Both Ryu and Akuma’s cr.mp have 4 frames of start-up and they are both +2 on block.
Taking away something that is a bit much is one thing, but fucking up a character’s basic design and giving them shitty new moves to boot is something else entirely. You can’t just go around fucking up a character’s footsies. That’s basic fundamentals right there.
Capcom fucked Gouki up. This shit is fucking sad.
It was just a loketest right? So things will change. Here’s to hoping they change for the BETTER.
And this is posted by a sagat player! Capcom really dropped the ball on this one, fucking lazy ass nerf. He drops to high mid tier doing that to his far RH.
Capcom are always talking about how close they got their ear to the ground with fans these days (something i question looking at many of the new ultras or maybe it explains them heh), so maybe if we voice our concerns on the capcom unity boards they MIGHT actually be read? Pretty desperate measure, but should try at least?
You won’t be able to link far.HK off a counter hit if the start up frames stay the same as they are. It’s a 1 framer as it is.
= /
Wow they’re just doing whatever to my boy for SSF4?
It’s not looking good so far, but lol @ some of yall lames jumping ship. At least wait until the game drops. He said this is a 2 month old build. I believe some of Akuma’s stuff will change for the better, including his ultra both use wise and look wise.
lol at the trolling, he had 1 change and only 1 change anyone could find 1 frame slower st. HK … that’s it …
I’d understand if it was like 10 frames and punishable on block now but really 8 frames for a safe combo starting 1/3 screen move that once active eats everything below it into a combo and is even on block please hardly unfair. Now the obvious solution is remove 1 frame on hit from far light punch as +6 and +7 are identical from a tactical perspective only fst. HK can’t combo.
For those saying make it negative your idiots if st. RH was negative on block you’d get eaten by gief akuma mains seem to not know their own tools … -1 you eat ultra -2 you eat free spd. Without even st. RH you lose A LOT in the anti-gief department.
people are always running around “omg ken’s cr. MK sucks Ryu’s is better!!!” people don’t know what they are talking about. Ken has 1 frame faster startup yet Ryu has 1 more active frame … only difference between the two (real reason ryu’s is better is his fireball combo’s so technically his cr. MK is better cuz his fireball is better, semantics but inaccurate all the same).
lol and i’m pretty sure stay crispy is right i play both ryu and akuma and have never noticed a difference.
Edit: Also according to eventhubs (sigh srk wiki is down) ryu and akuma’s cr. MP are identical like stay crispy said.
http://www.eventhubs.com/guides/2008/nov/13/akuma-gouki-frame-data-street-fighter-4/
I realize it’s more-or-less confirmed that Akuma’s RH loop is gone, but there were two ways of removing it, by either adding 1 frame to stHK startup, or by removing a frame of hitstun to far stLP. This was probably said in this thread already, but I just want to make sure everybody knows that the removal of RH loop doesn’t require the stHK to have added startup… Was it confirmed by Capcom that his stHK has an extra frame of start-up, or are people claiming this just because the RH loop no longer works?
I’m not cool with the move having 8 frames of start-up. If it still had 7 frames of start-up, but his far stLP had +6 instead of +7, then the RH loop would still remain broken, and you wouldn’t be stabbing Akuma’s footsies in the side. It doesn’t make sense to make that kind of change. Ryu’s close and far standing LP are both +5 on hit, allowing a 1 frame link into his 5-frame sweep. Akuma’s close stLP is a 1 frame link into his 6-frame sweep, and using his far stLP would make it a 2 frame link, the way it stands. Doesn’t it make more sense to change the hitstun on far stLP from +7 to +6 for a 1 frame link into sweep, so that you mirror Ryu’s toolset, than to take the stRH, a key move for footsies, and nerf it? Removing 1 frame of hitstun to his far stLP gets rid of the RH loop yet really doesn’t damage his footsies at all. If you only wanted to remove the RH loop you should do that and not nerf the stRH itself.
EDIT: I have found all of the SRK wiki frame data pages in cached search engine results, and I’ve saved them to my PC…here they are on my webserver http://kyari.homeftp.net/framedata. None of the links in the pages work, just click the Back button to go back to the main area… this is all from the SRK wiki so it has i frames and stuff on it as well.
Any info on lk. tatsu xx sweep? I hope they have at least kept it the way it is now.
I’ve seen a bunch of people say that far.HK beats focus. It doesn’t. You can focus the first hit and back dash.
Are you sure that St.Hk is one frame slower, or did you just think that because the loop no longer works? It could just be that st.lp has less advantage like people have pointed out.
he needs counter ultra. duh.
In 3 rounds of continual testing against Sagat (the easiest character to loop) I didn’t get a single loop nor did I manage to do cr.LP cr.LP cr.MP xx Fireball FADC far.HK. And I can do that shit all day. Which means it is the HK which has greater start up, not the recovery on the LP
Urgh. So the loop is gone (we kinda expected to happen - as it CAN get ridiculous) and fundamental FADC follow-up options are also impacted by the extra start-up?
Great.
this is some sad shit…i didn’t really give a fuck about the loop (well I’d rather have kept it, but hey…) but the fadc combos with fs.rh were my favourites…damn capcom “no characters are being nerfed and they’re gonna get better”. Fuck you
It’s a beta. It’s not final. Don’t get worked up about it.
i’m not believing shit until the final build is done. yeah it sucks to hear, but like mango said, shit is still beta.
Increasing the push back would make FADC combos pretty sketchy as well, cos I know they stretch the reach of the cr.MP or cr.LP after the linked far.HK as it is. They should just add recovery frames to the far.LP. Not like anyone ever uses it against anything and then you’d still be able to cancel it into LK Tatsu for combos.
they probably don’t want sagat to have a single “bad” matchup at capcom.
yeah i think lollo is right im sure capcom wants to keep sagat s tier