames and I think this gives more frame advantage. I think it’s dangerous to use it quite close to the opponent.
Not to mention the f.mk would break your charge. I don’t think you would have enough time to charge. Even if you did though, like Rexell said, there’s no way in hell it would work in AE. That thing has to have at LEAST 11 frame startup I think. Hm… I haven’t tried to combo it off of lp boom since AE hit. I don’t think that will work anymore.
I need to actually look at the frame data again, but like I was saying, I think that if your point blank and you score a CH with f.mk, I think your at +3… which means you should be able to close s.lp > s.hp. Would be a pretty sweet frame trap to catch crouch techs if it worked.
A girL got 3rd plAce at. A tourney tOday. With Guile.
So. Anybody complaining bout guiles stuff can just stuff it.
that’s awesome! never met a female guile player.
Lately I’ve been finding myself throwing more and more fwd mk’s (whiffed and at the tip of the boot) in my matches to see what kind of reactions I’d get. Maybe it’s just me but that move alone used once or twice at the beginning of the match tells me what kind of opponent I’m facing. Reversal happy/button tapper/patient player. Here’s what I’ve been landing:
I’ve been able to score a CH cr.mp and throw out a linked sonic boom. Although the sonic boom won’t combo at times, it did give me an advantage to keep pressuring in. At certain times, I’ve had opponents try to jump over or neutral jump the linked sonic boom which would land me an easy setup for an instant airthrow or an early jump hp to push them back further and get more spacing. It usually results with the opponent gearing up for a reversal or crouch teching at that point.
I played against a Dudley player the other night and threw out a whiffed fwd mk. Off of the whiffed fwd mk, I was able to land a CH cr.mp > far st.hp x 2 which kind of blew me away. I didn’t know Dudley’s hitbox was that big to where you can land st.hp x2 (like Bison’s).