Worked for me at ECT on Counterhit. That’s when Combofiend mentioned that U1 was 6f start up.
I also know that it wasn’t 5f start up because I tried to do the cr.lp > Ultra 1 a good number of times and the training dummy just kept blocking.
EDIT 2: I guess this is just something that we’re going to have to wait for when the game drops.
Juggle is still unconfirmed unfortunately. On a side note, capcom has released final change list hiding some nerfs and buffs before. It happened from vanilla to super apparently, even though I wasn’t playing then.
This is unfortunate. I have played Guile since SF I I:TWW. I stuck with him through vanilla, loved him in Super and continued with him in AE. Why can’t Capcom get him right. It seems he either sucks or is op. I was excited for an update but now, I just don’t know if I care. I was really looking forward to the auto correct of U1. But why even auto correct if it is not a viable anti-air option. I realize some of the new mechanics may help but seriously, wtf is up with U1? I haven’t played as much since they nerfed him in AE, I may play even less now. I feel blase.
So the changelist from japanese to arcade has been translated, and Guile’s ultra 2 juggle is not mentioned, which leads me to believe that like Balrog, his ultra tweak remained. That’s really good news if true.
Also, this might a weird mentality, but I’m actually kind of excited for Guile’s health nerf, but hear me out. Historically capcom has given health nerfs to characters than have generally been pretty high on the tier list. This means they thought Guile was good enough to warrant a health nerf. Obviously this may turn out to be really bad, but in the very least it means Capcom thinks Guile is now really good, which kind of excites me.
I think it come down to the fact that Guile having an ultra breaks his character design - at least in sf4. He keeps you out all day, but once you’re in he’s brown bread (low stun, lack of auto correct, yadda yadda yadda)
Him having an ultra that he can just throw out and get raw comeback damage is counter to this. Which certainly goes to help explain why U1 had and still has such limited invincibility and long start up
For an even clearer example look at ultra 2 in super - you could just throw it out and get raw damage quite easily. Your opponent had to respect it which breaks Guiles design (I don’t agree with this btw) Next update oh look it magically loses an activation frame as well as damage, heavily limiting its overall use beyond a read or 2 bars of meter.
U1’s initial +60 damage buff I think was a genuine albeit knee jerk buff to help compensate the risk reward of the move. Obviously capcom were fine with the way it was working (or not working) so they gave us a bone with some extra damage. That was nice of them.
No changes were made to these ultras in the other versions because as far as Capcom were concerned they were working “as intended”.
Then Ultra edition comes out and they seemingly decided to change U1’s purpose entirely from whatever the hell it was before to whatever the hell it is now.
They also throw us a bone in the form of a 10% damage buff on U2. Capcom, the gift that keeps on giving (!)
Have you guys done flashkick to ultra 2 yet in the new version. It’s gone from 306 to 405 with the increase to damage and juggles. Thats pretty damn good. Also his bnb is a braindead 2 framer now, making it very practical. I’m not saying the old link was hard, but not even having to focus on it now really leaves room to ensure your execution on the fadc ultra 2.
lol, no mention of why they nerfed U1
My only consolation right now is watching the Desk red focus video. If nothing else, at least we get to let it rip more often than before if we get a good read. I’m also a bit scared of mistiming anti air u2 now… Usually the opponent just as to block if you do it too late but now potentially they could land and hit red focus to blow through.
I’m hoping that the Evil Ryu matchup gets better since we will have DWU/no unblockables now. I find that matchup very though and it seems like he’s gonna be a popular character in Ultra.
Accdording to the japanese change list, they didn’t. So it should still be 5 frames.
According to the final change list they did
“-Flash Explosion (UC1) start-up reduced by 1 frame (7F → 6F); damage reduced by 60 (510 → 4500; 2nd Flash Kick start-up now slower, less likely to whiff opponents who float high; invincibility frames reduced by 4 frames (10F → 6F)”
Is there any other info besides that change list?
The japanese arcade change list, it doesn’t mention anything about U1 getting more start-up, so acording to that one, it should still be 5 frames like the current arcade build. Personally I trust that list a lot more, since Combofiend’s list lacked a lot of changes, and got stuff wrong like Gen’s LP Roll being +3. SRK list used that one as a basis and still has U1 as 5f.
I don’t trust the japanese list. This list is a change between arcade 1.0 and arcade 1.1 but it lists guile’s U2 as getting a damage increase from 300 to 330. U2 has always been 330 the whole time. There’s also no mention of the juggle properties.
EDIT: no mention of juggle properties, if this list is true, would make one believe that they kept the juggle buff in. I don’t think they’re going to give U2 the juggle buff. Here’s why…
j.hk > s.hp > super > u2 with juggle buff will do 698 damage
super > u2 with juggle buff will do 614 damage
I don’t think they’re going to give guile that kind of comeback power.
I guess both lists have inconsistensies (it also mentions nothing about the blockstun buff to Vega’s LP and HP RCF). So we’ll just have to wait and see I guess (Also, when it comes to something like those “all hits juggle”-changes, I wouldn’t count on that happening in every situation, only in FADC situations. Or are those combos confirmed to be in the arcade version?).
Ya’ll make sure to check out the USF4 matches from UFGT sunday on leveluplive. Knuckledu(guile) vs. Tampa Bison(rolento). UDK wiffs multiple times against a crouching rolento.
Good shit Capcom!
Delayed wakeup itself will elevate guile from mid-low to mid-high.
I agree with the increased counter hit on boom, it allows guile to be punished harder on unsafe boom while still allowing him the same boom recovery time when using boom in a combo or blockstring. To be honest I wanted them to nerf the boom some more, especially long range booms, the great recovery time on the boom is capcom’s excuse for making the rest of his tools less than what they should be.
Guile had a good footsie game with cr.mk, f.mk, st.hk, and st.hp, it was a shame that none of them can be cancelled into a combo. Guile’s problem was that any chance he takes is only rewarded with a single hit here and there, if UDK is as good as it looks then finally he has a longish poke that can he can use to go into a damaging combo.
The GHK of his will still be garbage, it will probably not hit crouching opponents, it is a bad AA, timing on it very strict to link into it and you can only link into it when the opponent is in the corner. So now you can easily get the 2nd GHK to hit after the first one, but you will never get the first one to hit, so this buff is mostly useless.
Been watch a few gameacho vids and general USF4 japanese arcade stuff. I still see that flash kick trading a lot…flash kick in general seemed a bit weird. Counter hit booms aren’t even in that version either I don’t think. That is going to suck. Is red focus attack going to be a big deal for Guile or not? Saw a lot of Guile’s using Ultra 1 fishing for red focus far more than a lot of the other characters I watched.
Some quick comments on other characters. Rose, Chun Li and Ibuki all look really, really good. T Hawk and Bison definitely looked better. Balrog, Deejay and Honda are about the same as they were, but all the Honda’s I watched are now rocking ultra 2. Poision looked ok. Hugo’s damage seemed really lacking.
It probably means that there’s a universal corner combo using this move now. I remember the normals/booms you had to use before ghk being character specific. Not really a massive buff but i guess its ok. Would be nice if this can be utilised in mid screen combos somehow but I doubt it.
In closer analysis, the df.hk buff might just be amazing… think about it…
Let’s say you get in for a frame trap. You’re up close and do c.lp > delay > s.hp xx boom. Before, you don’t really get much after this midscreen. Now, you may be able to hit confirm it into FADC > df.hk > flashkick. A big problem before was df.hk whiffing on a lot of people, but this might be just what it needs to combo. Since s.hp forces stand too, I could see this as 100% viable and dangerous. We’re talking akuma level damage off of a frame trap heavy normal xx fireball FADC.
Furthermore, this means you should be able to do the same thing on a cornered opponent without even spending any meter.
Wow… this could actually be a HUGE deal… CH UDK > s.hp xx boom xx FADC > df.hk > hk flashkick. Sounds like pain.
The main thing being, is if this is just theory or if df.hk isn’t going to able to do that. I guess we will just have to wait and see, but I’m excited again.
Nobody knows anyone at the tournament that can test the juggle state? I can message a couple people and see if they’ll do it randomly.