Anyone else use the typical kara dash cr.M to try and get a low hit from far away? Just curious. You would see wesker’s typically do this. I haven’t but I think I’m going to start using it.
You mean with Viper? I used to use 2B alot, but that move has some glaring weaknesses, it’s hitbox isn’t huge (it is long), and I’m pretty sure the hurtbox extends long before the move goes active, I’ve been hit/grabbed out of it too often. Then again, I’ve learned to never do too much without siesmo cover.
Yeah. Its very deceiving for how long it is and I could see it being effective but there definitely seems to be better ways to get in. Oh yeah and I’ve been abusing 2nd level Focus attack recently :]. Its stupid good. Destroyed Team best buddies with it a lot recently. When you know a naked berserker slash is coming start it and by the time it gets there you will have level 2. If they go behind you simply EX.TK
Standard anti wolverine is to hit focus, and then cancel to EX Seismo in whatever direction he winds up. Even if he Berserker charges, you might still punish (it has 3 frames recovery), but you will get pressure.
Wolverine still does okay against viper, but Berserker slash doesn’t really work like normal. This is also why Viper is maybe Dante’s only bad matchup.
I’ll have to play with lvl2’s again I guess, usually I FADC the lvl2 and get a mixup under the threat of the lvl3 or with JamSession/Unibeam.
I have a love/hate relationship with 2B from Viper as if it whiffs you need to react really quickly to fix it against characters like Magneto who will blow you up for using it.
So… I’ve been playing with Viper/Jill again, and I’m thinking it’s better than I originally gave it credit for. I came up with this fairly flashy combo:
Also, I just noticed that Jill’s arrow kick causes a walbounce AND a hard knockdown. I am messing with this right now.
Edit: The best combo I found in the corner is:
jC>5B>5C>L Seismo>ADDF>jS>-/>5B>5C>L Seismo>TH C BK>-/>jC>jC>jS>-/>Call ArrowKick>L Seismo>ADDB>-/>S>jC>jC>jS>-/>Call JamSession>L Seismo> Ender of Choice
Alright, Viper/Jill is actually really, really good. Jill has the most amazing projectile assist ever for Viper. Huge wall bounce and hard knockdown. It lets you confirm into a full combo from absolutely anything. Fuzzy guard setups, crossup BK, and BK feint+assist mixups are insane.
My favorite current mixup like this is:
H BK (feint)> Call Arrow Kick> ~
~jH BK Crossup
~jL BK fake Crossup
you get an amazing confirm of Jill assist.
Also because of the hard knockdown, trades are all massively in your favor, and the arrow kick actually inflicts alot of guard stun. Her flash kick assist could also be useful in some matchups. Lastly, DHC into kick super does good damage, but a perfect DHC into Machin Gun Spray is huge damage.
The big problem I used to have with this team was that it didn’t have a way to get jill in. My revelation game when I realized I could just use Viper to get jill inside via DHC’s. When Jill is in, she’s already on top [that’s what she said], and Jill’s mixup is even better then Vipers [scary].
Lastly, I’ve been doing heavy lab work with Jill, and I’ve boosted her damage quite a bit from what people used to consider standard.
Which combo you use depends on preference and character order, and you always have the DHC glitch into Dante if you can’t confirm the full thing.
I know I’m being excited at the moment, but the team seems quite good. I’ve only just stared playing with Dante+Jill Setups. If anyone wants to know anything else let me know.
Thats a really cool find. Jill is an awesome character as well. Thanks for the new find. Its making me considering giving her another try. She can replace amaterasu and trish on my viper/sentinel teams.
They both seem to be really strong on point as well. Also Jill with Sentinel is already really good and Im starting to really like Viper with Sentinel.
Yeah, the big reason Jill Sent is so good, is that you can call Sentinel and do Machine Gun spray. It practically forces the opponent to block a mixup. Viper Sentinel is decent as well. Learn the timing for the S+Drones>jBBCS so that you bat them into the drones for a combo extension.
I was actually in the lab with Jill Sentinel, but I couldn’t come up with anything too special in terms of combos.
hmm I cant think of much except for resets. Also have you tried Viper/Jill/Akuma. For some reason I feel that would be a really strong offensive team
I just ran some basic tests with both Akuma and Sentinel. Here are the quick results:
Akuma:
Akuma assist is good, but both Viper and Jill have a hard time really getting anything special off it besides the usual. Takes away DHC glitch and Vipers Delicious Jam Session combo ender. Doesn’t help bad matchups.
Sentinel:
This assist helps Jill alot, but it hurts Viper alot (compared to Dante), especially in the shitty matchups. Lets you DHC glitch and you can do THC combo enders with Jill due to how long HSF lasts (Similar to my 1 million no DHC combo with Jill/Dante THC).
hmm alrite what about dr. doom. You get the hidden missile relaunch or the molecular shield bullshit. I was wondering what he could do for jill. Also with plasma beam you can do left right mixups
Doom, would replace Viper as the OTG character (missiles). Or you could have him use doom Rocks. But yeah, I think Doom is a very solid choice for Viper/Jill.
Actually, I’ve got some doom ideas. So Ill report back when i get some testing in.
Still got more work to do on this one but Viper(BK)/Jill(AK)/Doom(HM) is looking pretty pro. I’ll have more stuff later.
Doom rocks does have one unique use with Jill (outside of being a generally good assist). You can do the same thing with Doom rocks that I do with Jam Session, where I call Jam Session, do Machine Gun Spray, and then pick them up with the Kick Super for good damage. It’s really hard though (way harder than Jam Session).
thats pretty cool. Now I gotta wait until Ultimate comes out so I got Jill for the 360. Looks like Viper/Jill/Doom might be a really good team. Definetly a really good find. Now all I have to do is pick up how to do the damn buktooth loop and i will replace sentinel with doom lol.
Yeah, I’d take Hidden Missiles over Sentinel any day. Sentinel (as a character and as an assist) is very overrated, and Doom’s assist has more flexibility and helps with Viper’s bad matchups.
Like I said, I’m still working on some stuff. I’ll have more when I’m done. I might make some more videos depending on how unique it actually is. I’m also still figuring out what Assist is best for Viper on this squad. I’m leaning toward BK as Foot Dive + Burn Kick Mixup is dirty.
I would have to agree with you that burn kick would probably be the best assist as it gives unblockables to Jill and you wouldn’t really need an otg since Hidden Missiles already cover that area. Also is it safe to approach behind arrow kick. I like Sentinel due to the fact that I can actually do the flight combos. I cant do the loops with doom but I guess I can fix that with training mode.
Also Viper/Doom is a really deadly team. Its very good for zoning if you got ur seismo chains down and really good for letting Viper approach and continue her combos.
I wouldn’t approach behind arrow kick from full screen. But if your midrange, arrow kick is really good as it’s fast, and causes alot of guard stun. But you do have to protect it a bit more than something like Haggar or Magneto. But that’s not really a big issue.
I could talk at length about why I think Sentinel is middle mid tier, but he does have a distinct roll in alot of teams that isn’t easily replaced.
Sentinels drones assist is really good as it opens up opportunities for alota characters. I played a Spiderman/Skrull/Sentinel team and drones is very good for that team. It really covers spider-man well. Btw I was just messing around in training mode and I think ironman with unibeam might be good for your viper/jill team. You get the left right mixups as well as a beam to hold them down. I was also thinking of trying repulsor blast. Maybe you can use repulsor blast with jills machine gun spray like you do with dantes jam session as well
On IM (IM is one of my main characters), so he was one of the first characters I tried. you can indeed use repulsor a little like Jam Session, the big problem is it doesn’t go high enough to solve the matchup problem. I’d take Repulsor over unibeam on this team as Viper get’s more from repulsor and fast beams (Unibeam, Disruptor, Plasma Beam) don’t work as well with jill as they do with say Wesker, because of the nature of her moves. However, Relusor doesn’t do much for Jill’s Neutral, Hidden Missiles is actually really good for her neutral.
The Drones are a very good assist, except that you need a team to support them. I don’t mean that you need to take advantage of the drones, but instead you need to be able to call Drones safely as Drones is the easiest assist to punish in the whole game. This dictates limits your team choices and in turn, your options. Also, as we all know, Sentinel on point is ass pancakes.