So I’m assuming the current frame data on all Burn Kicks is absolutely wrong, because via testing against Rog’s cr. jab all of them seem to be - or = on block, outside of meaty circumstances. Anyone know anything different?
I was actually gonna ask the same thing. SRK wiki give airburnkicks to be +4 for medium and +2 for heavy on block, which sounds ridiculous to me.
I don’t really know how to test things out to see the real numbers myself.
The frame (dis)advantage for burn kick depends on what active frame it is blocked on, height, opponent hitbox/hurtbox, whether it is blocked standing or crouching. With how bad Viper’s normals are, burn kick should be at least even on block.
Oh, and don’t test things against Boxer. His hurtbox is weird and doesn’t provide consistent results. Test against Ryu, he has the generic shoto hitbox/hurtbox and has a 3, 4, and 5 frame normal.
Ryu’s cr. jab is 3 frames? If true, what makes Rog’s so much more pragmatically better? Hitbox range?
Rog’s jab is just overall better. Hitbox, total frames, advantage, etc.
startup: 3f
active: 2f
recovery: 5f
total: 9f
+4 on block
+7 on hit
Ryu c.LP
startup: 3f
active: 2f
recovery: 7f
total: 11f
+2 on block
+5 on hit
The only thing that I can say for Ryu’s c.LP over Rog’s is that Ryu can combo into a hard knockdown from his c.LP.
Isn’t Rog able to do it as well ?
crLP crLP stLP crHK ?
Yes, from his standing jab, like you said. I was talking about crouching jabs between Ryu and Rog. If you want to test frame advantage of BKs, test against a shoto with a 3f normal, not against Rog. He has a weird hotbox/hurtbox that has different pushback and yields inconsistent results.
Oh okay, directly from crLP you meant. I didn’t catch that.
Ok so for anybody who watched SCR this weekend I really wonder what happened at the final moment of Jayce vs Wao (http://www.twitch.tv/leveluplive/b/507803423 forward to 4:12:42)… Jayce gets the ultra in the corner and goes for the unblockable on oni. Now the only way I know to block that unblockable as oni is blocking it with a perfectly timed qcb. But somehow Wao avoided it altogether and jabbed Jayce on landing… I tried to replicate this but I got counterhit by the roundhouse every time… Anyone care to explain what happened here? Did Jayce miss his timing or did Wao find another way to not only block, but entirely avoid and punish that unblockable setup??
Edit: Nvm figured it out myself, if you stay neutral the roundhouse whiffs and your free to pressure with jabs like Wao did. Guess the “unblockable” against oni after ultra is actually pretty bad because your just banking on a knowledge deficit of the oni player, otherwise your cornering yourself and let him start jab pressure on top of it for free… Next time a top level viper is up against Wao or Infiltration oni I wanna see dash, jump forward, air bk or possibly a tiny delay on the jump timing which would probably make it a regular jump in that has to be blocked…
There’s actually quite a few unblockable that just whiff if the opponent doesn’t try to block all together. It’s a weird solution to it but it makes sense, since unblockables are directly a result of the block animation.
So I can chain seismos in Marvel and when I first tried in SF4 on pad I could do it …very poorly. Now that I’m on stick, though I can chain seismos in Marvel again, but the same method (altered for the different game timing just like I did with pad) doesn’t work. I can’t chain seismos on stick using my marvel method of DP motion to UF in SF4.
Try Jayce’s method:
qcd (from forward) ~ uf+punch (6329+p)
I’ve been using SRK ~ uf (62369), AND the churn motion from the df of the SRK ~ roundabout uf (623214789+p), for years.
But when I saw Jayce’s tutorial and tried his method, I wanted to kick myself for not coming up with that method on my own. It’s much simpler and much cleaner.
Coincidentally, it also helped me to realize that my way of going from qcb to df after a Fierce feint, in preparation for an SRK motion (EX Seismo), was the very reason I kept getting EX Seismo during FFF attempts; That badly-timed df was messing me up on the fly, so my would-be punish would end up getting punished.
So the new net code for ultra is horrible. I feel like I can’t do anything, burnkicks, seismo chains, anything.
It’s so discouraging especially because there’s so many lag spikes too so you can’t use network simulation to train for it though I’d never stoop that low. Fuck, I hit everything in the training room too. So horrible… I don’t know what to say. Even my Day 3 poison does better online because I atleast am not limited execution wise due to terrible lag.
Im having a good time learning Viper. She is a very fun character. I played her online for the first time a few days ago and of course I got bodied but it was all a learning experience. I gotta stop playing scared with her and I know that will go away with time. Im in training mode everyday just going over her basics like FFF, seismo chains, meterless FADC, etc. Plus learning her safe jumps and setups too. The only thing that bugs me is like one day I can land her FFF combo into burnkick good and then the next day I just keep fucking up on my inputs. I’ll just keep at it and get it down. I gotta get use to doing it online too. Im also starting to get the hang of her sjc into ultra 1. I remember being scared of trying her out because of execution with her but Im glad I decided to give it another go. Taking a break from this game and coming back to learn Viper made this game fun for me again.
For both systems or just 1? Psn is more laggier now then ever. I seriously blame capcom. They need a better net code.
Im playing on 360 which is supposed to have “better net code”
Guess not really. its just horrible. Playing poison instead.
It feels like SJC’s are way more lenient now for her (coming back from an extreme hiatus). The window you have to SJC off a light or other normal seems to be slightly increased by a frame or two or three. Anyone else notice the typical FFF -> ex seismo -> air burn kick -> burst time, combo seem to hit randomly. That or i’ve been away too long.
Maybe you were playing high-level Guilty Gear during your absence, and/or various other anime games, and now realize just how slow SFIV was all along.
Anyone have any delayed wake up set ups post forward and back throws?
I recall someone posting forward throw, dash, Seismo Feint, sj.Fierce/RH. Was that a 4 frame safe jump or something?
nearly broke my stick because mp tk red focus whiffed 3 times on random crouching characters at far range (poison and cody, cant remember the other one).
fair warning. this character still sucks btw.