Smash Bros Ultimate Thread- The game is finally hear to steal the hearts of all Smashers

Classic Fighting Games Super Smash Brothers WiiU/3DS
335

Goddamn, what a great Direct…

Simon was my #1 request, so obviously, I’m psyched as hell. While I wanted Simon in the game the most because of how iconic he is to the series of CV(and because Captain N), I actually like Richter better as a character, so he’s the one I’m probably going to end up using.

I couldn’t…BELIEVE how much stuff they gave CV. An echo fighter, an assist trophy, a boss, a stage, THIRTY-FOUR music tracks! I honestly feel bad for the other 3P characters by comparison.

FS Meter and Squad Strike are two features I really wanted to see, and I really hope they end up being adopted by tournaments. Squad Strike is one way to make sure no more Bayo vs. Bayo finals. :stuck_out_tongue:

I never really cared about King K. Rool, but he was, like, the most requested character, so I’m glad he’s in if for no other reason than I don’t have to hear people asking for him anymore.

Pretty much the only thing I wanted for the game that I haven’t got yet is for “bosses” to appear in Classic mode and for there to be a Boss Rush mode. But they’re definitely in the game and obviously going to be in the game’s Story mode.

Ganon
Mother Brain
Andross (N64 version)
Metal Gear Rex
Wily Machine

It’s not literally everything. And asking for more is not complaining.

336

(Jim Sterling Voice)

However, all this talk of Castlevania material in Smash overlooks just one thing. Sakurai has put in the single best representative for Konami that he possibly could.

Dracula.

After all, Dracula, much like Konami, only exists to suck the blood out of innocent people.

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338

Ah, I guess whatever post you were responding to got deleted then.

340

I mean, I definitely do wish Waluigi was playable, but I’m not complaining about it.
I’ve deleted the original post since apparently po deleted his as well.

(Not in order)

  1. Necrozma
  2. Fawful
  3. Kracko
  4. Dr Wily
  5. Dr Robotnik

I also think it would be great to get Mother Brain, Eggplant Wizard, and King Hippo as references to Captain N.

341

Mother Brain would have to have a special intro (as a boss) versus Olimar and/or Falcon. In her Captain N voice.

“Welll sheeeyit, if it ain’t the Cap’n 'imself!”

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342

So, with the huge stage list available in Ultimate… several of us have been considering revising the stage select rules for tournament. Based on discussion in the Discord, we would like to propose the following (this ruleset presumes Stage Morph isn’t being used, though we can easily modify it to account for Stage Morph if it proves tourney-viable):

One Time Preparation: Design a legal stage list.

Additional One-Time Prep: Design a ‘random select subset thereof’ list, for use in “player took too long, forcing random select” situations.

At the tournament…

Step 1: Rock-Paper-Scissors (best 1 out of 1) between the two players.

Step 2: Winner picks any legal stage.

Step 3: Loser selects stage for next match. Winner stays on their current character. Loser may change characters.

Step 3a: May not return to a previously played stage in this set unless both players agree.

Step 4: Repeat Step 3 until set is completed.

Special: A 2 minute (120 second) time limit to select your stage is provided, but players should not repeatedly hit this limit. If a player takes longer than this, a judge should be called to force the player to immediately select. If they do not do so, then the Random Stage List from ‘Additional One Time Prep’ list is used.

If a player’s delays repeatedly causes this situation (more than 3 times in a single event/tournament), the judge may issue a Match Forfeit. If it happens again, they may issue a Game Forfeit. If it happens a third time, they may issue a Tournament Forfeit. The judge must personally witness at least one of these violations before Forfeits may be issued.

(This is a defense against people ganging up to falsely report a player they don’t like)

Thoughts?

343

Another rule we’re floating that might become standard based on the new stuff incoming (Obviously will need to be tested): Instead of Stage StrikingFirst stage is a Stage Morph, with two stages chosen between the contenders

Also, we’ve been debating how similar stages (Like Battlefield and Hazardless Midgar) applies to DSR and the Initial Random Rule.

344

I dunno what any of that means. I just know as a viewer, I want to see FS Meter and Squad Strike.

345

I’ll explain real quick, then. Back when Smash had a lot fewer legal stages in tournaments, some rules were invented to try to keep things fair.

“Stage Striking” is the practice where players take turns banning stages, and the stage left is the one that gets played on for that current game. It’s very time consuming.

‘DSR’ is “Dave’s Stupid Rule”, which in its various forms says a stage used in a set may not be picked again in that set unless both players agree. This prevents a set being FD, BF, FD, BF, FD.

Initial Random is the idea that the first stage in a set is automatically Random, from a set of stages fed into the Random Stage button (usu. ones the tournament scene feels are neutral-ish).

What the set above tries to do is eliminate stage striking (which should save time), eliminate ‘seasons’ of map lists (which reduces logistical requirements, we need only communicate the Forced Random If A Judge Is Called map list one time to all tournaments), and keep things varied by maintaining ‘DSR’ in some form.

Basically, it should help viewers and TOs. Viewers have less dead time between games in a set because there’s no stage striking. They get improved map variety via maintaining DSR. TOs get people out of the venue sooner so they can clean things up sooner and be out of the building sooner (which reduces their costs, some veunes charge by the hour). Players don’t really lose much in this arrangement, if anything.

Stage Morphing is something I hope proves to be competition-worthy and I would love to integrate it into a stage selection rule set if so.

FS Meter will require playtesting. If it proves genuinely disruptive, then ban it. If it proves to be okay, let it rock.

Squad Strike, if it works KOF style, should hopefully become a tournament standard. It will really, really cut down on embarrassing shit like a single dominant character driving people out of the venue in disgust.

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347

It offers some pretty big advantages over single-character. Chief among them is that even if one character becomes dominant… you will, by default, see at least two more. It’ll keep things more interesting.

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348

I think it’s great as an option, but I don’t think I’d ever want it to become the tournament standard.

I mean, I personally would have no problem with it, seeing as I’m already going to be maining 4 characters (at least). But something about forcing people to play multiple characters if they don’t want to leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

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350

It’s also a player advantage, encouraging them to dig into more of the game. Also, “screw the spectators” when they’re the reasons sponsors fund increasingly well equipped venues is rather… myopic, I feel.

351

Smash is never a multi character fighter and that isn’t a main mode of the game. Soul Calibur had the mode before and that was never the tournament standard. This isn’t like marvel where the main game is 3v3. Forcing it to be the main is a silly maneuver. It’s totally fine as a side event tho.

352

Most people agree that having multiple character can split focus for improvement. There’s a reason why people have a ‘main’ and ‘pocket characters’, it’s that one is formidable, and the other(s) are for matchup’s sake. People get more consistent results when they only have one main. Forcing them to have three when having one is an option, they’ll choose to have one.

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353

I think 3v3 is more hype to watch and can also solve some terrible matchup problems. Not to mention, Bayo will have less screen time (that’s a joke). Forcing people to learn more than 1 character isn’t a big deal, since this game isn’t very complex nor have high execution barrier. If KOF players can deal with having to learn at least 3 chars I can’t see why smash players can’t.

But, in the end of the day it’s a community choice, they will decide what to do. I just hope that 3v3 becomes a thing because that could bring me some interest in watching this game again.

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355

kof is a 3v3 fighting game. Smash is not. You have to main 3 characters in KoF because that’s the game it is. You do not have to do so in smash because smash is a 1 character fighter.

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356

Smash is basically whatever we want it to be. We have the option.

We can even play Eight Player Smash, with up to four players!

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357

The whole discussion really comes down to “options”. Smash is already the most customizable game out there, and Ultimate is just giving us that many more possibilities to work with. I think it’s awesome that there’s an option for a 3v3 mode. And 5v5! AND SMASHDOWN! There’s now doubt that these will be really great for side tournaments and casual play. However, trying to force any of these as the standard feels wrong. Let’s test it out, sure, and if the scene evolves that way, then fine, but I definitely don’t think it should be decided on ahead of time. In the end the tournament standard is going to be pared down to the most balanced set of options it can agree on.

Also, @Akhos, saying that tournaments shouldn’t “cater to the spectators” is very narrow-minded, especially for larger events. I absolutely agree with you that a tournament should be about the competitors first, and the rules should reflect this.
But for any tournament that has significant sponsor partnerships, getting those views is important to keep the money flowing, and being interesting to watch is important to keep those views coming.
Obviously it shouldn’t be the most important factor, but you can’t just ignore it either.

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359

I’d like to point out that since Po hopped back into the Discord on the 9th, LW has done more vitriolic complaining than him.

What bizzaro world are we living in?

361

Smash is a game with items, crazy stages and many different ways to play. The community set for 1v1, 3 stocks, with some (most) stages banned because they think it’s better this way. There’s nothing set on stone for this game. People can choose to continue with 1v1 as a standard and I understand, but there’s no other reason for this other than “the community prefers this way”.

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